The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[amogles]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Diane Abbot would be my preferred candidate, give a woman a chance, Labour have never had a woman when the Conservatives have had 2. Learn from your opponents.

... and ensure labour remains unelectable for another election cycle or two?

In earnest, despite the entertainment of seeing Labour repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, democracy requires a competent opposition and needs to be able to challenge the government on an eye to eye level.

If you can't have that, democracy becomes a farce.

I therefore wish that somebody competent steps into Corbyn's shoes.

[Tom1234]

	Quote:	amogles
	I therefore wish that somebody competent steps into Corbyn's shoes.

No one can step into his shoes while he's still wearing them.

	Quote:	Tom1234
	No one can step into his shoes while he's still wearing them.

I dunno, those clown shoes are pretty big!

[bigblue2]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Diane Abbot would be my preferred candidate, give a woman a chance, Labour have never had a woman when the Conservatives have had 2. Learn from your opponents.

I really hope that was a joke

	Quote:	amogles
	... and ensure labour remains unelectable for another election cycle or two? In earnest, despite the entertainment of seeing Labour repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, democracy requires a competent opposition and needs to be able to challenge the government on an eye to eye level. If you can't have that, democracy becomes a farce. I therefore wish that somebody competent steps into Corbyn's shoes.

Maybe the UK has to go through this comedy-politics phase we seem to be in (and let's face it, if we are honest, Johnson is just as bloody idiotic as Corbyn - he's just got a better PR machine papering over the cracks).

After the 10 years of crippling austerity followed by the Brexit mess, had there been a semi-competent Labour leader on offer, the UK electorate would have jumped at the chance to change things, but here we are.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	bigblue2
	I really hope that was a joke

Why should this be a joke? It’s been talked about for a long time that the next Labour leader should be a woman. Stephen Kinnock has today said so too.

[bigblue2]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Why should this be a joke? It’s been talked about for a long time that the next Labour leader should be a woman. Stephen Kinnock has today said so too.

the Diane Abbot bit

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	amogles
	... and ensure labour remains unelectable for another election cycle or two? In earnest, despite the entertainment of seeing Labour repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, democracy requires a competent opposition and needs to be able to challenge the government on an eye to eye level. If you can't have that, democracy becomes a farce. I therefore wish that somebody competent steps into Corbyn's shoes.

It’s not going to happen though unless the membership changes! Also, it’s not as if there’s a long list of candidates who are able to step up to the task. Of the current runners and riders I don’t see anyone there to bother Boris Johnson which is a shame. The biggest threat Boris Johnson faces is himself!

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s not going to happen though unless the membership changes! Also, it’s not as if there’s a long list of candidates who are able to step up to the task. Of the current runners and riders I don’t see anyone there to bother Boris Johnson which is a shame. The biggest threat Boris Johnson faces is himself!

Oh Jess Phillips or Yvette Cooper would bother him quite a bit, I reckon.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	bigblue2
	the Diane Abbot bit

Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

Really? Do you know who Diane Abbott is? She's not in the same stratosphere as Phillips or Cooper.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	"Churchill also said he was "strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes"," Prime example of whataboutery. Napoleon III's reconstruction of Paris was very successful and stands today.

There is no doubt that Churchill was a great and courageous leader, and that we owe him a huge debt of gratitude. One daren't even think what the world might be like today had he been less resolute.

He was also a great historian, writer, and orator, and the originator of many great one-liners.

One the other hand, he wasn't an angel by any stretch. He had very negative and dark sides to his character and said and also did many things that are difficult if not impossible to justify.

A "what would Churchill have done?" type of approach is not necessarily the most meaningful in today's context.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:
	Oh Jess Phillips or Yvette Cooper would bother him quite a bit, I reckon.

Yvette Cooper nearly lost her seat thanks to her Brexit actions during the rotten Parliament. Jess Phillips is good on pointing out problems, not so good on solutions. Neither has much of a chance anyhow as it all comes back to the membership, and they will likely choose someone in the mould of Corbyn.

The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

[bigblue2]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

?? she's an imbecile, every interview she gives is a train wreck, she can't even put matching shoes on ffs

[amogles]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

They did. That's how the Dem bit got into the Libdems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social...tic_Party_(UK))

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Yvette Cooper nearly lost her seat thanks to her Brexit actions during the rotten Parliament. Jess Phillips is good on pointing out problems, not so good on solutions. Neither has much of a chance anyhow as it all comes back to the membership, and they will likely choose someone in the mould of Corbyn. The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

You're very big on backbone, I notice. And exclamatory phrases.

And

	Quote:
	You're very big on backbone, I notice. And exclamatory phrases. And

It's very easy language to add pizzazz to one's point of view without actually having to quantify anything or bring anything resembling fact.

[amogles]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s not going to happen though unless the membership changes! Also, it’s not as if there’s a long list of candidates who are able to step up to the task. Of the current runners and riders I don’t see anyone there to bother Boris Johnson which is a shame. The biggest threat Boris Johnson faces is himself!

It's still early days and many leaders rise to the opportunity and don't really start to stand out until they are actually at the top. So let's wait and see.

I agree that Boris has a tendency of being his own worst enemy, so I hope the good Boris wins and suppresses the more crazy stuff.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

As they found out in the 80s, in the idiotic UK electoral system to split is suicide.

	Quote:
	As they found out in the 80s, in the idiotic UK electoral system to split is suicide.

Sometimes the electoral system saves the UK from other nightmares, too horrible to contemplate...

	Quote:
	In the 2015 general election, UKIP secured over 3.8 million votes (12.6% of the total), replacing the Liberal Democrats as the third most popular party, but only secured one seat, with Carswell retaining his seat and Reckless losing his.