The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[John William]

On another subject what about the appointment of Ex Australian Prime Minister, Tony Abbott as UK
Trade Envoy ? who's famous boast when signing a trade deal with China was, 'I'm not sidetracked by
peripheral issues such as labour and environmental standards”

No doubt hand picked by Dominic Cummings by the looks of it.

Bang goes food standards, the environment and workers rights in the UK !!


The Guardian - Fresh controversy over Tony Abbots's Brexit trade role

[John William]

Just confirming what many of us have long suspected, that whenever anyone
rings Jacob Rees-Mogg on his mobile, Rule Britannia is played !!

Video of Jacob Rees-Moggs playing his favourite tune at work

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	John William
	Just confirming what many of us have long suspected, that whenever anyone rings Jacob Rees-Mogg on his mobile, Rule Britannia is played !! Video of Jacob Rees-Moggs playing his favourite tune at work

In an ever changing world, it's reassuring to see that we've moved not an inch from when George Orwell wrote the following:

	Quote:
	"In intention, at any rate, the English intelligentsia are Europeanized. They take their cookery from Paris and their opinions from Moscow. In the general patriotism of the country they form a sort of island of dissident thought. England is perhaps the only great country whose intellectuals are ashamed of their own nationality. In left-wing circles it is always felt that there is something slightly disgraceful in being an Englishman and that it is a duty to snigger at every English institution, from horse racing to suet puddings. It is a strange fact, but it is unquestionably true that almost any English intellectual would feel more ashamed of standing to attention during ‘God save the King’ than of stealing from a poor box."

[marton]

The government has admitted that its plan to reinterpret the special Brexit arrangements for Northern Ireland will break international law.

The Northern Ireland secretary, Brandon Lewis, astonished backbenchers when he told the House of Commons: “Yes, this does break international law.

It reportedly led to the resignation of the UK’s top legal civil servant, Jonathan Jones, on Tuesday morning.

If the change to the special Brexit arrangements for Northern Ireland damages the Good Friday agreement then Boris can say goodbye to a US trade deal.

[fatmanfilms]

Interesting article in the Telegraph https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...27mY0j-i9ONz_A

[John William]

All this and the Covid restrictions too.

[Ato]

	Quote:	John William
	All this and the Covid restrictions too. Attachment 140203

Terribly proportioned Union Jack/Flag. Looks like the way I used to draw it as a child in one of the colonies.

[John William]

[Mikers]

	Quote:	marton
	The government has admitted that its plan to reinterpret the special Brexit arrangements for Northern Ireland will break international law. The Northern Ireland secretary, Brandon Lewis, astonished backbenchers when he told the House of Commons: “Yes, this does break international law. It reportedly led to the resignation of the UK’s top legal civil servant, Jonathan Jones, on Tuesday morning. If the change to the special Brexit arrangements for Northern Ireland damages the Good Friday agreement then Boris can say goodbye to a US trade deal.

What is the international law its breaking ? its a real question. all the news has said is that "it will break international law" but i dont know what law it is. Is it something to do with the GFA ?

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	Mikers
	What is the international law its breaking ? its a real question. all the news has said is that "it will break international law" but i dont know what law it is. Is it something to do with the GFA ?

The International Law it would be breaking is the Withdrawal Agreement signed at the beginning of the year.

It's concerning as it's something the UK doesn't do. Listening to the temerity of French boring on about it who have quite happily broken International Law in the past is quite something though!

I'll await the details before casting judgment, it's important to remember that these are unprecedented times.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The International Law it would be breaking is the Withdrawal Agreement signed at the beginning of the year. It's concerning as it's something the UK doesn't do. Listening to the temerity of French boring on about it who have quite happily broken International Law in the past is quite something though! I'll await the details before casting judgment, it's important to remember that these are unprecedented times.

Perhaps Boris believes laws are there to be interpreted by courts, Hence why many people living in countries with Napoleonic law don't understand.

[HickvonFrick]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Perhaps Boris believes laws are there to be interpreted by courts, Hence why many people living in countries with Napoleonic law don't understand.

He's certainly got some form in acting in a way such that the courts have some interpreting to do.

[marton]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The International Law it would be breaking is the Withdrawal Agreement signed at the beginning of the year. It's concerning as it's something the UK doesn't do. Listening to the temerity of French boring on about it who have quite happily broken International Law in the past is quite something though! I'll await the details before casting judgment, it's important to remember that these are unprecedented times.

Strange behaviour by the UK Government proving they cannot be trusted to comply with a recent agreement at a time when they want to create new free trade deals.

[John William]

	Quote:	marton
	Strange behaviour by the UK Government proving they cannot be trusted to comply with a recent agreement at a time when they want to create new free trade deals.

Boris and the Conservative government already 'have form' when it comes to breaking the law when it suits them.

The Guardian - Johnsons suspension of Parliament was unlawful, Supreme Court rules

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	John William
	Boris and the Conservative government already 'have form' when it comes to breaking the law when it suits them. The Guardian - Johnsons suspension of Parliament was unlawful, Supreme Court rules

Remember the sheer outrage when that happened? And what was the result? Boris Johnson won by a landslide a few months later!

The moral of the story is clear, just because something is law, it doesn't make it "right". The last Parliament behaved appallingly, and it took an election to make them realise this, and on that occasion breaking the law was necessary and acceptable in the eyes of the people.

If, as the Government claim, the Withdrawal Agreement risks the integrity of the UK internal market and sovereignty of the UK, then they may be "right" in breaking international law.

[henk]

Ministers will be given powers to “disapply” elements of the Northern Ireland Brexit arrangements in the internal market bill, in a move that legal experts say is an “eye-watering” breach of international law.

The bill, published on Wednesday, seeks to give powers to ministers to unilaterally decide how to apply the Northern Ireland protocol in relation to checks on goods going from Northern Ireland to Great Britain.

It also unpicks article 10 of the protocol in relation to state aid and states that it will “not be interpreted in accordance with case law of the European court” or “in accordance with any legislative act of the EU”.

This is a contradiction of the section of the protocol that is underpinned by the “direct effect” of EU law, which would enable any individual or company to rely on EU law in a local court, and which was signed off by Boris Johnson in January.

Legal academics pointed to paragraphs 42, 43, and 45 of the internal market bill as a blunt rewriting of the protocol.

Brandon Lewis breaks cardinal law for MPs and tells the half-truth | John Crace
“This is a remarkable piece of legislation and it expressly contravenes our international legal obligations to a point that the legislation itself says this is the intention, as did Brandon Lewis [the Northern Ireland secretary] yesterday,” said Catherine Barnard, a professor of European law at Cambridge University, who added the bill was “really eye-watering” in its explicitness.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Remember the sheer outrage when that happened? And what was the result? Boris Johnson won by a landslide a few months later! The moral of the story is clear, just because something is law, it doesn't make it "right". The last Parliament behaved appallingly, and it took an election to make them realise this, and on that occasion breaking the law was necessary and acceptable in the eyes of the people. If, as the Government claim, the Withdrawal Agreement risks the integrity of the UK internal market and sovereignty of the UK, then they may be "right" in breaking international law.

Are we back to the Libertarian, Liberal or Conservative debate again? So now you're a libertarian -- laws should be obeyed only when it suits you? I can just imagine a slew of cases being thrown out of court: "I was indeed driving at 160 mph, Your Honour, but that's because I wanted to and I found the speed limit not to my linking. I refer you to the precedent set by HM Government..."

[NotAllThere]

There's a difference between committing a criminal offence and doing something that it isn't legal. Governments do stuff that isn't legal quite often. Then it's challenged in the courts, they're told "no, you can't do that", and they have to reverse the decision.

But Boris is a prat.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:
	Are we back to the Libertarian, Liberal or Conservative debate again? So now your a libertarian -- laws should be obeyed only when it suits you? I can just imagine a slew of cases being thrown out of court: "I was indeed driving at 160 mph, Your Honour, but that's because I wanted to and I found the speed limit not to my linking. I refer you to the precedent set by HM Government..."

It was illegal to be homosexual pre-1967, or get an abortion pre-1968. The law tends to be in black and white yet the world we live in is shades of grey. I believe in the Rule of Law, however I also see it's not perfect. Just because something is in law, it doesn't make it right. Sometimes it is necessary to break the law.

[MusicChick]

	Quote:	NotAllThere
	There's a difference between committing a criminal offence and doing something that it isn't legal. Governments do stuff that isn't legal quite often. Then it's challenged in the courts, they're told "no, you can't do that", and they have to reverse the decision. But Boris is a prat.

But you gotta give it to him, an efficient prat.