The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Flying Kite]

… Brexit is good for big businesses only if EU break apart, not good in any circumstances to average British person …who need that Europe break apart? see this statement: Donald Trump’s brutal assessment of Italy’s EU membership: ‘Get rid of Brussels burden!’...then poor British have to understand who poisoned all those years tabloids as SUN, Daily Mail, Daily Express and other yellow press with distorted views...Cambridge Analytica name have to ring a bell to those that voted Brexit, actually that media influence company voted not the British people...

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	henk
	Hilarious, these "little englanders" https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...droidApp_Other

It’s a consequence of not signing a trade deal. It is perfectly normal for a nation to defend its territorial waters. Why is it that the same logic/outcry is never applied when the EU threatens to block roads or stop planes from landing?

[JackieH]

Just spat my tea- or the irony, about fish...

From the Times

''Brexiteers have long hailed the “sea of opportunity” that awaits British fishermen and women after the UK leaves the EU — but now it has emerged that their boats will be monitored by a French company.

The business that won the tender to track UK fishing vessels wherever they operate, as well as foreign-licensed boats in British waters, is Collecte Localisation Satellites (CLS),
a French maritime surveillance provider.

The contract was awarded by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) in late summer having previously been held by a British firm,

[JackieH]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s a consequence of not signing a trade deal. It is perfectly normal for a nation to defend its territorial waters. Why is it that the same logic/outcry is never applied when the EU threatens to block roads or stop planes from landing?

if they do so on their own territory, it is their right. Sovrinty- you know. It is not their fault Raab, Johnson and ERG didn't realise the UK is an (some) Island/s.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s a consequence of not signing a trade deal. It is perfectly normal for a nation to defend its territorial waters. Why is it that the same logic/outcry is never applied when the EU threatens to block roads or stop planes from landing?

But it is not about applying the rule of law at the end of a negotiation period, it's just another hilarious BREXITEER strategy....

Having failed to split the EU leaders with his recent attempt to to phone them... the new idea seems to be to unite them and make their resolve even stronger....

So far we've had 39B now hitting 85B, no border in the Irish Sea being implemented, not EU office in NI being implemented.....

It's just not possible to take this stuff seriously any more.

[bowlie]

I wonder how long we have wait for the Zodiacs to start returning to France.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	But it is not about applying the rule of law at the end of a negotiation period, it's just another hilarious BREXITEER strategy.... Having failed to split the EU leaders with his recent attempt to to phone them... the new idea seems to be to unite them and make their resolve even stronger.... So far we've had 39B now hitting 85B, no border in the Irish Sea being implemented, not EU office in NI being implemented..... It's just not possible to take this stuff seriously any more.

It’s not a strategy, it’s simple matter of fact that a nation must defend her territory. As was already stated, it was perfectly reasonable for Boris Johnson to attempt to reach out to the leaders of member states, the same strategy worked a year ago when getting the withdrawal agreement over the line.

Thr EU commission’s negotiating strategy has never come under any serious scrutiny. As an Irishman you should be concerned that your country is in serious risk of being sold out in part due to French fisherman.

[marton]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s not a strategy, it’s simple matter of fact that a nation must defend her territory. As was already stated, it was perfectly reasonable for Boris Johnson to attempt to reach out to the leaders of member states, the same strategy worked a year ago when getting the withdrawal agreement over the line. Thr EU commission’s negotiating strategy has never come under any serious scrutiny. As an Irishman you should be concerned that your country is in serious risk of being sold out in part due to French fisherman.

Northern Ireland fishermen now face the very real prospect that, if there is no Brexit deal, they will be banned from entering Irish and European waters.

This means that local boats will no longer be allowed to fish in large parts of the Foyle and Carlingford loughs lucrative fishing grounds.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s not a strategy, it’s simple matter of fact that a nation must defend her territory. As was already stated, it was perfectly reasonable for Boris Johnson to attempt to reach out to the leaders of member states, the same strategy worked a year ago when getting the withdrawal agreement over the line. .

It just demonstrates how in experienced the entire team are. They keep boxing themselves in to a corner and don’t seem to learn from their mistakes. They keep drawing red lines that they are forced to ignore and have now talked themselves in to a situation where it’s either a big clime down, a poor deal or no deal.

They have gone from great deals to talking about survival for heaven’s sake.

Just a big joke now.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The EU commission’s negotiating strategy has never come under any serious scrutiny. As an Irishman you should be concerned that your country is in serious risk of being sold out in part due to French fisherman.

You just don’t get it. We do about the same trade with Belgium as the UK, the new RoRos, the French port upgrades and the national grid hook up to France, makes us more independent than before.

There is every chance we’ll get a united Ireland much earlier than expected... note there is a new phrase in the DUP vocabulary - all island solutions.

We’ll take a hit, but have reduced national debt from 124% to 58%, being a net exporter for over thirty years and having lots of allies, we’re in good shape to take a it.

Why is it that BREXITEERS always think that they are the only ones will to but principles ahead of economics? another big mistake.

So, no deal with the EU, no deal with the US, Canada/Japan deals depend on EU deal, no support to adjust WTO trade schedules and bonus - an additional 27 objectors....

Like I said just a joke now.

[JackieH]

Not very sure how to share, but I have just seen a map where all the UK fishing trawlers were fishing yesterday...

the vast majority were all around Iceland, Norway, Danemark, all along the north Spanis coast and down the whole of Portugal's coast.

So I imagine protecting waters will go both ways?

(on Jason Hunter's site).

[Castro]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Just a big joke now.

What's cringeworthy is Johnson's pantomime performance of a tough negotiator. His grasp of facts and details is lamentable and now with talk of ordering the navy to defend our waters, he sounds more like the leader of the BNP. Thatcher would be rolling in her grave.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	JackieH
	So I imagine protecting waters will go both ways?

The reality is that with four war ships you can’t defend anything. The entire strategy depends on the boys leaving the transponders turned on. And come the end of the year they’ll go dark and on top of that the Royal Navy will no longer have access to the EU fisheries traffic... it will just be hit and miss. The sea is a very big place.

I’ve been on the bridge and seen it happen in a past life.

[John William]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	The reality is that with four war ships you can’t defend anything. The entire strategy depends on the boys leaving the transponders turned on. And come the end of the year they’ll go dark and on top of that the Royal Navy will no longer have access to the EU fisheries traffic... it will just be hit and miss. The sea is a very big place. I’ve been on the bridge and seen it happen in a past life.

This could be a great opportunity for Putin to deploy a couple of his stealthiest hunter killer submarines
down one of those remote British and Irish inlets on the West coast of Scotland or even beter down the
West coast of Ireland. As I believe the British MOD have promised to safeguard the territorial waters
of the Republic of Ireland, as if it's their own against such sub incursions; just like the RAF QRA
fighters would do the same against Russian strategic bombers approaching Irish airspace.

Such incursions are not unknown and of course would be a huge embarrasment to the UK as it changes it's
relationship with member states of the EU in January 2021.

Here's the last hunt for Reds in October down the Swedish archipelago waters back in October 2014.

BBC News - Sweden steps up mystery sub hunt off Stockholm waters

[bowlie]

	Quote:	John William
	This could be a great opportunity for Putin to deploy a couple of his stealthiest hunter killer submarines down one of those remote British and Irish inlets on the West coast of Scotland or even beter down the West coast of Ireland. As I believe the British MOD have promised to safeguard the territorial waters of the Republic of Ireland, as if it's their own against such sub incursions; just like the RAF QRA fighters would do the same against Russian strategic bombers approaching Irish airspace. Such incursions are not unknown and of course would be a huge embarrasment to the UK as it changes it's relationship with member states of the EU in January 2021. Here's the last hunt for Reds in October down the Swedish archipelago waters back in October 2014. BBC News - Sweden steps up mystery sub hunt off Stockholm waters

Ah the Hunt for Red October

[John William]

	Quote:	bowlie
	Ah the Hunt for Red October

Yes could be a great photo opportunity for Putin to gatecrash Brexit, now that 'his man in the White House' will
be leaving next month.

[marton]

	Quote:	JackieH
	Not very sure how to share, but I have just seen a map where all the UK fishing trawlers were fishing yesterday... the vast majority were all around Iceland, Norway, Danemark, all along the north Spanis coast and down the whole of Portugal's coast. So I imagine protecting waters will go both ways? (on Jason Hunter's site).

As I posted before, the great British public does not like the sorts of fish to be found in British waters; mackerel and chips sound less than appetising.

Also, the largest British registered fishing trawlers are foreign owned.

[John William]

	Quote:	marton
	Northern Ireland fishermen now face the very real prospect that, if there is no Brexit deal, they will be banned from entering Irish and European waters. This means that local boats will no longer be allowed to fish in large parts of the Foyle and Carlingford loughs lucrative fishing grounds.

Will Boris deliver 'peace in our time' as the fish wars continue in Brussels ?

[Harness]

	Quote:	Harness
	I think Monday will be the announcement.

I was wrong.
Talks have been extended.

[HickvonFrick]

	Quote:	John William
	Will Boris deliver 'peace in our time' as the fish wars continue in Brussels ? Attachment 140908

Fish is a proxy. It's the level playing field that matters.

[HickvonFrick]

	Quote:	JackieH
	if they do so on their own territory, it is their right. Sovrinty- you know. It is not their fault Raab, Johnson and ERG didn't realise the UK is an (some) Island/s.

It may be their de jure right, but is it an appropriate way to behave? Luckily the EU have been pretty clear that this will not happen. It's a threat too far. It's one step off war.