The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[bowlie]

	Quote:	SponPlague
	And I just received my red Swiss passport this month!

Congratulations!

[Island Monkey]

From 2022, British Citizens will have to apply for the ETIAS visa waiver scheme to visit the Schengen zone. Not expensive, but a new hurdle.

https://etias.com/etias-requirements...itish-citizens

[bowlie]

	Quote:	Island Monkey
	From 2022, British Citizens will have to apply for the ETIAS visa waiver scheme to visit the Schengen zone. Not expensive, but a new hurdle. https://etias.com/etias-requirements...itish-citizens

Not just the British, but just about every non-EU/EFTA national.

[Island Monkey]

	Quote:	bowlie
	Not just the British, but just about every non-EU/EFTA national.

Yes of course. But this is about consequences of Brexit.

[rumshot]

Etias won’t be a reality.... with schengen it’s already complicated, imagine after this system...

A bunch of European countries and citizens won’t accept it... IMO, too dangerous... we have seen it before.

[Island Monkey]

	Quote:	rumshot
	Etias won’t be a reality.... with schengen it’s already complicated, imagine after this system... A bunch of European countries and citizens won’t accept it... IMO, too dangerous... we have seen it before.

The EU countries have already approved it.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	rumshot
	Etias won’t be a reality.... with schengen it’s already complicated, imagine after this system... A bunch of European countries and citizens won’t accept it... IMO, too dangerous... we have seen it before.

It's already approved and in the final stages of deployment.... it's an evolution of the current system.

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	UK never issued C permits, they don't even issue ID cards to citizens.

I suspect Castro knows that.

He was quite obviously talking about a colleague with a Swiss C permit and an Indian passport.

[bowlie]

	Quote:	Island Monkey
	The EU countries have already approved it.

They find retaliating against Australia, Canada, the U.S. et al to be more important than privacy concerns. And those affect only non-EU nationals.

I presume this deal has to be ratified by the European parliament. At first glance there's a few things in there I can imagine them objecting to...I wonder how smooth that will be.

[wantone]

I watched a bit of BBC yesterday, someone claimed that the UK got similar deal to Norway yet Norway allows free movement of people. How can that be?

[bowlie]

	Quote:
	I presume this deal has to be ratified by the European parliament. At first glance there's a few things in there I can imagine them objecting to...I wonder how smooth that will be.

It has been approved by the EP, the Commission and the Council. Why would they object to something that doesn’t affect any EU national? This relates to non-EUs travelling to the Schengen area and is no more onerous that a Schengen Visa request. The benefit being that every Schengen member has immediate access to information regarding the application; arrival and departure (from Schengen) information.

Can it be misused, of course. Will it be? Who knows?

[marton]

Looks like it will be some time before full details of the new trade deal emerge.

We do know that the protection for UK fishing has turned into a 25 percent cut in the share of fish caught by EU vessels in U.K. waters to be phased in over five and a half years.

More than 40 percent of the U.K.’s exports to the EU are services, and the sector accounts for around 80 percent of the U.K.’s economic activity but there seems to be nothing in the new deal about services.

Passporting, which allowed automatic access to the single market, is gone.
Mutual Recognition of Professional Qualifications (MRPQs), the mechanism that allows workers such as doctors, engineers and architects to have their qualifications recognized across member states has also gone.

International connections between electricity and natural gas networks remain.

UK nationals no longer have the freedom to work, study, start a business or live in the EU. Visas will be required for stays over 90 days, work permits even for short assignments.

The UK will continue to participate in the EU’s flagship €80bn Horizon Europe programme as a paying associate member for seven years. It will also continue in Copernicus and Euratom.

Aviation and haulage will continue as before with passenger and cargo planes still able to fly and land in the EU including stopover flights from Heathrow and elsewhere in the UK that originated from outside the UK.

How the costs of this will compare with the UK pre-Brexit EU payments is not yet published.

[NewInTownForever]

	Quote:	bowlie
	They find retaliating against Australia, Canada, the U.S. et al to be more important than privacy concerns. And those affect only non-EU nationals.

The US has a similar system, the Esta, since ages...but for cognitive dissonant Brexiteers if the EU does the same, it's bad no matter what.
If the EU tomorrow publishes a paper saying that the earth is a sphere, they'll start saying that the earth is flat just to say something against it.

[Island Monkey]

	Quote:	NewInTownForever
	The US has a similar system, the Esta, since ages...but for cognitive dissonant Brexiteers if the EU does the same, it's bad no matter what. If the EU tomorrow publishes a paper saying that the earth is a sphere, they'll start saying that the earth is flat just to say something against it.

Why would Brexiteers complain? They wanted to stop freedom of movement! It’s remainers that should feel hard done by by more restricted travel.

[SponPlague]

	Quote:	NewInTownForever
	The US has a similar system, the Esta, since ages...but for cognitive dissonant Brexiteers if the EU does the same, it's bad no matter what. If the EU tomorrow publishes a paper saying that the earth is a sphere, they'll start saying that the earth is flat just to say something against it.

It doesn’t travel on the back of a turtle? You’ll be denying Santa Claus next!

[olygirl]

"UK nationals no longer have the freedom to work, study, start a business or live in the EU. Visas will be required for stays over 90 days, work permits even for short assignments."

Two questions:

1. How will this affect UK nationals already living and working in Switzerland?
2. How will this affect UK nationals who want to work in Switzerland in the future?

[Island Monkey]

	Quote:	olygirl
	"UK nationals no longer have the freedom to work, study, start a business or live in the EU. Visas will be required for stays over 90 days, work permits even for short assignments." Two questions: 1. How will this affect UK nationals already living and working in Switzerland? 2. How will this affect UK nationals who want to work in Switzerland in the future?

1. It shouldn’t affect them too much. Apart from the fact until they get citizenship they can’t leave & come back. I assume permit works for Schengen travel??

2. Massively.

[JackieH]

I have not been able to check what is below myself- but it is from Jason Hunter who is a very experienced international negotiator (and yes, very pro EU)

''Yay. Great deal. Thanks Boris Johnson.

Airlines: UK can no longer participate in the liberalised aviation market. UK can no longer operate passenger and/or cargo flights between EU destinations based on a UK issued license. UK can no longer operate passenger flights onwards to or from the EU (eg. London-Amsterdam-Bangkok). UK no longer participates in or contributes to European Aviation Safety Agency EASA.

Road Transport: UK no longer participates in EU single market for transport services. UK operators lose right to conduct unlimited cross trade in the EU and up to three cabotage operations within the territory of a single member state.

Fish. UK fisheries products face new customs and SPS checks on entry to the EU.

Security: uK no longer participates in shaping the rules for security, police and judiciary cooperation (Europe, Eurojust etc). UK no longer benefits from.privileged access to police and judicial authorities. UK no longer has access to EU sensitive databases and networks such as the Schengen Information System.

Other programmes: UK no longer benefits from EU funding programmes like NextGenerationEU, regional development and cohesion funding, agriculture and rural development funding.

Mobility: UK nationals no longer have freedom of movement within the EU losing the right to freedom to work, live, start a business or study in the EU. Additionally border checks now required. UK nationals will have to pay extra charges for travel to the EU.

Pet passports no longer valid.

Energy: the UK no longer participates in the Single Energy Market. UK loses access to EU emissions trading scheme. UK is no longer a member of the European atomic energy community and loses its rihht to trade nuclear material and technology with Euratom.

Services: UK no longer benefits from country-of-origin approach or passorting concepts.

No more automatic recognition of qualifications for doctors, nurses, architects, vets, engineers, pharmacista etc. UK.no longer free to provide audio/visual services into the EU markets with a UK licence.


Trade: will do a longer post on that but its pretty awful too.

Merry Christmas folks and as always.... Bollocks to Brexit.''

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	Island Monkey
	1. It shouldn’t affect them too much. Apart from the fact until they get citizenship they can’t leave & come back. I assume permit works for Schengen travel?? 2. Massively.

I think you are overestimating the difficulty for anyone with a skill. I came to CH in 1994 long before free movement. I just had a skill that was missing.