The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[John William]

You couldn't make it up could you ? so much for british jobs for british workers.

The Guardian - British exporters told to move to the EU to avoid Brexit costs

BBC News - UK firms told to set up in EU to avoid trade disruption

[marton]

For CNN fans
Probably fake news

Rotting fish, lost business and piles of red tape. The reality of Brexit hits Britain

	Quote:
	The region where food shortages could fast become a real issue is Northern Ireland, where images of empty supermarket shelves have circulated on social media. Due to the unique position of Northern Ireland, it has split with the rest of the United Kingdom and remained inside the EU single market, making it a lot harder to import food from Great Britain. Simon Coveney, Ireland's foreign affairs minister, said that images showing empty shelves in Northern Irish supermarkets were "clearly a Brexit issue" and "part of the reality" of the United Kingdom leaving the European Union.

[bowlie]

	Quote:	marton
	For CNN fans Probably fake news Rotting fish, lost business and piles of red tape. The reality of Brexit hits Britain

Why don’t they just import the food from Ireland? Probably cheaper since it doesn’t need a sea crossing.

[marton]

	Quote:	bowlie
	Why don’t they just import the food from Ireland? Probably cheaper since it doesn’t need a sea crossing.

Well you know people have their food likes and dislikes and are used to British foods.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	bowlie
	Why don’t they just import the food from Ireland? Probably cheaper since it doesn’t need a sea crossing.

There has been unrestricted access to Ireland for a very long time, if it had been cheaper the trade would have developed already.....

In fact the cost of living is between 15% - 20% high than the UK and average GDP per capita is about 40% higher. Ireland is not a cheap country. NI is to Ireland, what France/Germany is to Switzerland when it comes to shopping.

[komsomolez]

	Quote:	John William
	You couldn't make it up could you ? so much for british jobs for british workers. The Guardian - British exporters told to move to the EU to avoid Brexit costs BBC News - UK firms told to set up in EU to avoid trade disruption

Indeed, this looks increasingly bad. Just read in the German news that 40% of trucks delievering goods to the UK go back empty. Which means that the UK is not exporting much and the freight rates for imports go up.

[marton]

Oooppss

EU threatens to block Covid vaccine exports amid AstraZeneca shortfall

[3Wishes]

	Quote:	marton
	Oooppss EU threatens to block Covid vaccine exports amid AstraZeneca shortfall

That made me rather angry when I read it. Similar to when various countries hoarded masks and other PPE by blocking through transit. It reeks of hypocrisy. "We're all about international cooperation and bilateral agreements and helping developing countries...until we aren't first in line for what we want". Then it's every man/country for himself.

[marton]

In the "you could not make this stuff up corner"

	Quote:
	EU citizens are being offered financial incentives to leave the UK, the Guardian has learned, months before the deadline to apply for settled status has passed. From 1 January EU citizens have quietly been added to the government’s voluntary returns scheme where financial support is offered as an encouragement to return to their country of origin. Payments can include flights and up to £2,000 resettlement money.

[John William]

	Quote:	3Wishes
	That made me rather angry when I read it. Similar to when various countries hoarded masks and other PPE by blocking through transit. It reeks of hypocrisy. "We're all about international cooperation and bilateral agreements and helping developing countries...until we aren't first in line for what we want". Then it's every man/country for himself.

Which reminds did anyone get to the bottom of the great Toilet Roll shortage that came with the first wave lockdowns ?

[JackieH]

	Quote:	3Wishes
	That made me rather angry when I read it. Similar to when various countries hoarded masks and other PPE by blocking through transit. It reeks of hypocrisy. "We're all about international cooperation and bilateral agreements and helping developing countries...until we aren't first in line for what we want". Then it's every man/country for himself.

Yes it is dreadful. But you have to place this in the context of Brexit- and that the UK chose to leave the EU, and chose, and then boasted very loud, making it a massive positive point 'that because of Brexit we were able to get our hands on the vaccine and approve it before all in the EU' blasted all over the Press/TV/Social media, etc. The EU chose to work together on the approval and the contracts to order large numbers- so in thise case, it is totally understandable.

[marton]

	Quote:	RufusB
	Yep. Brexit had nothing to do with the vaccine deployment in the UK. The UK gov't, for once, got ahead of the curve with their order. Brexit could have meant that the EU orders were fulfilled over non-EU. Thankfully it did not. It was understood that a pandemicmwas coming, but that it would be Flu based, not SARS. Hence the huge additional order of flu vaccines by last July too. Not a list of who voted, merely a list of all the Brexity benefits. Only that's probably not as funny as taking pot shots.

Good that the UK gov't, for once, got ahead of the curve with their order. Would be a shame if the EU blocked delivery..

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	JackieH
	Yes it is dreadful. But you have to place this in the context of Brexit- and that the UK chose to leave the EU, and chose, and then boasted very loud, making is a massive positive point 'that because of Brexit we were able to get our hands on the vaccine and approve it before all in the EU' blasted all over the Press/TV/Social media, etc. The EU chose to work together on the approval and the contracts to order large numbers- so in thise case, it is totally understandable.

I think this proves that in your eyes the EU can do no wrong. Just like their ventilator sharing program and their financial stimulus program, the EU has managed to screw up their vaccine roll out too. You wanted to see "JUST ONE" benefit of Brexit, well here's one staring you right in the face!!

They've screwed up so badly that now they're looking to correct it through any means necessary, whether that is leaking misinformation to a German newspaper on the efficacy of the AstraZeneca vaccine, or trying to blame AstraZeneca for late delivery of a vaccine that STILL hasn't been approved.

The EU wanted it to be a European effort so backed French company Sanofi even though their vaccine is miles away from approval, rather than ordering more from Pfizer/Biotech, as ever ideology over reality has been their undoing. Then they spent so long haggling over price that they missed their place in the queue.

The EU "chose" to work together, which is why Hungary has just bought a load of Sputnik V. The EU proving once again that the Emperor has no clothes. How you can try and turn this around on the UK is quite simply nuts!

[bowlie]

It appears to me that the EU countries had some commitments from the vaccine manufacturers, that now they are struggling to meet. The EU is suspicious that the stated reasons for the delays are not realistic.

So they are looking for guarantees that the problems are realistic and that production is not being diverted to others, despite binding commitments to EU countries.

What we may be seeing is the greed of big Pharma being called to task.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	JackieH
	Yes it is dreadful. But you have to place this in the context of Brexit- and that the UK chose to leave the EU, and chose, and then boasted very loud, making it a massive positive point 'that because of Brexit we were able to get our hands on the vaccine and approve it before all in the EU' blasted all over the Press/TV/Social media, etc. The EU chose to work together on the approval and the contracts to order large numbers- so in thise case, it is totally understandable.

FT disagrees with you.
https://www.ft.com/content/c9bbc753-...6-dd97a7c4b807

[3Wishes]

	Quote:	JackieH
	Yes it is dreadful. But you have to place this in the context of Brexit- and that the UK chose to leave the EU, and chose, and then boasted very loud, making it a massive positive point 'that because of Brexit we were able to get our hands on the vaccine and approve it before all in the EU' blasted all over the Press/TV/Social media, etc. The EU chose to work together on the approval and the contracts to order large numbers- so in thise case, it is totally understandable.

I realize we're in the Brexit thread but my anger was more generalized. Many of the wealthy countries have "secured" vaccine dose quantities that would vaccinate their entire population multiple times over. Meanwhile poorer countries are left with scraps, despite the fact they're less well-equipped to handle the pandemic.

This article is older but it shows the disparity:
https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-relea...ading-covid-19

The UK is hardly in a terrible position when you consider they have vaccinated nearly 10% of the adult population. Only Israel and I think one other country have vaccinated more people per capita.

[JackieH]

Totally agree- but in this case, the UK- it was important, I feel- to state the political context in the case of EU/UK.

I can't read the FT, but it would not be the first time we disagree

As for red rep from TonyClifton accusing me of being massively anti UK- he could not be more wrong. I am anti the actions of the current UK Government, for sure- with 100000 deaths to back the fact they have made a massive mess of Covid, and Brexit- and that the combination of both is an absolute disaster for the UK, and all my family and friends who are still there.

[RufusB]

	Quote:	JackieH
	Totally agree- but in this case, the UK- it was important, I feel- to state the political context in the case of EU/UK. I can't read the FT, but it would not be the first time we disagree As for red rep from TonyClifton accusing me of being massively anti UK- he could not be more wrong. I am anti the actions of the current UK Government, for sure- with 100000 deaths to back the fact they have made a massive mess of Covid, and Brexit- and that the combination of both is an absolute disaster for the UK, and all my family and friends who are still there.

Jackie, it's not actually as bad as all that. Had BoJo stuck to his inital herd immunity guns, it would have been over 400000k. Please stop saying it's a disaster. We're just getting on with it as best we can. Is it weird and monotonous and isolating and horrid being in lockdown? Yep. But not a disaster.

[JackieH]

100000 deaths and no end in sight- and farming, fishing, business on its knees- and it is not a disaster? Sorry- but really ?!?

Our daughters, grandchildren, family and friends in the UK say it is a disaster- grandkids not having school again, can't see family, friends, no clubs, no sport apart from walking and cycling. All of them say it is- apart from a few, who have died.

[RufusB]

	Quote:	JackieH
	100000 deaths and no end in sight- and farming, fishing, business on its knees- and it is not a disaster? Sorry- but really ?!?

It's unutterably shit. It is isolating and collective mental health is in decline. My youngest is forgetting how to interact with her peers because she has spent half her life in lockdown. So, believing there is light, that it's not actually the oncoming forking train, is pretty much self-preservation right now.

Any person making Pollyanna cracks will get a poke in the eye.