The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	curley
	As a non-English person I find the type of language used in GB politics extremly disturbing. Is it normal for GB politicians to call eachother names and argue with eachother on the level of an 8 year old?

It's absolutely normal, though I wouldn't judge the rest by Farage's standard at the EU Parliament. He takes even that to a new low.

'Banter', such as that from Cameron yesterday, is absolutely normal. Funniest comment of the day...

	Quote:
	“Let me welcome the new member for Tooting to her place,” Mr Cameron said ... “I think I'd advise her to keep her mobile phone on – she might be in the Shadow Cabinet by the end of the day. And I though I was having a bad day!"

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7105986.html


The UK is one of the few countries in the World that has a combative style of parliament, with opposing parties sitting on opposite sides of the chamber, rather than in the ampitheatre format favoured by most other national parliaments.

If I had a few days to spare, I could get you all the historical stuff behind this chosen format. It goes way back to things like shaking hands with your right hand to prove that you're not about to draw your sword. That feeds into one of the reasons left handed people weren't trusted as they still had their sword hand free. Etc......

[Faltrad]

	Quote:	marton
	And in Turkey and Greece they have fist fights in Parliament.

Yes it happens, but it is not daily standard practice. The tone in the British parliament is always like that, this is their way of being normal. Day in, day out.
Well, if they like it... I don't care, but I can't take them seriously. It might be just me. Different opinions welcome.

	Quote:	Blueangel
	The UK is one of the few countries in the World that has a combative style of parliament.

It was like that in France before WW2. It changed with new generations coming. It didn't change in the UK. No big deal I guess, but the perception of lack of seriousness stays seen from the continent.

[lewton]

We don't really have fist fights in the Greek parliament, except for the Golden Dawn MPs.
Certainly not normal.

[curley]

	Quote:	Phil_MCR
	Exactly. The very senior politicians should obey the clear instructions from the technocrat masters! Bloody uppity politicians thinking they should have a say in things or independent thought! Pah!

	Quote:	marton
	I thought these were the very people you want to stop having control? You should be celebrating that they are blocked?

After living amongst English speaking people for 42 years now I'm beginning to wonder if I should go take English-lessons as to me Phil_MCR's post was clearly meant sarcastically.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Faltrad
	Not at all. No German politician would dare talking like that in public, the few times this happens, the guy was eaten alive by the press and the Stammtische all over the country the day after. France is the country of "petites phrases", smart-ass comments with double entendre and sarcastic allusions. It feeds the press but it's by no mean vulgar.

I meant, in Germany it is also true that the real work and the real deals are struck behind the scenes. When you watch debates one person may say A and another may retort B but you never hear somebody say, good speech, you've just convinced me to change my opinion.

It's a show put on for the public. It's not an honest debate.

[Faltrad]

	Quote:	amogles
	I meant, in Germany it is also true that the real work and the real deals are struck behind the scenes.(...) It's a show put on for the public. It's not an honest debate.

Yes and yes. On that part, I share your opinion. It's only about the offensive vulgar style of the British parliament I was making a huge difference with the other countries I know.
In the parliament, politicians only talk to be quoted somewhere else. How they obtain this publicity is a different question. True.

[lewton]

How does this work?

Boris is already negotiating with Angela.

[ZuriRollt]

	Quote:	lewton
	How does this work? Boris is already negotiating with Angela.

Ah, he even brushed his (hair). So cute.

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	ZuriRollt
	Ah, he even brushed his (hair). So cute.

Boris has so much to learn if he wants to be a poster boy.


http://globalnews.ca/news/2790745/su...-war-ii-comic/

[ZuriRollt]

	Quote:	lewton
	How does this work? Boris is already negotiating with Angela.

Another bunch of BS.
it's quite ridiculous that it makes me want to puke.

Can't be bothered anymore
Here the reality (again):

Attachment 115826

Both with the fallout from the Brexit vote and the turmoil in the Labour party, it's unbelievable the problem people are having with accepting the result of a simple vote.

Whatever you think of Corbyn, he has a clear mandate to run that party given by its members. Yet MPs are happily ignoring that and trying to get rid of him.

Same goes for the Brexit vote. They said it was too important a decision and the country should decide. The country decided and now certain people are screeching that this should now have been decided by Parliament. Supposedly intelligent people too. It's a disgrace.

[Faltrad]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Both with the fallout from the Brexit vote and the turmoil in the Labour party, it's unbelievable the problem people are having with accepting the result of a simple vote.

In the UK, perhaps. But in EU, it's been accepted and people just wouldn't like to have to wait for the leaving talks to start. That's more than decent respect for the results.

It seems EU has less difficulties accepting british democracy than british politicians themselves.

[dodgyken]

With Labour having pressed the self destruct button and Tory MPs wandering around Parliament asking their party colleagues "Friend or Foe" the political landscape is left wide open for the Liberal Democratics to surge through, unite the country and make Britain slightly above average again.

Now what's the name of their leader again?

	Quote:	Urs Max
	Not really, there are multiple precedents, for instance danish voters refusing the Euro.

or the French and Dutch voting against the European Constitution

[lewton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Both with the fallout from the Brexit vote and the turmoil in the Labour party, it's unbelievable the problem people are having with accepting the result of a simple vote. Whatever you think of Corbyn, he has a clear mandate to run that party given by its members. Yet MPs are happily ignoring that and trying to get rid of him. Same goes for the Brexit vote. They said it was too important a decision and the country should decide. The country decided and now certain people are screeching that this should now have been decided by Parliament. Supposedly intelligent people too. It's a disgrace.

Please note though how the EU is insisting that the UK must respect the vote and trigger article 50.
We can't wait to see you out.

It's the UK side that is trying to delay the whole thing.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Same goes for the Brexit vote. They said it was too important a decision and the country should decide. The country decided and now certain people are screeching that this should now have been decided by Parliament. Supposedly intelligent people too. It's a disgrace.

Which is exactly the point my Swiss neighbour made the other day.
And I quote her...

"Swiss people have referendums all the time (over 180 in the last two years) and if we discussed politics as much as the British did, we'd never have time to talk about anything else. I thought British people were supposed to be intelligent? "

"Switzerland has had many, many wars, but that was only to stop Switzerland from being invaded and broken up. Great Britain went all over the World and had a great empire. In two years time, Switzerland will still be Switzerland and Britain won't even have Scotland!"

Also worth remembering that referendums are illegal in Germany since after WWII.

"And it makes me wonder...." copyright Led Zeppelin

[porsch1909]

How does this work?

I guess it's all a bit of a laugh until you realise Farage is paraphrasing Hitler in the European parliament.

	Quote:	Loz1983
	... Whatever you think of Corbyn, he has a clear mandate to run that party given by its members. Yet MPs are happily ignoring that and trying to get rid of him. ...

This system allowed for a leader who isn't supported by many of the MPs, bypassing the party. The weakness is obvious.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Also worth remembering that referendums are illegal in Germany since after WWII.

Really?

There have been quite a few referendums in Germany over the years.

That's not a weakness Pashosh, it is Ides of March levels of treachery from ambitious MPs, sabotaging the will of their own membership.

The party is a shambles because of this - less seats in Scotland than the Tories - they might as well pack it in up there and save the money they use renting offices.