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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #29301  
Old 07.02.2021, 10:29
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Because unlike you they need to stop sticking their heads in the sand and deal with the farce they have created. If only you’d coined the phrase “Local Britain”, you’d have a roaring success on your hands.
This is a matter for business's to do, not something for the government.
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  #29302  
Old 07.02.2021, 10:56
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Not when it is the Government that has caused the farce.

Exports down by over 2/3rds- that is massive.

Combined with the losses due to Covid- and wait just a little more for restrictions to be fully put into action, for furlough to stop, and massive job losses to become real, add stopping rent and eviction protection.

Last edited by Guest; 07.02.2021 at 16:18. Reason: Deleted personal comments. Unnecessary and likely only to exacerbate tensions.
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  #29303  
Old 07.02.2021, 11:45
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Not when it is the Government that has caused the farce.

Exports down by over 2/3rds- that is massive.
I had to google that, yes by volume rather than by value.

It will be interesting to see how the UK's trade deficit with the EU is this year, hopefully it will be reduced although your alarming statistic implied it could be worse.
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  #29304  
Old 07.02.2021, 12:14
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I had to google that, yes by volume rather than by value.

It will be interesting to see how the UK's trade deficit with the EU is this year, hopefully it will be reduced although your alarming statistic implied it could be worse.
The vast majority of high value shipments move by air. Things like vaccines, computer chips, currency, jewels.
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  #29305  
Old 07.02.2021, 12:40
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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So it would seem it’s both a lack of resources and an inability to complete documentation...

We can expect people to improve their documentation process over time, but unless the government increases the resources for testing, it’s not going get much better...
Pretty much spot on. Exporters will learn how to complete paperwork correctly, and how to get (in my case) cheese tested quickly. And hopefully the government will increase capacity at testing centres, staff as well as actual labs. My anger really is that the government had over 4 years to prepare for this, but all they did was tell exporters that everything will continue as before. And that was blatantly false.

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Why would the government be responsible for 'increases the resources for testing'
Oh good grief.
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Old 07.02.2021, 12:44
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Oh good grief.
You mean there should be a 'national health service' for animals?
Surely the cost & infrastructure of this should be directly paid for those who wish to export stuff like yourself, rather than expect the taxpayer to subsidise your trade!
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  #29307  
Old 07.02.2021, 13:53
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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You mean there should be a 'national health service' for animals?
Surely the cost & infrastructure of this should be directly paid for those who wish to export stuff like yourself, rather than expect the taxpayer to subsidise your trade!
Usually, governments take measures to help and increase exports, unlike the UK where a claimed 68% fall in exports is met at best with apathy or at worst with lies.
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  #29308  
Old 07.02.2021, 14:38
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Will be dismissed by the usual because it is from the Guardian - but it says it as it is :

''British exporters sending goods into the EU have been similarly hit by border frictions. For a small exporter, the costs of the regulatory checks, filling in long and complex forms and meeting new rules around VAT can be crippling. Some businesses have simply had to stop exporting to the EU because of these costs, putting jobs at risk. New rules for shellfish and livestock have led to a dramatic drop in trade. The Road Haulage Association reports that export loads to the EU have been reduced by as much as 68% and that there are only around 10,000 of the 50,000 customs agents who are needed to cope with the flow of goods to the EU. This will have a detrimental impact on the viability of the road haulage industry, also affecting businesses that rely on imports of goods coming into the UK: six in 10 firms are already reporting delays in shipments coming from the EU.

Ministers have responded with claims that these are just “teething problems”. They are ignoring industry voices who point out that many are structural problems that will not go away within weeks, or even months, without a significant renegotiation. Little wonder that business representatives say the biggest problem they have with the government at the moment is denial of reality. Calls for meaningful engagement from the government to find solutions go unheeded, even as government trade advisers are encouraging exporters to set up separate companies inside the EU to get around export charges. Ministers simply continue to claim that Brexit is going well.

This is the inevitable cost of Brexit. People have spent their lives painstakingly building up a livelihood, only to find it wiped out almost overnight by a government that has eagerly embraced new barriers to trade. They are existing in a warped reality, where it suits neither the government nor the opposition to acknowledge the gravity of their situation. And so, even as jobs disappear and incomes plummet, there will be little political accountability for the flawed political choices that have brought us here.,,
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  #29309  
Old 07.02.2021, 15:50
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Will be dismissed by the usual because it is from the Guardian - but it says it as it is :

''British exporters sending goods into the EU have been similarly hit by border frictions. For a small exporter, the costs of the regulatory checks, filling in long and complex forms and meeting new rules around VAT can be crippling. Some businesses have simply had to stop exporting to the EU because of these costs, putting jobs at risk. New rules for shellfish and livestock have led to a dramatic drop in trade. The Road Haulage Association reports that export loads to the EU have been reduced by as much as 68% and that there are only around 10,000 of the 50,000 customs agents who are needed to cope with the flow of goods to the EU. This will have a detrimental impact on the viability of the road haulage industry, also affecting businesses that rely on imports of goods coming into the UK: six in 10 firms are already reporting delays in shipments coming from the EU.

Ministers have responded with claims that these are just “teething problems”. They are ignoring industry voices who point out that many are structural problems that will not go away within weeks, or even months, without a significant renegotiation. Little wonder that business representatives say the biggest problem they have with the government at the moment is denial of reality. Calls for meaningful engagement from the government to find solutions go unheeded, even as government trade advisers are encouraging exporters to set up separate companies inside the EU to get around export charges. Ministers simply continue to claim that Brexit is going well.

This is the inevitable cost of Brexit. People have spent their lives painstakingly building up a livelihood, only to find it wiped out almost overnight by a government that has eagerly embraced new barriers to trade. They are existing in a warped reality, where it suits neither the government nor the opposition to acknowledge the gravity of their situation. And so, even as jobs disappear and incomes plummet, there will be little political accountability for the flawed political choices that have brought us here.,,
I wouldn't dismiss the Guardian out of hand, I've had great success with a number of recipes they've published.

This is alarmist nonsense, however. Full of exaggerated claims. Hogwash.

Many of the temporary challenges that exist will be overcome through resourcefulness and entrepreneurial endeavours simply resulting in a new paradigm.

I don't read too much into it but incidentally GBP has strengthened considerably since the start of the year.
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  #29310  
Old 07.02.2021, 16:26
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I wouldn't dismiss the Guardian out of hand, I've had great success with a number of recipes they've published.

This is alarmist nonsense, however. Full of exaggerated claims. Hogwash.

Many of the temporary challenges that exist will be overcome through resourcefulness and entrepreneurial endeavours simply resulting in a new paradigm.

I don't read too much into it but incidentally GBP has strengthened considerably since the start of the year.
"temporary challenges" We are already in the sixth week so how long is "temporary" bearing in mind that there was no fundamental necessity for these "challenges" - an on the ball government should have documented and tested the processes before this year started.
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  #29311  
Old 07.02.2021, 19:11
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Indeed, and so far, we have been talking about UK exports.

KPMG and others are warning about imports, especially food and meat products, from April, and other rules being phased in. Fruit, veg, fish shellfish, and so much more, and including cheese imports. EU hauliers are already threatening to refuse to come to the UK.

From the Guardian again

''The new checks and processes could mean that “some of the biggest headaches for hauliers and companies which import are definitely yet to come,” says Tim Sarson, a tax partner at accountancy firm KPMG.

The introduction of animal and plant inspections in April coincides awkwardly with the time of year when Britain starts to import more groceries from southern Europe.

“You’ve got SPS checks which are slowing things down just as you’ve got volumes ramping up from Europe, if there are going to be shortages of fresh fruit and veg, that is when it is likely to happen,” Sarson said.''

''More changes occur in July, as traders moving goods must make their full customs declarations on entering the UK, rather than submitting forms at a later date. In addition, imports will have to enter the UK at specific locations known as border control posts.

More changes affecting certification and regulations of items such as medical devices have been given a longer transition period'' - but will also face massive problems.
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  #29312  
Old 07.02.2021, 19:52
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Indeed, and so far, we have been talking about UK exports.

KPMG and others are warning about imports, especially food and meat products, from April, and other rules being phased in. Fruit, veg, fish shellfish, and so much more, and including cheese imports. EU hauliers are already threatening to refuse to come to the UK.

From the Guardian again

''The new checks and processes could mean that “some of the biggest headaches for hauliers and companies which import are definitely yet to come,” says Tim Sarson, a tax partner at accountancy firm KPMG.

The introduction of animal and plant inspections in April coincides awkwardly with the time of year when Britain starts to import more groceries from southern Europe.

“You’ve got SPS checks which are slowing things down just as you’ve got volumes ramping up from Europe, if there are going to be shortages of fresh fruit and veg, that is when it is likely to happen,” Sarson said.''

''More changes occur in July, as traders moving goods must make their full customs declarations on entering the UK, rather than submitting forms at a later date. In addition, imports will have to enter the UK at specific locations known as border control posts.

More changes affecting certification and regulations of items such as medical devices have been given a longer transition period'' - but will also face massive problems.
I remember you telling us the UK would not be able to get any vaccine as we had missed on buying jointly with other EU countries. Goes to show you can't believe everything you read in the Gardian.
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  #29313  
Old 07.02.2021, 20:24
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Remember what they said

https://fb.watch/3vZRB1iudZ/

we hold all the cards, there will be no downsize or price to pay, at all.
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  #29314  
Old 07.02.2021, 21:17
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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"temporary challenges" We are already in the sixth week so how long is "temporary" bearing in mind that there was no fundamental necessity for these "challenges" - an on the ball government should have documented and tested the processes before this year started.
Also bear in mind we are in a 6 month grace period for imports, so once that ends the chaos can begin in both directions. Civil servants have helpfully suggested companies set up subsidiaries in the EU, which is great if you're a major seafood wholesaler, not so much if you sell Fudge from a corner shop in Devon.
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  #29315  
Old 08.02.2021, 01:57
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Also bear in mind we are in a 6 month grace period for imports, so once that ends the chaos can begin in both directions. Civil servants have helpfully suggested companies set up subsidiaries in the EU, which is great if you're a major seafood wholesaler, not so much if you sell Fudge from a corner shop in Devon.
I doubt it, the fish still have to go through the export/import process...
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  #29316  
Old 08.02.2021, 12:57
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Also bear in mind we are in a 6 month grace period for imports, so once that ends the chaos can begin in both directions. Civil servants have helpfully suggested companies set up subsidiaries in the EU, which is great if you're a major seafood wholesaler, not so much if you sell Fudge from a corner shop in Devon.
It's already started in the other direction to. One of my suppliers in the UK makes Bitter Orange Marmalade, they normally have deliveries of Seville oranges from Spain almost every week. They haven't had one this year, it's a combination of the suppliers not knowing how to complete the paperwork, one one just can not be bothered to do it.

They also make a range of fruit Chutney that I buy. There's big confusion about the paperwork, about whether they have to list the country of origin of all ingredients in the jar (and I guess some will have fruit from the UK, EU, even the West Indies or India in the case of Mango) and if they do, is it worth the bother to export it?
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  #29317  
Old 08.02.2021, 13:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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What about the British, they guys in the street? Would they even care if NI left and united with Eire?
I don't think the average Joe in the UK has strong feelings about NI one way or the other.
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Old 08.02.2021, 13:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I doubt it, the fish still have to go through the export/import process...
Unless they unload them off the boat directly in the EU rather than in the UK!

Tom
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Old 08.02.2021, 13:28
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Unless they unload them off the boat directly in the EU rather than in the UK!

Tom
Lateral thinking, hence the EU subsidiary.
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Old 08.02.2021, 13:29
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Unless they unload them off the boat directly in the EU rather than in the UK!

Tom
Some are doing this but depending on their fishing ground it can be a long journey which reduces the time when they can actually fish.
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