The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	amogles
	Or in the USA how the Electoral Council is always called into question by those who lost an election because of it, and only afterwards. People will always attempt to change the constitution and the voting laws to make it easier for them to win.

Likewise the vote collection for the POTUS election, the Dems cried foul in 2016 just like the Reps did last year.

The same applies to gerrymandering, both do it but the Reps seem to be better thus the Dems cry foul.

	Quote:	Jim2007
	But it did not gain any credibility beyond its only little group and that is the big difference.

Whether it gains traction or not seems rather random, I see no difference in the mindset. Just like there's no difference in the mindset behind attempted vs completed murder.

	Quote:	Jim2007
	I think any other consideration though is that there is no process available to the loosing side in the UK to challenge the result beyond endless bellyaching - there is no way to force them to bring it to an end. In Ireland any citizen can take a case to the Supreme Court if they don’t agree with the outcome, in Switzerland a new referendum can be launched, but in the UK you can just continue to bellyache.

Agreed (can't speak on Eire politics specifically though).
I think the frequently recurring call to vote plays a role too, both in building trust, learning that there's always another day, and establishing the channels that provide at least reasonably fair information.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Polymath
	Same-sex couples in Ireland can be excused for feeling some unease about the fact that their relatively newfound right is prescribed in the name of the 'Most Holy Trinity'.

That proves God's omniscience.
One of the three incarnations(word?) represents the non-binary types.

[marton]

Boris continues to ruin UK's reputation

Boris Johnson was embroiled in an extraordinary public spat with EU leaders over Northern Ireland yesterday as tensions over Brexit boiled over at the G7 summit in Cornwall.

Former British ambassadors said his failure to honour a Brexit deal that he himself had helped negotiate had fatally undermined trust in his government and damaged its international reputation.

Nigel Sheinwald, a former UK ambassador to Washington and the EU, said: “The lesson of this week is that you can’t have a global Britain which is genuinely respected and influential and impactful around the world if people doubt your basic bona fides.”

Referring to a document signed at the summit by Johnson and US president Joe Biden, Sheinwald added: “There is no point in writing new Atlantic charters which depend on mutual trust, mutual confidence and the rule of law when you are operating as chancers.”

Biden has also stressed the importance of protecting the Good Friday agreement, after it emerged that US diplomats had taken the unusual step of warning Lord Frost, the cabinet minister and EU negotiator, the approach risked inflaming Northern Irish tensions.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	This is true, but then there is a long tradition of decision making by referendum in Ireland as well and it is just the accepted approach. Even on very controversial subjects such as gay marriage or abortion, the opposition usually dies down within 12 months or so. The people take their argument to the Supreme Court and that is where it ends. Probably taking BREXIT as a learning exercise was not a good idea.

I agree that having referenda with some regularity builds up a cultural awareness and a debate climate, and maybe also the attitude that sometimes you win and sometimes you lose but it's not the end of the world.

Personally I would like to see referenda become a more common part of taking important decisions.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	amogles
	Personally I would like to see referenda become a more common part of taking important decisions.

In Ireland most young people are drawn into politics via referenda. EU relate referenda aside, most of the others are the kind of idealistic issues that young people can get behind rather than the usual party politics.

The referendum on gay marriage was for many 18 - 30 year olds their first experience of the system. They delivered leaflets, put up posters, knocked on doors, acted as presiding officers, ferried voters to and from the polling stations, took part in the count etc… They learned that you can actually change things if you get involved rather than sit on the fence and complain.

[st2lemans]

They should just kick Ireland out of the EU, problem solved!

Tom

[bowlie]

	Quote:	st2lemans
	They should just kick Ireland out of the EU, problem solved! Tom

They should just kick N. Ireland out of the UK. Make them independent and tell them to solve their problems themselves.

[st2lemans]

	Quote:	bowlie
	They should just kick N. Ireland out of the UK. Make them independent and tell them to solve their problems themselves.

They should have done so 100 years ago.

Would have avoided a lot of troubles.

Tom

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	bowlie
	They should just kick N. Ireland out of the UK. Make them independent and tell them to solve their problems themselves.

Yep and move the Unionists back to where they came from - Scotland and save the other Union at the same time….

Back in the real world it becomes a choice between which side you’d prefer to come and blow you up.

[amogles]

	Quote:	bowlie
	They should just kick N. Ireland out of the UK. Make them independent and tell them to solve their problems themselves.

Apparently there is a movement within NI that wants precisely that.

But their facebook page hasn't been updated since 2015. So much for their significance.

https://www.facebook.com/intheNIIP/

[Tom1234]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Back in the real world it becomes a choice between which side you’d prefer to come and blow you up.

That's normally how different religious factions seem to settle their differences...

[marton]

Probably offtopic and nothing to do with Brexit

	Quote:
	The Liberal Democrats' victory in Chesham and Amersham yesterday overturned a 16,000 majority in a seat that has always voted Conservative. The party's candidate Sarah Green won by 8,028 votes from the Tories. Labour had the worst by-election result in the party's history, with 622 votes.

[marton]

Really

	Quote:
	The EU is preparing to act against the “disproportionate” amount of British television and film content shown in Europe in the wake of Brexit, in a blow to the UK entertainment industry and the country’s “soft power” abroad. The UK is Europe’s biggest producer of film and TV programming, buoyed up by £1.4bn from the sale of international rights, but its dominance has been described as a threat to Europe’s “cultural diversity”.

[Ato]

	Quote:	marton
	Really

Where is this from? Surely the USA is a bigger threat to Europe’s “cultural diversity”.

[me.anon]

	Quote:	marton
	Really The EU is preparing to act against the “disproportionate” amount of British television and film content shown in Europe in the wake of Brexit, in a blow to the UK entertainment industry and the country’s “soft power” abroad. . . .

A good excuse to prevent the TV stations filling up air time with repeats of ancient British situation comodies of the like of "Keeping up Appearances", "Fawlty Towers" etc. However, the situation won't be any better if these are simply replaced with more tripe from Hollywood.

[Axa]

	Quote:	Ato
	Where is this from? Surely the USA is a bigger threat to Europe’s “cultural diversity”.

FWIW the guardian article https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...m-shown-brexit

Maybe the "potential" in the thread name needs to be updated.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	Really

oh dear. So the punters will have to watch Tatort until the cows come home.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	me.anon
	A good excuse to prevent the TV stations filling up air time with repeats of ancient British situation comodies of the like of "Keeping up Appearances", "Fawlty Towers" etc. However, the situation won't be any better if these are simply replaced with more tripe from Hollywood.

There are already rumors about a German versions of Allo Allo, Fawlty Towers (The Hoff starring as Basil Fawlty) and The Office (scripts edited by the crew of Derrick)..

[amogles]

	Quote:	me.anon
	A good excuse to prevent the TV stations filling up air time with repeats of ancient British situation comodies of the like of "Keeping up Appearances", "Fawlty Towers" etc. However, the situation won't be any better if these are simply replaced with more tripe from Hollywood.

I guess they are talking about state-run TV channels.

Which are a dying breed anyway.

[Tom1234]

	Quote:	me.anon
	A good excuse to prevent the TV stations filling up air time with repeats of ancient British situation comodies of the like of "Keeping up Appearances", "Fawlty Towers" etc. However, the situation won't be any better if these are simply replaced with more tripe from Hollywood.

You may find it's more in the area of British childrens' series that are really popular in Europe:

Including, but not limited to:

Peppa Pig (in twenty languages)
Bob der baumeister
Shaun das Schaf