The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	dodgyken
	I'm still sat on the fence - you don't get a bad view from it - and as long as don't actually try to sit astride it and instead dangle both legs down one side - its not all that uncomfortable. (You can also throw things at the frothy mouthed lunatics on both sides)

I'm just off to turn the power to the fence on.

[dodgyken]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	I'm just off to turn the power to the fence on.

Rubber pants

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	dodgyken
	Rubber pants

NFPA 70E certified, or the usual ones with the plated rivets?

[jacek]

	Quote:	marton
	But nobody in UK is listening to the EU and also not answering.

It merely means that the search for Article 50 has just begun somewhere down the Westminster ...

[CathHarmony]

	Quote:	baboon
	If you want to be fair in that comparison then also exclude the Alps from the Swiss land area as you exclude Scotland - this is also basically empty for similar reasons. The Swiss Mittelland has a density of 450 persons / km2. England 413. Healthcare basically applies here (EHIC or compulsory insurance if you're working here), housing you normally won't get in the UK either and social security in the UK you have to wait 5 years for under the new agreement.

Teensy bit disingeneous, look at the size of the swiss mittleland its less than a ⅓ of the country and it could be wrong, according to wiki its 380 bods per sqm. and its probably full of tolerable working people because Switzerland deports you shortly after you are no use to them....



Also 'free' health care in Switzerland, you have to go through hoops to get it here, and asking for it will get you deported the next time your pass comes up for renewal, England you just turn up at the gp and there are no consequences other than excellent health care.

[Uncle Max]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	The metropolitan elite summed up in 7 words.

I have no idea what this sneering's about but you're barking up the wrong tree.

	Quote:	Swisstree
	Number of UK children living in poverty jumps by 200,000 in a year.

Totally bonkers this is shielded from so many. Government austerity willed this sorry state of affairs and if Britain swings further to the right the politics of 1980's "Maggie Thatcher Milk Snatcher!" will seem golden. Cameron, Osbourne and Co. did things even Maggie wouldn't; resources will be scarcer than ever if this shit gets real. Oh wait, experts predict this will happen and we'll all sick of experts. Still, rather stick two fingers up to the EU than consider consequences of child poverty. Fly a flag. Tell people to get over it. Hit the mark, miss the point.

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	Agreed - and this is primarily due to a right-wing Tory government rather than EU membership. Voting Exit, which was mainly supported (in political circles) by righter-winger members of said Tory party will exasperate the problem.

It's all gone a bit loony tea party.

	Quote:	Phos
	Why not take the opportunity to restructure the economy in a way that is fit for the UK? ...I don't know how one can claim to be progressive, yet yearn for the the status quo.

Cause you don't scupper the boat when there's a chance to restore it.

The amount of law making required is going to take forever; there are few trade negotiators capable of rewriting the last 40+ years of statute to safe guard rights. Who's going to do all the work? Q4S? Capita? E&Y? Four decade's worth of Queen's speeches. This alone ought to be enough to give pause for thought.

Where Angels fear to tread...

Reform, restructure, stamp your feet and get mad as hell but sinking the project - and forcing chaos, rather than consensual albeit slower and less glorious negotiating - appears to the world as sheer petulance. Brits showed no political will to change things, then it became too late. Null Points for style.

	Quote:	Odile
	People who have been hurting badly voted for Brexit will it provide school places, and good quality school places at that ? will it provide a better NHS ? will it provide affordable housing ? will it reverse the bedroom tax and cuts to the disabled ? Will it? Really. Now who suffers from the above? Champagne socialists? Really? Clueless indeed.

I for one am a Champagne Socialist: Champagne for everyone. Everyone should have the opportunity to find dignity in honest labour, earn money and buy whatever they like. Bread and roses, but I'll forgo the roses if it means less child poverty. Not sure the world is in accordance, though.

So much hot air about regaining control; as a sovereign nation Britain was always in control. The electorate just weren't paying attention nor did much about it and the bully boys were completely free to do as they wished. A revolution encouraged by an elite isn't a revolution. At least people are now discussing politics, which I hope we can all appreciate.

	Quote:	dodgyken
	Was staying in the EU going to directly help with any of those?

Do you mean receipts for pencils and plasters or recognition of Objective One funding for the infrastructure? Some places in the UK have been saved and regenerated to success stories by the attention of the EU, cities which in the 80's - thanks to what would be regarded today as a moderate Tory government - were left to rot under a policy of 'managed decline'. Those were dark, dark days and there's little appetite to return.

[Phil_MCR]

	Quote:	jacek
	Now the "freedom of movement" card has been pulled ... Brexit: EU warns UK on freedom of movement http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36659900

surely the whole point of leaving europe is that the UK doesn't want to be part of the single market.

[baboon]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	Teensy bit disingeneous, look at the size of the swiss mittleland its less than a ⅓ of the country and it could be wrong, according to wiki its 380 bods per sqm. and its probably full of tolerable working people because Switzerland deports you shortly after you are no use to them.... Also 'free' health care in Switzerland, you have to go through hoops to get it here, and asking for it will get you deported the next time your pass comes up for renewal, England you just turn up at the gp and there are no consequences other than excellent health care.

If you check your source you will see that that map is titled "Much of the eastern part of the plateau has become part of the "Greater Zurich Area". ONLY THE EAST.

The Mittelland is the whole of the area between Alps and Jura, from Genfersee in the South-West to Bodensee in the North-East.

I took the population density from this page which quotes 450 persons per Km2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geography_of_Switzerland

Oh and free health care remains free regardless of any hoops you might have to go through. And does not get you thrown out of the country either.

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	Uncle Max
	I have no idea what this sneering's about but you're barking up the wrong tree.

You suggested that you didn't want to get spittle on your morning croissant. The croissant, as I'm sure you are aware, is a class marker, representing the metropolitan elite. The spittle represents the erupting rage of the oppressed. That you do not wish to get their spittle upon your delicious middle class breakfast suggests that you have no interest in them or anything they have to say (unless they fit some kind of modern noble savage stereotype, as beloved by writers for the Guardian).

Fifty and more years of this quiet, unbespittled croissant chomping has resulted in the events of the last five days.

You can't say you weren't warned.

HTH

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	Fifty and more years of this quiet, unbespittled croissant chomping has resulted in the events of the last five days.

It's just not the same without any Caviar

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	It's just not the same without any Caviar

[mirfield]

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	It's just not the same without any Caviar

Aw. I miss him too. I hope he's getting on OK.

[22 yards]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	The croissant, as I'm sure you are aware, is a class marker, representing the metropolitan elite.

As you know, Uncle Max has been in Switzerland for yonks and is now third generation (at least) Swiss. Things are different here. The Gipfeli -- which is not a croissant, morning or otherwise (it's just not bendy enough) -- is no indicator of social class. It's consumed by everybody, from the roadworkers and forklift drivers with whom I share my CHF 5.75 Coop Restaurant breakfast deal many mornings to the suited pharma company executives and inter-city commuters (with whom I also share my Coop Gipfeli, Weggli and Schale).

I think all of those people in the café with me prefer their Gipfeli unbespittled.

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	22 yards
	I think all of those people in the café with me prefer their Gipfeli unbespittled.

Capitalist lapdogs! They too shall be up against the wall when the spittle ocean rises!

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	Capitalist lapdogs! They too shall be up against the wall when the spittle ocean rises!

Where were you on the long march?

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	Where were you on the long march?

At the back, selling umbrellas.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	Capitalist lapdogs! They too shall be up against the wall when the spittle ocean rises!

- Nothing like a good glass of Chateau de Chassilier wine, ay Gessiah?

- You're right there Obediah.

- Who'd a thought thirty years ago we'd all be sittin' here drinking Chateau de Chassilier wine?

- Aye. In them days, we'd a' been glad to have the price of a croissant.

- With loads of spittle

- Without a croissant.

[Medea Fleecestealer]

Ha! Sturgeon got her come-uppance. Spain and France are against any negotiations with Scotland.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-...itics-36656980

[marton]

	Quote:	Uncle Max
	I have no idea what this sneering's about but you're barking up the wrong tree. Totally bonkers this is shielded from so many. Government austerity willed this sorry state of affairs and if Britain swings further to the right the politics of 1980's "Maggie Thatcher Milk Snatcher!" will seem golden. Cameron, Osbourne and Co. did things even Maggie wouldn't; resources will be scarcer than ever if this shit gets real. Oh wait, experts predict this will happen and we'll all sick of experts. Still, rather stick two fingers up to the EU than consider consequences of child poverty. Fly a flag. Tell people to get over it. Hit the mark, miss the point. It's all gone a bit loony tea party. Cause you don't scupper the boat when there's a chance to restore it. The amount of law making required is going to take forever; there are few trade negotiators capable of rewriting the last 40+ years of statute to safe guard rights. Who's going to do all the work? Q4S? Capita? E&Y? Four decade's worth of Queen's speeches. This alone ought to be enough to give pause for thought. Where Angels fear to tread... Reform, restructure, stamp your feet and get mad as hell but sinking the project - and forcing chaos, rather than consensual albeit slower and less glorious negotiating - appears to the world as sheer petulance. Brits showed no political will to change things, then it became too late. Null Points for style. I for one am a Champagne Socialist: Champagne for everyone. Everyone should have the opportunity to find dignity in honest labour, earn money and buy whatever they like. Bread and roses, but I'll forgo the roses if it means less child poverty. Not sure the world is in accordance, though. So much hot air about regaining control; as a sovereign nation Britain was always in control. The electorate just weren't paying attention nor did much about it and the bully boys were completely free to do as they wished. A revolution encouraged by an elite isn't a revolution. At least people are now discussing politics, which I hope we can all appreciate. Do you mean receipts for pencils and plasters or recognition of Objective One funding for the infrastructure? Some places in the UK have been saved and regenerated to success stories by the attention of the EU, cities which in the 80's - thanks to what would be regarded today as a moderate Tory government - were left to rot under a policy of 'managed decline'. Those were dark, dark days and there's little appetite to return.

"So much hot air about regaining control; as a sovereign nation Britain was always in control." Too late, Mate!
The cat is both in and out of the bag; I blame Schröder!

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	At the back, selling umbrellas.

How different life could have been if you were at the front.