The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

	Quote:	idefix
	Hmmmm. I thought we all gonna die after Brexit. The FTSE is doing better than Brexit. Hmmmm. Maybe getting out of the EU wasn't such a bad idea after all?

Try looking at the FTSE-250 which is composed largely of companies that trade in sterling vs the FTSE-100 composed of companies that mostly book in dollars - which has appreciated against sterling. How do those charts compare?

[idefix]

	Quote:
	Try looking at the FTSE-250 which is composed largely of companies that trade in sterling vs the FTSE-100 composed of companies that mostly book in dollars - which has appreciated against sterling. How do those charts compare?

While you are at it, shows the Japanese charts on the day of Brexit...

Meanwhile, the next PM says she will trigger A50 ASAP

[marton]

	Quote:	porsch1909
	The way I read it is that he's saying that all Jews don't like to murder innocent Palestinian children and bomb schools with laser guided missiles. Just like all Muslims don't want to behead journalists in the middle of the desert. A fair statement

These would be the innocent Palestinians using schools as rocket launching sites? As the UN reported the rockets are launched remotely to ensure any victims of reprisals are indeed innocent..

[marton]

	Quote:
	Like reducing immigration you mean? The greatest driver of the exit vote.

But the recently departed Boris said immigration was not a major driver?

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	I don't think we've explored the conspiracy theory potential of this thread sufficiently. Any takers?

I don't do conspiracy theories because the majority of the time, fact is stranger than fiction. Sadly, this is ont of those events that doesn't require conspiracy theories, plus I'm sick to the back teeth of them from the freakin Corbyn supporters.

[marton]

N

	Quote:	SOBEIT
	Yes it does, some expats if they receive a governmental pension are still taxed by the UK and it must be declared here for the yearly taxes too. And as for the OUT campaign being manipulated by lies what about the REMAIN campaign!

According to the double taxation agreement UK pensions are only taxed in the UK, from memory para. 18.

[Phil_MCR]

	Quote:	vuachère
	Given Blair's record of success (notably, the ME peace envoy for 8 years), him as the negotiator would ensure UK's exit from the EU happens sometime in infinity and the coffers of the Parliament would be proportionally depleted for his honorariums.

He's got some fckign nerve. Look at what he got for giving away billions of the UK rebate (I mean apart from a cushy EU job...)

Meanwhile the EU set to spend €62 billion to tackle migration from African and Asia. EU leaders made a announcement on Tuesday 28th June.

"Under the Partnership Framework with third countries, which the council adopted, 16 countries of origin and transit for migrants will be pressured to cooperate with the EU’s goals on curbing migration. Their compliance is to be rewarded with various “incentives” including development aid and trade deals. Non-cooperation will be met with unspecified “negative incentives” – presumably the withholding of aid and trade." Source

Human rights organizations are very concerned and have denounced the plans.

Médecins Sans Frontières also criticised the Council for its decision and warned of the “serious humanitarian consequences of the agreement, especially in Greece”.

Again, the EU are not being transparent: where is the money coming from exactly, no open discussion/ debate inclusive of human rights organizations as to how best to deal with the crisis and the long term effect it will have on third world countries.

[marton]

	Quote:	Swisstree
	Meanwhile the EU set to spend €62 billion to tackle migration from African and Asia. EU leaders made a announcement on Tuesday 28th June. "Under the Partnership Framework with third countries, which the council adopted, 16 countries of origin and transit for migrants will be pressured to cooperate with the EU’s goals on curbing migration. Their compliance is to be rewarded with various “incentives” including development aid and trade deals. Non-cooperation will be met with unspecified “negative incentives” – presumably the withholding of aid and trade." Source Human rights organizations are very concerned and have denounced the plans. Médecins Sans Frontières also criticised the Council for its decision and warned of the “serious humanitarian consequences of the agreement, especially in Greece”. Again, the EU are not being transparent: where is the money coming from exactly, no open discussion/ debate inclusive of human rights organizations as to how best to deal with the crisis and the long term effect it will have on third world countries including (the non-EU) UK.

Fixed that for you

	Quote:	idefix
	Hmmmm. I thought we all gonna die after Brexit. The FTSE is doing better than Brexit. Hmmmm. Maybe getting out of the EU wasn't such a bad idea after all?

At the end of the day- for the majority of the 48 %- what they feel now is not related to the FTSE- but to the ideals of post war Europe, of a Europe that collaborates rather than kills each other. It was the anniversary of the Somme yesterday- and that was very poignant for many of us.

And sitting here in the comfort of our mountains, watching the charts- and for some making quite a few bob too, because disasters always benefit some - it might be too easy to forget what is happening now in the UK. Despair for some, distrust, and a massive rise in racist attacks as Farage and the results have given their hatred legitimacy. Something broke in Great Britain the other day- that may never be mended. If you don't believe that, and think the FTSE will make it all better- then I despair a bit more.

Conspiracy theories JagWaugh? Well yes. But there are very few, even on the OUT side, who don't realise now that neither BoJo, Gove or Farage ever thought in a century of Sundays- that they would win- and now just don't know what to do. If you call that a conspiracy therory- so be it- the great majority believe it fact, and a large % now realise they have been fed lies upon lies, with the support of the Murdoch Press.

Even in primary schools, kids are being bullied for being Polish, or 3rd/4th generation Indian or West Indian even- and British people who were born here, of parents born here, are being verbally assaulted in the street since the vote. It's just so tragic to watch. So take your eyes of the FTSE and perhaps concentrate on the life of people. The people who voted out because of the lies they were told, will be the first ones to suffer, lose their jobs, etc- and they won't be happy, not happy at all. This is not the Great Britain I dreamed off for my grand-children, that is for sure. (They at least could go to live in Ireland or Switzerland).

[SOBEIT]

	Quote:
	At the end of the day- for the majority of the 48 %- what they feel now is not related to the FTSE- but to the ideals of post war Europe, of a Europe that collaborates rather than kills each other. It was the anniversary of the Somme yesterday- and that was very poignant for many of us. And sitting here in the comfort of our mountains, watching the charts- and for some making quite a few bob too, because disasters always benefit some - it might be too easy to forget what is happening now in the UK. Despair for some, distrust, and a massive rise in racist attacks as Farage and the results have given their hatred legitimacy. Something broke in Great Britain the other day- that may never be mended. If you don't believe that, and think the FTSE will make it all better- then I despair a bit more. Conspiracy theories JagWaugh? Well yes. But there are very few, even on the OUT side, who don't realise now that neither BoJo, Gove or Farage ever thought in a century of Sundays- that they would win- and now just don't know what to do. If you call that a conspiracy therory- so be it- the great majority believe it to be the case, and a large % now realise they have been fed lies upon lies, with the support of the Murdoch Press.

Did you forget Bosnia and Kosovo? Plenty of killing there and it wasn't that long ago either!

[Phil_MCR]

	Quote:
	the ideals of post war Europe, of a Europe that collaborates rather than kills each other.

I think that is one of the most insidiously damaging things about the EU. It seems to have brain-washed people into thinking that the EU is the only way that Europe can collaborate and work together (i.e. within a framework of law which forces countries into submission through threats or QMV and which overthrows democratically elected governments and replaces them with technocrats, or bullies governments with economic threats e.g. Ireland bailout or Brexit).

This is a sad, sad 'ideal' to have for European cooperation. I hope Brexit leads to the destruction of the EU to allow for a new Europe where countries can cooperate and collaborate out of mutual benefit, instead of fear or coercion. Where differences are valued and respected instead of considered something to be eliminated and made uniform.

Not at all- but it was an 'internal' war- but yes, reminds us how important it is to work together.

Richdog, it was Churchill who talked about the ideal of a United States of Europe.

Why couldn't work in Europe? Arizona is so different to New England, Colorado vastly different to Texas, California bears no ressemblance to Maine.

[SOBEIT]

	Quote:
	Not at all- but it was an 'internal' war- but yes, reminds us how important it is to work together.

So you agree there has been killing in your collabrative post war Europe?

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:
	... And sitting here in the comfort of our mountains, watching the charts- and for some making quite a few bob too, because disasters always benefit some - it might be too easy to forget what is happening now in the UK. Despair for some, distrust, and a massive rise in racist attacks as Farage and the results have given their hatred legitimacy. Something broke in Great Britain the other day- that may never be mended. If you don't believe that, and think the FTSE will make it all better- then I despair a bit more. ...

Odile,

The other day I watched an episode of "Life on the Dole" or something like that. It dealt specifically with disputes and difficulties arising between landlords and tenants on the dole. On the one hand I was disturbed to see how some people who apparently require medical help in an assisted living environment live, on the other I was impressed at how even handed and patient the landlords agent was.

However, what caused a feeling of revulsion was that they showed a couple of property owners whinging because they had invested in a property, sight unseen, hired a service to ensure their dealings with the tenants were arms length, and appeared to think that they had some sort of a right to make a profit, and that something needed to be done to protect their rights.

I spent a bit of time reading the war poets yesterday, and thinking of how the wrong people always end up paying the bill for the folly of the system.

I may not agree with every point you raise, but I submit to you that our sentiments are not much different.

[st2lemans]

	Quote:
	Richdog, it was Churchill who talked about the ideal of a United States of Europe. Why couldn't work in Europe? Arizona is so different to New England, Colorado vastly different to Texas, California bears no ressemblance to Maine.

And the EU works totally different than the US.

Tom

[st2lemans]

	Quote:	SOBEIT
	Did you forget Bosnia and Kosovo? Plenty of killing there and it wasn't that long ago either!

They weren't part of the EU, though.

Tom

[SOBEIT]

	Quote:	st2lemans
	They weren't part of the EU, though. Tom

Never said they were.

[idefix]

	Quote:
	And sitting here in the comfort of our mountains, watching the charts- and for some making quite a few bob too, because disasters always benefit some - it might be too easy to forget what is happening now in the UK. Despair for some, distrust, and a massive rise in racist attacks as Farage and the results have given their hatred legitimacy. Something broke in Great Britain the other day- that may never be mended. If you don't believe that, and think the FTSE will make it all better- then I despair a bit more.

Every Briton living in Switzerland and voting Leave - has every right to do so and it's only a logical choice. We live in a non EU country, surrounded by EU and we are doing much better than the EU and we have no wars. So Britain can be much better outside the EU. Leave the EU ideals to the Romanians and Bulgarians.

[idefix]

	Quote:	st2lemans
	They weren't part of the EU, though. Tom

But, don't forget, the EU invited Yugoslavia just before the war thinking they can stop it. The Yugoslav government declined the EU invitation.

Wars will happen inside or outside EU, it's human nature to fight, kill and dominate. Why do we want to stop our basic human instinct?