The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[amogles]

	Quote:	vuachère
	Bloomberg reports that Farage has quit being leader of UKIP! https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...pendence-party

That would perfectly match the view that with UKIP being a single issue party, and that goal being achieved, they can pack up and quit.

[Phil_MCR]

	Quote:	amogles
	That would perfectly match the view that with UKIP being a single issue party, and that goal being achieved, they can pack up and quit.

Whether you like him or agree with his political views, he had a goal and worked for years to achieve it: putting enough pressure on Cameron to secure a referendum and then campaigning to get a leave vote.

I guess the job isn't yet complete, as the UK hasn't left the EU, but that now rests with the government and it may be a bit early for him to pack up his bags as I am guessing that the government may need further pressure to see it through.

Political musical chairs as new lines are being drawn. Many UKIP members can return to the Conservatives. UKIP should redefine its platform and attract Labour members to cross over. And Labour can rebrand itself as the Socialist Mob Rule party, by lowering its voting membership fee to £1.99.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	vuachère
	Bloomberg reports that Farage has quit being leader of UKIP! https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...pendence-party

Yes, he's a coward and now that he's done the ugly part he'll look for some sunny, safe place.

	Quote:	greenmount
	Yes, he's a coward and now that he's done the ugly part he'll look for some sunny, safe place.

Give him some yellow paint and he can get a job on The Simpsons.

[lewton]

How is Farage a coward?
Thanks to FPTP his party only has 1 seat of 650 in the parliament.
They are absolutely irrelevant.
As a leader of that tiny (in the parliament) party, Farage had no role whatsoever in whatever is to come. His resignation is absolutely irrelevant.

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	greenmount
	Yes, he's a coward and now that he's done the ugly part he'll look for some sunny, safe place.

Greenmount,

Haven't got my OED with me at the moment, but according to

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com

a coward is:

"A person who is contemptibly lacking in the courage to do or endure dangerous or unpleasant things"

I think pretty much everyone would agree that he has quite deliberately done some dangerous and unpleasant things.

I'll give you contemptible, and raise you by deceitful, distasteful, dastardly and dislikeable, but "coward" is entirely the wrong term.

[Castro]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	Greenmount, Haven't got my OED with me at the moment, but according to http://www.oxforddictionaries.com a coward is: "A person who is contemptibly lacking in the courage to do or endure dangerous or unpleasant things" I think pretty much everyone would agree that he has quite deliberately done some dangerous and unpleasant things. I'll give you contemptible, and raise you by deceitful, distasteful, dastardly and dislikeable, but "coward" is entirely the wrong term.

I think Coward better describes Boris (see Hezza tirade)

	Quote:
	“He's like a general who leads his army to the sound of guns and at the sight of the battlefield abandoned the field. I have never seen so contemptible and irresponsible a situation.”

How does this work?

[greenmount]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	"A person who is contemptibly lacking in the courage to do or endure dangerous or unpleasant things" .

He knows very well that there will come some unpleasant things for the UK after this...exit, and people will look for who's responsible (even though he's not the only one)...so he better disappears now. He doesn't have any constructive plans after this mess, he set the house on fire and now he runs off. He knows it will be more difficult to deal with the consequences than to be a disgusting populist. (it's easy to antagonise, find common enemies etc etc. - he's a politician for goodness sake, he know all this stuff).
So yeah, coward is a good word for him too, not only for Johnson.

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	a coward is: "A person who is contemptibly lacking in the courage to do or endure dangerous or unpleasant things" I think pretty much everyone would agree that he has quite deliberately done some dangerous and unpleasant things. I'll give you contemptible, and raise you by deceitful, distasteful, dastardly and dislikeable, but "coward" is entirely the wrong term.

He is totally a coward, because he hasn't got the courage to see through what he has done, and doesn't want to endure the dangerous situation and 'unpleasant consequences he and BoJo have thrown the country into.

I add total ba*ta*d too.

[Phil_MCR]

	Quote:	lewton
	How is Farage a coward? Thanks to FPTP his party only has 1 seat of 650 in the parliament. They are absolutely irrelevant. As a leader of that tiny (in the parliament) party, Farage had no role whatsoever in whatever is to come. His resignation is absolutely irrelevant.

Agreed. He pretty much has no role left. The conservatives have already side-lined and excluded him from any further role in the Brexit negotiations with the EU - which anyway are unlikely to take place until next year. I think it is the end of UKIP.

[lewton]

	Quote:
	He is totally a coward, because he hasn't got the courage to see through what he has done, and doesn't want to endure the dangerous situation and 'unpleasant consequences he and BoJo have thrown the country into. I add total ba*ta*d too.

He doesn't have the courage to see through what he's done from what position exactly?
What office did he hold that he resigned from?

[CathHarmony]

Childish more like

Cameron, then Boris and now Farage,

What is wrong with men nowadays...

Even I feel like I have more guts than they do.

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	Cameron, then Boris and now Farage, What is wrong with men nowadays... Even I feel like I have more guts than they do.

That calls for a poll!

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	idefix
	The EU are clearly ignoring the free will of Swiss people and are not accepting their democratic decision.

EU and CH have a contract. All EU does is, they say "stick to the contract, there will not be renegotiations. Take it or leave it". What the Swiss voters want or don't want is of no concern of theirs, calling that undemocratic merely shows your ignorance or blindfoldedness.

	Quote:	marton
	European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker has denied involvement in sweetheart deals that allowed hundreds of multinationals to slash their tax bills by locating to Luxembourg, despite being prime minister of the country for almost 20 years.

Why would he have taken part in the negotiations? A politician of his caliber will do anything to avoid being part of controversial decisions of this magnitude. Doesn't mean of course he didn't know about them, or that he didn't give his Ok

[CathHarmony]

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	That calls for a poll!

hehe

one option would have to be

A Yulin dog has more guts than Boltis, Farawayge or Camerun. Stop Yulin.

What we pay these guys a hundred k a year to throw their hands up.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Reality is that there is not constitution and there is no constitutional court. The constitution is whatever the parliament or more accurately the Prime Minister says it is. Hence the idea of a sovereign parliament. The above explanation has been delivered countless times to passive citizens, but as we are now seeing it falls short of what is expected in a modern democracy.

The only problem with that is that the UK is NOT a democracy, the UK is a constitutional monarchy.

There's a reason why "British subject" used to be the term to denote a person with British citizenship: All British (if that's the correct term) are subjects of Her Majesty The Queen, no ordinary Brit is sovereign (aristocracy may be the exception, not sure).

Correct me if I'm wrong:
While de facto the parliament holds and executes the power, it does so only prerogatively, i.e. it is assumed that The Queen has passed the power onto parliament. But that is so by convention only, legally that delegating can be rescinded by His/Her Majesty's decision alone.

[hairybadger]

	Quote:	Urs Max
	The only problem with that is that the UK is NOT a democracy, the UK is a constitutional monarchy. There's a reason why "British subject" used to be the term to denote a person with British citizenship: All British (if that's the correct term) are subjects of Her Majesty The Queen, no ordinary Brit is sovereign (aristocracy may be the exception, not sure).

Tomato, tomato - subject, citizen, citoyen, who cares? Apart from a limited set of cases all Brits have been "British citizens" (look on the passport) for decades in any case. The UK may not practise direct democracy, but it is a far stretch to argue that it's less democratic than other similar nations. How about Norway or Australia, for starters? Are they undemocratic?

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	Childish more like Cameron, then Boris and now Farage, What is wrong with men nowadays... Even I feel like I have more guts than they do.

I have a lot more respect for a leader who knows when to resign, and know their participation will not further contribute to anything. I rather despise politicians who think their own personal political ambitions and their personality is the answer to all things for everyone.

So kudos to Cameron, Johnson and Farage. And boos for Gove and Corbyn, AFAIC. I think they are in it for their own egos.

	Quote:	hairybadger
	...The UK may not practise direct democracy, but it is a far stretch to argue that it's less democratic than other similar nations. How about Norway or Australia, for starters? Are they undemocratic?

IIRC neither has an unelected House of Lords which puts them a major step up from the UK. Both have propotional representation or at least a form of it which puts them another step up.

So the UK is considerably less democratic than either imo.