The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[MusicChick]

Ha! How unintelligent is it to mention "education" these days.

Safe-space check, everybody..

Replace the word "education" with "indoctrination", and I would agree with the statement:

Brexit voters are unindoctrinated.

The Azores- well that is one good thing that's come out of this mess- as we were planning to go there next Spring- hurrah.

[curley]

	Quote:	yacek
	Where does this infallibility belief in a constitutional court comes from?

Is that supposed to be an anwer?
Well, referendums are not binding, no constitution, no other "power" for the parliament to answer to ..... what exactly is democratic about GB?

Well, at least I got some answers from other sides:

	Quote:	Urs Max
	The only problem with that is that the UK is NOT a democracy, the UK is a constitutional monarchy. There's a reason why "British subject" used to be the term to denote a person with British citizenship: All British (if that's the correct term) are subjects of Her Majesty The Queen, no ordinary Brit is sovereign (aristocracy may be the exception, not sure). Correct me if I'm wrong: While de facto the parliament holds and executes the power, it does so only prerogatively, i.e. it is assumed that The Queen has passed the power onto parliament. But that is so by convention only, legally that delegating can be rescinded by His/Her Majesty's decision alone.

Thank you for the info .... nobody corrected you so I take it it was correct. "British subject" - wow

	Quote:	Urs Max
	EU and CH have a contract. All EU does is, they say "stick to the contract, there will not be renegotiations. Take it or leave it". What the Swiss voters want or don't want is of no concern of theirs, calling that undemocratic merely shows your ignorance or blindfoldedness.

Huh? Who do you think the EU has a contract with when it comes to Switzerland? Maybe all 6.1 million (2013) should show up to the negotiations next time instead of a few representatives they can walk all over. At least we would make the headlines, LOL.

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	dodgyken
	Yes - it is easier to sail up past Ireland then it is to try and get through between Ireland and France - and no one wants to edge slowly past France with just a few yards between the 2 countries in case foreign types lept aboard!

First Officer was Russian, Sparks was Dutch, First Engineer German, and the Deckhands were all Philipinos, so yes, I see the logic of trying to keep the French out.

Btw, If there are any troubles getting off the slipways, don't hesitate to call - it wouldn't be my first Great Britain launch.

[dodgyken]

	Quote:	JagWaugh
	First Officer was Russian, Sparks was Dutch, First Engineer German, and the Deckhands were all Philipinos, so yes, I see the logic of trying to keep the French out. Btw, If there are any troubles getting off the slipways, don't hesitate to call - it wouldn't be my first Great Britain launch.

My biggest concern will be how the hell people in Scarborough will react to seeing sunshine.

[MusicChick]

	Quote:	Phos
	Replace the word "education" with "indoctrination", and I would agree with the statement: Brexit voters are unindoctrinated.

I see. How about reading and writing in general. You just created space so safe it is basically void.

Why learn anything at all and have a shot at any advance, independently of what government, however indoctrinating or not, "should" offer to us.

How about being able to learn abroad, if our government is busy indoctrinating so much it provides zero chance to learn at home.

As I said, agnotology is the hottest research in the 21st century. More you know (with or w/o degree, that's an irrelevant, moot point to argue), more independent of doctrine or dogma you can get.

Well perhaps it is better to put things in simple terms, so it is clear for all, with puppets:


https://www.facebook.com/Channel4/vi...3514933337330/

	Quote:	MusicChick
	I see. How about reading and writing in general. You just created space so safe it is basically void. Why learn anything at all and have a shot at any advance, independently of what government, however indoctrinating or not, "should" offer to us. How about being able to learn abroad, if our government is busy indoctrinating so much it provides zero chance to learn at home. As I said, agnotology is the hottest research in the 21st century. More you know (with or w/o degree, that's an irrelevant, moot point to argue), more independent of doctrine or dogma you can get.

None of that has been taken away by Brexit. The UK is probably the primary globalisation catalyst in history. They pioneered globalism. To assert that they have become the most backwards inward looking people in Europe because of Brexit is a desperate assertion. Just take a look at the state of culture in mainland Europe, especially Eastern Europe, even Germany or France. That is not going to change. In fact, the UK will become even more globalised for leaving the EU, with more variety and more successful as well.

I think they can leave EU member states in the dust.

[Kosti]

	Quote:	Phos
	None of that has been taken away by Brexit. The UK is probably the primary globalisation catalyst in history. They pioneered globalism. To assert that they have become the most backwards inward looking people in Europe because of Brexit is a desperate assertion. Just take a look at the state of culture in mainland Europe, especially Eastern Europe, even Germany or France. That is not going to change. In fact, the UK will become even more globalised for leaving the EU, with more variety and more successful as well. I think they can leave EU member states in the dust.

So lets try to get this straight.
According to you, the more outward looking people in the UK voted to Leave the EU? And they did this because they want more globalisation?

Also, what culture would be "the the state of culture in mainland Europe, especially Eastern Europe, even Germany or France."?

	Quote:	Kosti
	So lets try to get this straight. According to you, the more outward looking people in the UK voted to Leave the EU? And they did this because they want more globalisation? Also, what culture would be "the the state of culture in mainland Europe, especially Eastern Europe, even Germany or France."?

Well, you got that crooked, not straight.

The idea that Brexit is for an inward looking ignorant UK is off the mark. Its a ridiculous joke to assert the EU holds a monopoly on cosmopolitism. The EU is more like training wheels for countries that lack cosmopolitism. The UK does not need it.

[Kosti]

	Quote:	Phos
	Well, you got that crooked, not straight. The idea that Brexit is for an inward looking ignorant UK is off the mark. Its a ridiculous joke to assert the EU holds a monopoly on cosmopolitism. The EU is more like training wheels for countries that lack cosmopolitism. The UK does not need it.

Great non-answer.

Pretty much standard from you, dont know why I thought it was worth a try.

[MusicChick]

It takes a bit of exposure to understand the state of culture in EE, Germany, France..restricting everybody's mobility isn't going to improve the exposure nor understanding.

[amogles]

	Quote:	dodgyken
	My biggest concern will be how the hell people in Scarborough will react to seeing sunshine.

re-open the coalmines aned send them underground.

[amogles]

	Quote:
	The Azores- well that is one good thing that's come out of this mess- as we were planning to go there next Spring- hurrah.

And while we're at it, we need to ask the Spaniards to give us Minorca back. They can have Gibralatar if they want. Good swap.

	Quote:	Kosti
	Great non-answer. Pretty much standard from you, dont know why I thought it was worth a try.

You ought to know not to ask me a fake question.

As far as a value proposition, Brexit offered more dynamism than remaining with the status quo of the EU. Choosing that dynamism over the EU is not an ignorant and uneducated choice. I realise many are struggling with this thought. But it is not the Brexit voters who are struggling with it.

[Kosti]

	Quote:	Phos
	You ought to know not to ask me a fake question. As far as a value proposition, Brexit offered more dynamism than remaining with the status quo of the EU. Choosing that dynamism over the EU is not an ignorant and uneducated choice. I realise many are struggling with this thought. But it is not the Brexit voters who are struggling with it.

Yeah, thats why London voted by almost 2/3rd to stay in the EU .... by your "logic", that would be because they wanted less dynamism and cosmopolitanism.

I just asked you a question. If you think your proposition is fake ... carry on ...

[MusicChick]

I don't see any Brexit leaders exercising this dynamism, either, to be honest.

	Quote:	Kosti
	Yeah, thats why London voted by almost 2/3rd to stay in the EU .... by your "logic", that would be because they wanted less dynamism. Carry on ...

London has been generating a lot of money with the status quo. But the UK is bigger than London. Its very myopic to believe that London's perspective should be adhered to in other parts of the country where the reality is different.

I would be willing to bet that the quality of life outside of London is leaps ahead of London. London is a ghetto in comparison to other parts of the UK I've seen. For those that live out there, they voted for the value of what they have. I know well educated, well travelled people out there who voted for Brexit.

I don't buy the argument that Brexit is a racist or xenophobic vote. People can hark on that all they want, but it will not really get them anywhere. I may agree that the vote was culturalist. Voters wanted to maintain their culture as they saw it without manipulation from disconnected foreign overlords. Even this was a smart vote I would support.

	Quote:	MusicChick
	I don't see any Brexit leaders exercising this dynamism, either, to be honest.

They are already on a campaign to line up international trade deals. They are already designing competitive corporate taxation. If you actually heard what Brexit campaigners have been saying, they've already been putting forth a vision of a dynamic, onward looking UK. But of course you likely did not notice or ignored these.