The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Capo]

	Quote:	baboon
	You mean apart from the trade agreements, regional development, agriculture, environmental protection, employment protection, human rights, transport and ensuring the running of the single market? Simple example - what was the state of UK beaches and bathing water before the EU forced the UK to clean up? Your turn. Don't forget you'll need 13 significant benefits for every 1 EU I can come up with given the disparity in numbers

You had already, and you still do, all these same public structures in all countries before the EU. And with so many regional peculiarities it's very hard to say that bureaucrats in Brussels know more about "agriculture", "transport", etc, than the people of the countries themselves. So what's the point of replicate it again?

So for you British people are so retard that, without the "EU wisdom", they would never be able to come into a consensus and clean up the beaches? Even China, who is known for being a very heavy polluting country, is becoming conscious about this problem and starting to take action.

Take the United States for example. Each state has it own legislation, some issues are very different among states, and the country as a whole is working much better than the EU.

The EU has caused much more harm than good, countries such as Italy started to get poorer after the Euro, and all these EU "benefits" as you say are nothing that regional demand would not solve.

[marton]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	So the world is wetting itself for -0.2%, thats so funny & a total joke TBH. If with a 10% drop in currency you can't sell an additional 1% you must be very incompetent. Loads of money to be made here

The link and comment was about the Eurozone so your reply does not make sense; there was no 10% drop in the euro?

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Faltrad
	Genuine question: Does that mean that UK manufacturers will have to follow EU regulations in order to sell and have no say and no part in the process of defining those regulations?

It is an interesting question and not straight forward....

UK manufacturers will have to comply with the import regulations for whichever markets they intend to export to. However there would be no need to incorporate those rules into UK legislation.

The bigger issue will be certification of goods for sale in these markets. At the moment UK goods are accepted into the single market without the need for additional certification and many EU trade agreements include the automatic acceptance of EU standards. This may well not be the case in the future and such goods may require recertification for sale in the EU and other markets....

[Odile]

	Quote:	Faltrad
	Genuine question: Does that mean that UK manufacturers will have to follow EU regulations in order to sell and have no say and no part in the process of defining those regulations? If so, the UK will have to introduce the EU regulations into UK regulations, so that the gain to leave the EU must be somewhere else. Hence my question. Note that I totally respect the leave vote and wish the UK good luck.

A very good question- and the answer is yes they will- and not they won't.

So it wasn't for that reason.

It wasn't for the 350 mio for the NHS.
It wasn't for cutting EU immigration.
It wasn't to cut down on austerity and help those 'left behind'.

So yes, keep asking- we would all like to have answers, rather than 'put up and shut up- this is democracy'

Surely the new Tory Leader should be voted for and appointed early next week. And ll recess for the Commons cancelled. The UK and its people cannot wait months whilsts MPs go off on their jollies to Europe or beyond- whilst the country is falling apart.

[baboon]

	Quote:	Capo
	So for you British people are so retard that, without the "EU wisdom", they would never be able to come into a consensus and clean up the beaches?

Well I would say the government rather than the people but otherwise yes. Surely the point is they didn't take action and had no plans to do so until forced

[marton]

Karma!
"Two weeks after Britain’s EU referendum, Europe has defied predictions that the UK’s vote to leave would inspire a surge in copycat breakaway movements, with establishment parties enjoying gains and populists dropping points in the polls.

In Germany, the Brexit aftermath has seen Angela Merkel’s popularity ratings surge to a 10-month high, almost returning to the level the chancellor enjoyed before the height of the refugee crisis last September.
An Infratest Dimap poll published on Friday also marks a two percentage point gain for Merkel’s party, the centre-right CDU, and a one point gain for the centre-left Social Democratic party.

Rightwing populist party Alternative für Deutschland, meanwhile, has seen its ratings drop by three percentage points to 11%. "

The Europeans are not so dumb that they fail to recognise Brexit is a disaster

Source ( a free newspaper for Dodgyken)

[Phos]

@Martin: So doubt a fully legitimate and official national referendum, and then give full credence to a commercial spot poll. That is sad, but funny.

It's not an overnight process. Relax and check back after some real democratic results.

[marton]

	Quote:	Capo
	You had already, and you still do, all these same public structures in all countries before the EU. And with so many regional peculiarities it's very hard to say that bureaucrats in Brussels know more about "agriculture", "transport", etc, than the people of the countries themselves. So what's the point of replicate it again? So for you British people are so retard that, without the "EU wisdom", they would never be able to come into a consensus and clean up the beaches? Even China, who is known for being a very heavy polluting country, is becoming conscious about this problem and starting to take action. Take the United States for example. Each state has it own legislation, some issues are very different among states, and the country as a whole is working much better than the EU. The EU has caused much more harm than good, countries such as Italy started to get poorer after the Euro, and all these EU "benefits" as you say are nothing that regional demand would not solve.

"The EU has caused much more harm than good," Do you have factual examples? Or is this just propaganda?

[Kosti]

	Quote:	Capo
	Take the United States for example. Each state has it own legislation, some issues are very different among states, and the country as a whole is working much better than the EU.

[Odile]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	So the world is wetting itself for -0.2%, thats so funny & a total joke TBH. If with a 10% drop in currency you can't sell an additional 1% you must be very incompetent. Loads of money to be made here

Again and again,, and again- for some people the world is just reduced to making a few bob. Tragic. One day you will realise you just can't take it with you ...

[Swisstree]

This is interesting:

"On Wednesday 6 July the European Parliament approved a proposal to turn the EU border agency Frontex into a 'European Border and Coast Guard Agency"

Not much in the news about it yet, but for this:

"Head of the Greens/EFA group in the Parliament, Ska Keller, said:

“This plan would transform FRONTEX into a border defence and deportation agency. Instead of being guided by the principle refugee protection, this new scheme would penalise EU member states that let in too many refugees or deport too few persons who have no right to stay in the EU. They could be forced to accept FRONTEX border operations against their will under threat of expulsion from Schengen. That undermines the very essence of what the EU is about.

Human rights and refugee protection are clearly an afterthought under this plan. Despite having expanded competences, FRONTEX will shamefully not be obliged to carry out more search and rescue at sea, despite the record levels of those drowning seeking to cross the Mediterranean."

[marton]

	Quote:	Odile
	A very good question- and the answer is yes they will- and not they won't. So it wasn't for that reason. It wasn't for the 350 mio for the NHS. It wasn't for cutting EU immigration. It wasn't to cut down on austerity and help those 'left behind'. So yes, keep asking- we would all like to have answers, rather than 'put up and shut up- this is democracy' Surely the new Tory Leader should be voted for and appointed early next week. And ll recess for the Commons cancelled. The UK and its people cannot wait months whilsts MPs go off on their jollies to Europe or beyond- whilst the country is falling apart.

Turns out the reason for Brexit was to frighten other countries out of holding their own referendums.
Edit; Maybe I should have written referenda?

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	Odile
	Again and again,, and again- for some people the world is just reduced to making a few bob. Tragic. One day you will realise you just can't take it with you ...

I thought I was supposed to be on your ignore list.

I know I can't take it with me, I just want to be able to give more to charity to help people less fortunate than myself. A few bob won't make a big difference even in Africa.

[st2lemans]

If the Brits really want to throw a spanner in the works, they should refuse to consider applying art. 50 for a few years.

Tom

[Phos]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	I know I can't take it with me, I just want to be able to give more to charity to help people less fortunate than myself. A few bob won't make a big difference even in Africa.

Yeah right.

If someone truly wants to help the less fortunate, they really ought to make at least a small fortune to have something to help them with.

I never heard of the less fortunate being helped by someone else pretending to whine on their behalf.

[marton]

	Quote:	dodgyken
	Marton - please learn how to selective quote - your posts are more annoying than guardian article linking remain voters.

Actually what I find really annoying are the people who post a link without any comment about the contents; I ignore these as a matter of principle.

[Odile]

From the Spectator, a great article by mathhew Paris

For the first time in my life, I feel ashamed to be British
I’ve seen a nasty side to our national character, and seen colleagues and friends pander to it in a way I never thought they would
Matthew Parris

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/f...to-be-british/

A divided society, intolerant, racist... or a few more £/$/CHF in the pockets of a few- a sick game.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	Phos
	Yeah right. If someone truly wants to help the less fortunate, they really ought to make at least a small fortune to have something to help them with. I never heard of the less fortunate being helped by someone else pretending to whine on their behalf.

At my death the majority of my estate will go for education in 3rd world countries, in places where people live on less than $1 a day. I think it will make a big difference. It's the main reason that I did not get a Swiss passport as I would loose the possibility due to forced inheritance.

What are you going to do with your money at your death?

	Quote:	Odile
	A divided society, intolerant, racist... or a few more £/$/CHF in the pockets of a few- a sick game.

Perhaps you don't realise that there are 2 sides to every transaction, 1 winner 1 loser. If you do what every else is doing you will be the loser.

[Swisstree]

	Quote:	Odile
	From the Spectator, a great article by mathhew Paris For the first time in my life, I feel ashamed to be British I’ve seen a nasty side to our national character, and seen colleagues and friends pander to it in a way I never thought they would Matthew Parris http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/f...to-be-british/ A divided society, intolerant, racist... or a few more £/$/CHF in the pockets of a few- a sick game.

Here's another from the Spectator today in praise of leave..

[Odile]

Sorry, can't hear you

(Note to self, don't look at EF before logging on).