The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Wallabies]

	Quote:	marton
	Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are ready to veto any Brexit deal that would limit their citizens’ rights to work in Britain, Slovak prime minister Robert Fico said today. Source also published in many other newspapers¨ The elephant in this room is that although May said she will keep the UK negotiation position secret and will not make regular reports on the status of negotiations it seems that many of the 27 countries involved will be happy to provide all this info You could not make this stuff up!

Well any member of the EU is allowed to know any deal Britain wants to make with the EU so the idea of secrecy on deals with the EU are worthless.

[MusicChick]

	Quote:	marton
	Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are ready to veto any Brexit deal that would limit their citizens’ rights to work in Britain, Slovak prime minister Robert Fico said today. Source also published in many other newspapers¨ The elephant in this room is that although May said she will keep the UK negotiation position secret and will not make regular reports on the status of negotiations it seems that many of the 27 countries involved will be happy to provide all this info You could not make this stuff up!

Yep, Visegrad 4. They mean it.

[Blueangel]

I've been back in the UK for 25hrs now, and have already been for drinks with one of my 3 closest friends who broke the news that he's being made redundant in January. The multi-nation company where he's worked for the last 16yrs are merging their UK operations with their South African branches because that country has an existing trade deal with the EU, and they can pay the new workers peanuts by comparison to the UK.

What do you say to someone with a mortgage and four kids whose employer is citing the impending invoking of Article 50 and Brexit as their reason for closing down their UK operations?

[me.anon]

	Quote:	marton
	Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are ready to veto any Brexit deal that would limit their citizens’ rights to work in Britain, Slovak prime minister Robert Fico said today. Source also published in many other newspapers¨ . . .

Who knows. By the time this whole mess is over, it'll be British workers who'll be wanting free movement to Eastern Europe to better their prospects.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Some more highlights: "We Europeans can never accept Polish workers being beaten up, harassed or even murdered in the streets of Essex" Although we'll happily accept European women being raped in the streets of Cologne.

"Although we'll happily accept European women being raped in the streets of Cologne" The title of this thread is about Brexit; how is your comment related to Brexit

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	This thread seems to have gone full Grauniad for the last few pages. Every day another story on why Brexit is the end of the world. Here's some advice. Get over it. You're starting to sound like a desperate guy who can't get over the fact his girlfriend has dumped him. It's not going to change anything.

Instead of attacking other EF members who are simply posting facts why don't you simply post the latest good news about Brexit?

Meanwhile in the real world
"EU countries in scramble to ‘steal’ UK-based research centres!

European commission under pressure to move flagship projects to rival cities, says ex-president Romano Prodi, who led the commission between 1999 and 2004.

The leaders of two major UK based organisations voiced their fears over the future; the European medicines agency and the EU’s flagship nuclear research project called the Joint European Torus.

The European Banking Authority, based in London’s Canary Wharf financial district, also faces an uncertain future.

Norman Lamb, a minister until last year, said that the development would be a “hammer blow” for British jobs and research. “While the divided Tory government struggles to find a workable plan for Brexit, other European countries are already fighting over the spoils.”

Source

None of these concerns are new but the situation now seems to be solidifying into real risks for the UK.

[marton]

	Quote:	Phos
	Looking at the EU's success rate in solving real problems, the old formula of simply making a magnanimous speech has stopped functioning a long time ago. This leaves me to believe that these problems Juncker is finally acknowledging really won't be getting fixed either. In fact, it may portend that their biggest fears will likely occur.

Interesting that mostly the Remainers simply post facts about the impact of Brexit while the Leavers usually post opinions about how the Remainers are moaning and the EU is failing without quoting any factual support.

Posts about the positive results of Brexit would be very welcome

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	What do you say to someone with a mortgage and four kids whose employer is citing the impending invoking of Article 50 and Brexit as their reason for closing down their UK operations?

Given that it will take a few years negotiate trade deals and then a few more for companies to establish themselves in the market place under that deal, he could be facing a decade of unemployment benefits! So I suggest not being too picky about what job he can get, but if at all possible try to get employment with a locally owned company.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I've been back in the UK for 25hrs now, and have already been for drinks with one of my 3 closest friends who broke the news that he's being made redundant in January. The multi-nation company where he's worked for the last 16yrs are merging their UK operations with their South African branches because that country has an existing trade deal with the EU, and they can pay the new workers peanuts by comparison to the UK. What do you say to someone with a mortgage and four kids whose employer is citing the impending invoking of Article 50 and Brexit as their reason for closing down their UK operations?

As you said they can operate with lower salaries so it would have hammered sooner or later, business's are like that.

Sadly jobs are no longer for life, 16 years is pretty good.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are ready to veto any Brexit deal that would limit their citizens’ rights to work in Britain, Slovak prime minister Robert Fico said today. Source also published in many other newspapers¨ The elephant in this room is that although May said she will keep the UK negotiation position secret and will not make regular reports on the status of negotiations it seems that many of the 27 countries involved will be happy to provide all this info You could not make this stuff up!

The Visegrád 4 are presently looking out for their own interests, not those of Merkel or Junker. Right now the political rift between Germany and the Visegrád is deeper than the rift between any of those countries and the U.K for precisely the reasons that on another thread you are being an apologist for. And if the Visegrád 4 are going to do any back stabbing it's either going to be because it's in their own interest or because they get some massive concession from Germany in return. Neither scenario strengthens the EU

So basically you're rejoicing that the EU is saved because other people are unhappy too? Really?

[marton]

	Quote:	amogles
	The Visegrád 4 are presently looking out for their own interests, not those of Merkel or Junker. Right now the political rift between Germany and the Visegrád is deeper than the rift between any of those countries and the U.K for precisely the reasons that on another thread you are being an apologist for. And if the Visegrád 4 are going to do any back stabbing it's either going to be because it's in their own interest or because they get some massive concession from Germany in return. Neither scenario strengthens the EU So basically you're rejoicing that the EU is saved because other people are unhappy too? Really?

Of course every country is looking out for their own interests; nothing new there!

Was I rejoicing? I thought I was quoting facts?

Can you explain your statement "the EU is saved" due to the Visegrád 4? My conclusion is the opposite?

	Quote:	marton
	Hungary, Poland, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are ready to veto any Brexit deal that would limit their citizens’ rights to work in Britain, Slovak prime minister Robert Fico said today.

So, these are the states that will be pushing hard for a good UK deal after Article 50. Article 50, they can't do anything about.

	Quote:	marton
	Posts about the positive results of Brexit would be very welcome

Brexit was the UK's Independence Day. Congratulation!!!

[marton]

	Quote:	Phos
	Brexit was the UK's Independence Day. Congratulation!!!

And all failing since then

[Sbrinz]

Why should the PM discuss her ideas and options with the British press? When you negotiate you don't tell the other party your strengths and weaknesses do you?

It's more a result of frustrated news editors with nothing to fill their pages.

On TV today was a minister of Finland who carefully explained that he thinks it will take the UK 10 years to unravel the relationship: there are thousands of laws to remake. There could be a bumpy road ahead, especially as Brexiters have no ideas, and no co-ordinated plans on what to do, except "Make it up as you go along." Mrs May has taken on the poisoned chalice, and I don't think there will be a happy ending to this disaster.

On another theme, I think it was very bad of Donald Fisk to blabber that he knows Theresa May will operate EU clause 50 in January or February 2017. If something comes up in the meantime, and the UK changes it's mind, anouncing a change of the date would cause another rumpuss.

[marton]

	Quote:	Sbrinz
	Why should the PM discuss her ideas and options with the British press? When you negotiate you don't tell the other party your strengths and weaknesses do you? It's more a result of frustrated news editors with nothing to fill their pages. On TV today was a minister of Finland who carefully explained that he thinks it will take the UK 10 years to unravel the relationship: there are thousands of laws to remake. There could be a bumpy road ahead, especially as Brexiters have no ideas, and no co-ordinated plans on what to do, except "Make it up as you go along." Mrs May has taken on the poisoned chalice, and I don't think there will be a happy ending to this disaster. On another theme, I think it was very bad of Donald Fisk to blabber that he knows Theresa May will operate EU clause 50 in January or February 2017. If something comes up in the meantime, and the UK changes it's mind, anouncing a change of the date would cause another rumpuss.

"When you negotiate you don't tell the other party your strengths and weaknesses do you?" Unusually in this negotiation the strengths and weaknesses of both sides are very well known and publicised.
I doubt the UK have any positive surprises to pull out of the hat but I would be happy if they do.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	So I suggest not being too picky about what job he can get, but if at all possible try to get employment with a locally owned company.

Thanks Jim. That's exactly what I told him to do to preserve the redundancy nest egg as best as he can.

Luckily and thankfully, he's been approached by a mutual friend to consider working for our town's youth centre, which is sponsored by the local sports teams and major manufacturers. We've also been told that a huge number of youth centres are frantically searching for sponsors because they're currently in receipt of EU funding.

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	As you said they can operate with lower salaries so it would have hammered sooner or later, business's are like that. Sadly jobs are no longer for life, 16 years is pretty good.

Agreed.
What surprises me with this particular move is that they're a Worldwide logistics company and a household name with approx half a million employees, but looking at their recent track record r.e. redundancies, there's a definite move to change their UK bases to skeleton staffing or closure.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Sbrinz
	Why should the PM discuss her ideas and options with the British press? When you negotiate you don't tell the other party your strengths and weaknesses do you?

Agreed in principle, but I take serious issue with this supposed tactic, when details are published in European media before even our own government have been advised.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Phos
	So, these are the states that will be pushing hard for a good UK deal after Article 50.

Actually they're the guarantee that it will be either EEA+FMOP or neither. As I recall getting rid of FMOP was a cornerstone of the Leave campaign as well as you.

[marton]

	Quote:	Phos
	So, these are the states that will be pushing hard for a good UK deal after Article 50. Article 50, they can't do anything about.

Um NO! These are exactly the States that will be pushing for a hard Brexit that keeps the FMOP intact and the opposite of a good UK deal!.

Visegrád 4 are the those States that want and need to keep FMOP which is exactly opposite to the Brexit demands. Sigh...!