The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH - Page 338

Sbrinz · #**6741** 19.11.2016, 13:08

I agree, the UK must call Article 50 in a proper legal way. 10 Downing Street should not be making enormous changes to British lives on a 48/52 majority.

With everything that has come to light since June, I am sure many people would vote differently today. But we should let the MPs discuss and decide as in most civilised countries.

Mikers · #**6742** 19.11.2016, 13:23

	Quote:	Sbrinz
	With everything that has come to light since June, I am sure many people would vote differently today. But we should let the MPs discuss and decide as in most civilised countries.

There's really a lot of people - an amazing amount in fact - who are "sure" that if you had the referendum today then the decision would be reversed. Just ask Nicola Sturgeon, who is also "Sure" that Scottish people would vote for Independence if asked now.

Swarms of people are "certain" its economic doom and "know" that the UK is giving Nissan a financial back hander.

It's more than evident from the deafening noise that people who voted leave clearly didn't understand what they were doing, or are just against foreigners, or want to reverse their decision because they were "lied" to. And lets not take their word for it, lest we not be sure, it is always the people who voted Remain and are upset that are "absolutely certain" that people who voted leave are now regretting it and feeling they were cheated. Not, you might note, the actual Leavers themselves.

The complex methodology of Sovereign Power or something like that, I tend to get a bit lost, means even thought the Government said this was a Referendum they would act on, they can't. And to "make things better" for everyone a City Hedge Fund manager has ensured that it went to court "just so that due process is followed".

The European Parliamentary leaders themselves of course want to make an example of Britain. Make them suffer. Because that'll teach 'em. Bugger the economies, lets show them whose boss. Of course when your minted up to the eyeballs on the EU political circuit, making countries suffer seems like quite a nice idea, its not going to mean a direct reduction in your own Wine Cellar now is it ? poor people ? Well they should have done a bit of research into it and voted the other way.

And most of all, as has been said, its the desire for failure that is most disappointing. The swathes of people from EF, to Towns, to Political Parties, who absolutely want this to fail. Who are looking forward to the tariff's coming in so they can jump up and down with glee chanting "look! look! Your not so clever now are you ? where's your 350 million now eh poor Northern twat ?".

This thing is like a game of football. If Britain goes in with confidence, we might come out with a successful result. If we go in thinking we are going to lose, we will. But there are so many people who are just desperate to see it fall then you have to wonder if it will ever work, because if you head out onto the pitch and half your own team are playing against you as well as the opposition, you've got a big ask on your hands.

#**6743** 19.11.2016, 13:36

	Quote:	Mikers
	The European Parliamentary leaders themselves of course want to make an example of Britain. Make them suffer. Because that'll teach 'em. Bugger the economies, lets show them whose boss.

Or maybe they are unwilling to lot the UK share the benefits of membership without paying the price. And why should they?

Mikers · #**6744** 19.11.2016, 13:42

	Quote:
	Or maybe they are unwilling to lot the UK share the benefits of membership without paying the price. And why should they?

Because it is what businesses want ?

#**6745** 19.11.2016, 13:47

	Quote:	Mikers
	Because it is what businesses want ?

British businesses didn't want Brexit. But they've been stuffed with it all the same.

Mikers · #**6746** 19.11.2016, 13:54

	Quote:
	British businesses didn't want Brexit. But they've been stuffed with it all the same.

Except these ones of course. But then again, you can speak for them I'm sure.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...back-a-brexit/

Britething · #**6747** 19.11.2016, 13:58

	Quote:	Medea Fleecestealer
	23rd June - in case you missed it. Leave the European Union 17,410,742 51.89%

Sorry, but 51.89% is hardly what I call massive !!
(Out of 72% of the voting population.)

Mikers · #**6748** 19.11.2016, 14:10

	Quote:	Britething
	Sorry, but 51.89% is hardly what I call massive !! (Out of 72% of the voting population.)

Perhaps we should rerun it. Except this time it can be like a sliding scale.

52/48 - Continue as before because at least 2% were too thick to understand what they were doing.
60/40 - Try and put a cap on some immigration but make a bit flowery and say like after 10 years. Stay in the single market except for Croissants.
70/30 - Put a cap on immigration at 2 years, 6 months if your Italian perhaps. Single Market for Cars and Finance, Tarrifs for Toblorone, Maltersers and Prusecco.
80/20 - Hard cap on immigration from EU, tarriffs abound, everything up 5% except anything going direct to Brussles EU HQ.
90/10 - no immigration, block up the channel tunnel, one sailing to europe per week. No trade with anyone beyond France (and not cheese).

this way, everyone gets the results they want, which is no result really because however we vote, loads of people will be unhappy. the whole thing was a mistake from the start and should never have been even begun.

#**6749** 19.11.2016, 14:17

	Quote:	Mikers
	Except these ones of course. But then again, you can speak for them I'm sure. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...back-a-brexit/

Of course there were exceptions. But the vast majority thought otherwise.

"a YouGov poll found that senior executives at big businesses prefer to remain in the EU by an overwhelming majority of 93% to 7%"

Mikers · #**6750** 19.11.2016, 14:37

	Quote:
	Of course there were exceptions. But the vast majority thought otherwise. "a YouGov poll found that senior executives at big businesses prefer to remain in the EU by an overwhelming majority of 93% to 7%"

which they would obviously. Big Business benefits massively from EU (and Global) structures to make themselves more competitive. so you would expect them to want to remain.

Smaller Businesses were more evenly split.

So depends on how you see that.

Britething · #**6751** 19.11.2016, 14:47

	Quote:	Mikers
	Perhaps we should rerun it. Except this time it can be like a sliding scale. 52/48 - Continue as before because at least 2% were too thick to understand what they were doing. 60/40 - Try and put a cap on some immigration but make a bit flowery and say like after 10 years. Stay in the single market except for Croissants. 70/30 - Put a cap on immigration at 2 years, 6 months if your Italian perhaps. Single Market for Cars and Finance, Tarifs for Toblerone, Maltesers and Prusecco. 80/20 - Hard cap on immigration from EU, tariffs abound, everything up 5% except anything going direct to Brussles EU HQ. 90/10 - no immigration, block up the channel tunnel, one sailing to europe per week. No trade with anyone beyond France (and not cheese). this way, everyone gets the results they want, which is no result really because however we vote, loads of people will be unhappy. The whole thing was a mistake from the start and should never have been even begun.

Perhaps you heard about the following? 4.1 million people signed it.
"The petition, which was set up by a Brexit supporter before the referendum was held, had called for the Government to annul the results if the Remain or Leave vote won by less than 60 per cent on a turnout of less than 75 per cent."

I agree with you on one point though, this business should never have been started. Bloody Cameron had no inkling of the Pandora's box he was about to open, because he was far too cocky and sure of himself. He thought he'd shut the traps of all the far-right wingers instead of which he unleashed a plague.

Hmm, like HC in that respect, then, I suppose.

Mikers · #**6752** 19.11.2016, 14:52

	Quote:	Britething
	Perhaps you heard about the following? 4.1 million people signed it. "The petition, which was set up by a Brexit supporter before the referendum was held, had called for the Government to annul the results if the Remain or Leave vote won by less than 60 per cent on a turnout of less than 75 per cent." I agree with you on one point though, this business should never have been started. Bloody Cameron had no inkling of the Pandora's box he was about to open, because he was far too cocky and sure of himself. He thought he'd shut the traps of all the far-right wingers instead of which he unleashed a plague. Hmm, like HC in that respect, then, I suppose.

yes so a small percentage of people who thought leave would lose were in fact wrong and they won. The Government who thought remain would win then lost and floundered around until someone who had said they supported remain but probably supported leave took charge and then definitely said we would leave her way while the people who had supported leave left, then came back (as foreign secretary). While the opposition who said they supported remain but were led by someone who supported leave really but wouldnt admit it dissolved into in-fighting, had a leadership contest, which was won by the same man who reiterated that he wanted to remain, but in a changed europe. something the former prime minister, who packed off and left when the result came in, had shown couldnt be done.

Urs Max · #**6753** 19.11.2016, 14:56

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	I went into Poundland last week, normal Tobleronr being sold at a discount price, obvioulely sourced abroad.

As Sandgrounder suggests, could be stock clearing.

Or perhaps you didn't check the right products as only two will be affected: 400g reduced to 360g and 170g to 150g while the packaging remains the same (though certainly the printed weight, if any, will be adjusted). Or perhaps you were just early, IIRC the news releases didn't give an "effective as of" date.

marton · #**6754** 19.11.2016, 15:10

	Quote:	Mikers
	There's really a lot of people - an amazing amount in fact - who are "sure" that if you had the referendum today then the decision would be reversed. Just ask Nicola Sturgeon, who is also "Sure" that Scottish people would vote for Independence if asked now. Swarms of people are "certain" its economic doom and "know" that the UK is giving Nissan a financial back hander. It's more than evident from the deafening noise that people who voted leave clearly didn't understand what they were doing, or are just against foreigners, or want to reverse their decision because they were "lied" to. And lets not take their word for it, lest we not be sure, it is always the people who voted Remain and are upset that are "absolutely certain" that people who voted leave are now regretting it and feeling they were cheated. Not, you might note, the actual Leavers themselves. The complex methodology of Sovereign Power or something like that, I tend to get a bit lost, means even thought the Government said this was a Referendum they would act on, they can't. And to "make things better" for everyone a City Hedge Fund manager has ensured that it went to court "just so that due process is followed". The European Parliamentary leaders themselves of course want to make an example of Britain. Make them suffer. Because that'll teach 'em. Bugger the economies, lets show them whose boss. Of course when your minted up to the eyeballs on the EU political circuit, making countries suffer seems like quite a nice idea, its not going to mean a direct reduction in your own Wine Cellar now is it ? poor people ? Well they should have done a bit of research into it and voted the other way. And most of all, as has been said, its the desire for failure that is most disappointing. The swathes of people from EF, to Towns, to Political Parties, who absolutely want this to fail. Who are looking forward to the tariff's coming in so they can jump up and down with glee chanting "look! look! Your not so clever now are you ? where's your 350 million now eh poor Northern twat ?". This thing is like a game of football. If Britain goes in with confidence, we might come out with a successful result. If we go in thinking we are going to lose, we will. But there are so many people who are just desperate to see it fall then you have to wonder if it will ever work, because if you head out onto the pitch and half your own team are playing against you as well as the opposition, you've got a big ask on your hands.

I am interested to know why you reference "The European Parliamentary leaders" rather than the EU Commission or the "27 States".

Mikers · #**6755** 19.11.2016, 15:22

	Quote:	marton
	I am interested to know why you reference "The European Parliamentary leaders" rather than the EU Commission or the "27 States".

Are you really that interested Marton ? Or could it be the wild idea that you will tell me that I'm referring to the wrong person or title or that its really the Walloons who hold the power or whoever it is.

I mean the politician bloke on the telly who said he would make Britain suffer. Almost certainly French or Belgian.

#**6756** 19.11.2016, 15:30

Apparently....:

	Quote:	Mikers
	The European Parliamentary leaders themselves of course want to make an example of Britain. Make them suffer.

is in reality one politician bloke:

	Quote:	Mikers
	I mean the politician bloke on the telly who said he would make Britain suffer. Almost certainly French or Belgian.

So which is it?

aSwissInTheUS · #**6757** 19.11.2016, 15:40

	Quote:
	So which is it?

Could also be Italian. Maybe Carlo Calenda.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...exit-and-pros/

Mikers · #**6758** 19.11.2016, 15:41

	Quote:
	Apparently....: is in reality one politician bloke: So which is it?

its a piece of humour, but I think that might have passed you by. Numerous people within the structure of the EU have said at various points over the past two months that they want to be as aggressive as possible towards the negotiation procedures so that no precedence is set and will deter other members from leaving, regardless of the potential negative financial impact on inter-country or inter-regional trading arrangements.

So thats it, if you have to have it spelled out word for word.

marton · #**6759** 19.11.2016, 15:44

	Quote:	Mikers
	Are you really that interested Marton ? Or could it be the wild idea that you will tell me that I'm referring to the wrong person or title or that its really the Walloons who hold the power or whoever it is. I mean the politician bloke on the telly who said he would make Britain suffer. Almost certainly French or Belgian.

I am interested in case you are one of the many people supporting Brexit who did not really understand how the EU they are rejecting actually works. Consequently the rejection was due to some basic misconceptions about some all powerful entity who controlled everything.

"its really the Walloons who hold the power" Indeed it is true the EU powers are shared and there are many parliaments with the power to veto decisions so there is no single person holding power!
Except when UK leaves the EU we will no longer have the power to veto decisions even if they effect us!

Sbrinz · #**6760** 19.11.2016, 15:58

A warning was given 5 days before the referendum,

However, the two most influential politicians in the EU – Chancellor Angela Merkel and President François Hollande – are minded to make Britain suffer.
They see this as an act not of revenge but of self-preservation.

Saturday 18 June 2016, Independent newspaper,

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7089296.html