The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Aeneas]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	It's reflected in what someone will pay for the land, the buyer is paying for future cash flow.

I already addressed this in my penultimate post, how the even the study you took your graph from disagrees with your conclusion. Address that, rather than repeat the same debunked nonsense.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Medea Fleecestealer
	I can understand, but for people applying for permanent residency? That means they've been in the UK for at least 5 years doesn't it? Hardly newly resident.

The directive states one is only entitled to residency if one has established economic viability. If you have never worked and contributed to NI I guess it is a concern.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	This has nothing to do with Brexit. Same that Dutch woman from last week. It's just standard procedure for issuing a passport. This is just the Graun doing it's Mail Online bit.

It has everything to do with Brexit.

They want to obtain formal authorisation to stay in the UK, in case Brexit deprives them of this residence right.

It is not just the Guardian; it was also reported in Swiss newspapers.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	marton
	It has everything to do with Brexit. They want to obtain formal authorisation to stay in the UK, in case Brexit deprives them of this residence right. It is not just the Guardian; it was also reported in Swiss newspapers.

So it's brexits doing that this person has not followed the U.K. Residency application process correctly ?

Let's take another spin. Say Remain had won but this guy fancies becoming British formally after all these years, but fails for the same reasons (as his failure is purely in the application process). Would that be due to Remain ?

In other news, the driest Swiss December on record has also been firmly linked to brexit.

[marton]

	Quote:	Mikers
	So it's brexits doing that this person has not followed the U.K. Residency application process correctly ? Let's take another spin. Say Remain had won but this guy fancies becoming British formally after all these years, but fails for the same reasons (as his failure is purely in the application process). Would that be due to Remain ? In other news, the driest Swiss December on record has also been firmly linked to brexit.

If Remain had won then you would not have had a flood of people concerned for their future so being driven to applying for UK citizenship and discovering the rules are crap.

Or to put it another way; if Remain had won and this guy fancies becoming British formally after all these years and then he found the rules were crap there would be no risk that he has to move to a country he never lived in and possibly does not even speak the language.

	Quote:	marton
	a country he never lived in and possibly does not even speak the language.

You mean the country of which he's actually a citizen?

If being British is so important to him he can go through the naturalisation process like anyone else has to.

This is a total non-story. He isn't British unless he forks out and puts some effort into it.

	Quote:
	This is a total non-story. He isn't British unless he forks out and puts some effort into it.

I have a British passport despite only putting in around half the effort he did (left after 23 years) and contributing very little after a couple of years of tax on a graduate salary.

[Medea Fleecestealer]

	Quote:
	I have a British passport despite only putting in around half the effort he did (left after 23 years) and contributing very little after a couple of years of tax on a graduate salary.

It's not a question of what effort he's put in or not. It's entirely about whether his parents were here legally at the time of his birth. If he/they can't prove that they were then he's not going to be a British citizen. I find it strange that a) the government organisations don't seem to have any info that would help and even more so that b) neither do the parents. Have they no copies of tax returns, employment payslips, etc?

	Quote:	Medea Fleecestealer
	It's not a question of what effort he's put in or not. It's entirely about whether his parents were here legally at the time of his birth. If he/they can't prove that they were then he's not going to be a British citizen. I find it strange that a) the government organisations don't seem to have any info that would help and even more so that b) neither do the parents. Have they no copies of tax returns, employment payslips, etc?

It doesn't really matter if they were in England legally or not: citizenship by birth on British soil had already been abolished when he was born. He simply isn't British.

[lewton]

	Quote:
	It doesn't really matter if they were in England legally or not: citizenship by birth on British soil had already been abolished when he was born. He simply isn't British.

I totally agree and I don't understand why they would want to stay there anyway (except if they are in Scotland, I would love to live in Scotland, it's beautiful like Switzerland and cool like Germany).

[marton]

The founder of Italy’s populist Five Star Movement (M5S) has asked members to vote on splitting from a Eurosceptic bloc of MEPs co-chaired by Nigel Farage.

Beppe Grillo, a comedian turned politician, said in a post on his blog that since Farage had led Ukip to Britain voting to leave the EU, the two parties no longer shared common goals.

Source

So much for Italy leaving the EU, not!

[Aeneas]

Most eurosceptism in Italy tends to focus on opposition to the Euro, not the EU itself. Indeed were you to ask the average Italian how they would view loss of sovereignty from Rome to Brussels, they'd likely welcome it.

[lewton]

	Quote:	marton
	The founder of Italy’s populist Five Star Movement (M5S) has asked members to vote on splitting from a Eurosceptic bloc of MEPs co-chaired by Nigel Farage. Beppe Grillo, a comedian turned politician, said in a post on his blog that since Farage had led Ukip to Britain voting to leave the EU, the two parties no longer shared common goals. Source So much for Italy leaving the EU, not!

Grillo never proposed leaving the EU, only the Eurozone. Or if he did at some point (that I don't know of), he quickly clarified that he only wants Italy to leave the Eurozone.
Which by the way makes perfect sense, given that the Euro is not working for them, but on the other hand EU membership has benefited Italy a lot.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	lewton
	Which by the way makes perfect sense, given that the Euro is not working for them, but on the other hand EU membership has benefited Italy a lot.

I always find this kind of statement amusing because it makes absolutely no sense what so ever. This idea that somehow if you have control of a current you can fix an economy is the stuff fairy tales are made of. There is not a single example of a country able to use their currency to fix a FUed economy. Just as with Greece, if you have screwed up economy and fail to take the steps of fix it, it really does not matter if your using monopoly money, it is not going to change things.

[Aeneas]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	I always find this kind of statement amusing because it makes absolutely no sense what so ever.

Well it oes make sense, just not a huge amount of sense. For years, Italy used devaluation repeatedly as a means to make exports competitive and thus quicken the economy. Additionally when transitioning to the Euro Italy suffered inflation as Italian business sought to take advantage on consumers by in many cases doubling prices (you'd find that a pizza and a Cola would cost 10.000 L one day then 10 € the next).

However the former is only one tool in the macroeconomic toolbox and the latter isn't going to change if Italy readopted the Lira. Real problem for Italy is not the Euro but globalization - countries like China developed and were able to produce traditional Italian goods such as shoes and clothing at a fraction of the price Italians were and destroyed the backbone of the Italian economy.

Remember that "hate crime" in Harlow where everyone was jumping on the Brexit hate bandwagon, including Junker?

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/world...-a3344651.html

Well a 15 year old is in court for manslaughter. No hate crime. This isn't making as many headlines through.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-38532563

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Remember that "hate crime" in Harlow where everyone was jumping on the Brexit hate bandwagon, including Junker? http://www.standard.co.uk/news/world...-a3344651.html Well a 15 year old is in court for manslaughter. No hate crime. This isn't making as many headlines through. http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-38532563

So where does the BBC article say it is or isn't a hate crime? Absolutely nothing in there one way or the other.

	Quote:
	So where does the BBC article say it is or isn't a hate crime? Absolutely nothing in there one way or the other.

Just for you:

NO HATE CRIME CHARGE 15-year-old boy hit with manslaughter rap over Harlow death of ‘hard-working’ Pole Arkadiusz Jozwik outside shops

[lewton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Just for you: NO HATE CRIME CHARGE 15-year-old boy hit with manslaughter rap over Harlow death of ‘hard-working’ Pole Arkadiusz Jozwik outside shops

So a hate crime is not treated as a hate crime and this makes you happy?

[marton]

	Quote:	Aeneas
	Well it oes make sense, just not a huge amount of sense. For years, Italy used devaluation repeatedly as a means to make exports competitive and thus quicken the economy. Additionally when transitioning to the Euro Italy suffered inflation as Italian business sought to take advantage on consumers by in many cases doubling prices (you'd find that a pizza and a Cola would cost 10.000 L one day then 10 € the next). However the former is only one tool in the macroeconomic toolbox and the latter isn't going to change if Italy readopted the Lira. Real problem for Italy is not the Euro but globalization - countries like China developed and were able to produce traditional Italian goods such as shoes and clothing at a fraction of the price Italians were and destroyed the backbone of the Italian economy.

"countries like China developed and were able to produce traditional Italian goods such as shoes and clothing at a fraction of the price " This would be exactly the problem UK would face if we went to a "duty free" approach.

Example Chinese industries;
Chinas top exports are Electronic equipment followed by Machines, engines, pumps

Vehicles
Beijing Automotive Industry Holding Co., Ltd makes Hyundai and Mercedes
Chery Automobile Co., Ltd produces Jaguar and Land Rover cars in China
BYD is the world's second largest electric car manufacturer.

China now produces 50% of World steel