The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[amogles]

	Quote:	McTAVGE
	I don't see France or Germany blaming the EU for interfering with their decisions on how their public transport systems operate.

Maybe that's because we're just about the only country that follows EU directives to the letter. Yet the other countries think we're having it good with lots of tailor made exceptions.

[amogles]

	Quote:	McTAVGE
	Soon, they'll have to own up to everything they mess up, no one will be left to blame!

I think we both agree on that point.

Only you see it as negative and I see it as positive.

[McTAVGE]

	Quote:	amogles
	Maybe that's because we're just about the only country that follows EU directives to the letter. Yet the other countries think we're having it good with lots of tailor made exceptions.

Well, very soon the U.K. shall have the high moral grounds all to itself!

[marton]

	Quote:	amogles
	Which is more or less what they are already doing. This is why there are contracts and targets in place that are enforced by bonus malus payments. Of course operators always seek ways of circumventing those, just as the franchiser seeks to tighten the rules to prevent that, but again, this is not restricted to foreign owned-owned companies. I don't see how a post Brext scenario would induce them to screw the passenger or franchiser any more than they already do now.

One possibility is that the £ exchange rate will be lower so they deliver less profit home which in term pushes them to further cut costs or raise fares or in the worst case pull out of a franchise that nobody else is interested in taking over.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	One possibility is that the £ exchange rate will be lower so they deliver less profit home which in term pushes them to further cut costs or raise fares or in the worst case pull out of a franchise that nobody else is interested in taking over.

Lots of maybes and speculation here.

In fact any franchise agreement has a certain risk that the franchisee will be unable to fulfil their obligations.

As for nobody else being interested in UK franchises, the very fact that so many foreign companies are competing for UK franchises indicates that they are attractive. And as the costs are largely local (salaries payed in UK currency, equipment leased in UK currency, track usage charges in UK currency etc) I don't think the currency exposure is especially great.

Alao, despite what the panic mongers will tell us, there are also plenty of UK companies running foreign franchises. So if there's going to be tit for tat vengeance, it's going to get messy for everybody. But these are businesses, and they're about profit, not politics, so I expect their reaction to be rational.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	amogles
	Maybe that's because we're just about the only country that follows EU directives to the letter. Yet the other countries think we're having it good with lots of tailor made exceptions.

No what you have is a government and a civil service that purposefully select the most complex option possible when selecting the method of implementation. Agricultural subsidies being a classic offering several possible options, 27 took the simple format and one took the complex one, guess who??? The result is that UK farmers have seen their subsidies delayed on a regular basis, while farmers through out the rest of the EU receive payments on time. But of course it is the EU's fault!!!!

[Spinal]

A question.

Isn't the EU run by our politicians? I.E. those people we vote for, as UK citizens? So any decisions made by the EU are those made by those we have elected to govern us?

Or am I missing something?

[Odile]

Indeed- not the fault of the EU if the turn out for European elections has been so meagre in the UK.

An increasing number of people are becoming very aware they have been fraudulently lied to. In fact, if some of the promises they made were looked at by the Trades Description Act, be they for financial services, any services or goods- would land the Leave Campaign, including the Government, with massive fines for fraud- the sale cancelled, compensation given, and even prison. How can anyone ever trust politicians again, who get away with it.

Now, can anyone give me a list of any of the promises made by Leave and the Government during the campaign, which the have fulfilled? Or even intend to fulfill. Like 'no-one is talking about leaving the single market'?

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Spinal
	Isn't the EU run by our politicians? I.E. those people we vote for, as UK citizens? So any decisions made by the EU are those made by those we have elected to govern us?

Close but not the full story... You also vote for MEP - Members of the European Parliament, you know the one you keeps sending UKIP too. They have the final decision in many areas including the BREXIT agreement.

[pdofr]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	No what you have is a government and a civil service that purposefully select the most complex option possible when selecting the method of implementation. Agricultural subsidies being a classic offering several possible options, 27 took the simple format and one took the complex one, guess who??? The result is that UK farmers have seen their subsidies delayed on a regular basis, while farmers through out the rest of the EU receive payments on time. But of course it is the EU's fault!!!!

December 2015: MPs slam gov heads over 'childishness' on failed farmer IT project

February 2017: Brexit could further harm woeful rural payments system - But we won't have to pay fines to Europe for being crap...

[pdofr]

	Quote:	Odile
	However it is great to know Brexiteers have their top priorities absolutely spot on to save the UK: https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...b3&oe=59905D7D

Blue passports, eh? I remember those as being just that bit too bulky to fit into my jacket inside pocket in comfort.

But they might provide the extra pages to cover all those stamps that a post-Brexit traveller might accumulate when travelling around Europe.

	Quote:	pdofr
	December 2015: MPs slam gov heads over 'childishness' on failed farmer IT project February 2017: Brexit could further harm woeful rural payments system - But we won't have to pay fines to Europe for being crap...

I never understood why the State, EU or otherwise, should have to pay to keep fat fingered farmers in their Range Rovers.

[Odile]

Pretty short list so far hey thanks for confirming- by not listing any

[McTAVGE]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	I never understood why the State, EU or otherwise, should have to pay to keep fat fingered farmers in their Range Rovers.

My friends in Wales who are farmers cannot even afford the various repairs needed for the leaking roof and long dead central heating. The only thing they drive is their tractors and an old battered Nissan Micra.


Again, not everyone in the farming industry is rolling in it.

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	Odile
	Pretty short list so far hey thanks for confirming- by not listing any

I wasn't remotely interested in what the Leave campaign had to say before the referendum, so why would I be interested now?

[nickatbasel]

Basically their interest is in the UK taxpayer subsidy that the government keeps coughing up to train operating companies in return for keeping some kind of meagre service going.

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Your right DB will run the trains in the best interests of DB, but that may not be in the best interests of the general public.

[marton]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	I wasn't remotely interested in what the Leave campaign had to say before the referendum, so why would I be interested now?

I know; too late now to change your vote

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	marton
	I know; too late now to change your vote

Why would I want to change my vote? I didn't vote for some bullshit about the NHS or immigration. I voted on a matter of principle. I do not wish to be a citizen of a European Union.

Simple as that.

And I know for a fact that I'm not alone in that sentiment, whatever disgruntled Remainers might like to think.

[Odile]

	Quote:	Dougal's Breakfast
	I wasn't remotely interested in what the Leave campaign had to say before the referendum, so why would I be interested now?

What about the promises made by the Government?

You seem to be among the small proportion of Leave voter who did some research and made his own mind. We may disagree totally, but at least I respect that. Most people were swayed by videos showing a efficient NHS without queues and instant cures for the flu, buses with 350/week for NHS, garantees of stopping free-movement, jobs given 'back' to our lads and lasses, school class sizes dropping and ressources increasing, etc, etc- as well as UKIP's posters showing refugees and 'brown' people being refused entry, and the like.

Not a single one of either the Government, or Ukip's promises have come to any kind of frution, even the beginnings of ... And many have now been clearly refuted - like the money for the NHS, or even free movement of people. And other effects are being felt, increase in racism (I know you don't believe that, but ...), prices going up, product size being cut to hide price increases, some products no longer available, the poorest regions losing subsidies, firms closing or moving production abroad, etc, etc - the list is endless.

Of course you are not alone- and I can assure you neither am I. An increasing proportion of people now know they have been lied to and cheated- and they are NOT happy. With such a tiny majority (of those who voted of course, not the country) - it seems that with those oldie leavers who have died since, the youngsters who wanted to remain and now 18, and those who have changed their mind as they realise above - 'the will of the people' does increasingly sound very very hollow indeed. Biggly.

There is no plan, even Baldrick would do better- and there is no-one queuing to get trade deals with UK- unless we pay with pounds and pounds of flesh and our soul - eg drop in environmental protection, import of protected species, animal welfare and additives, pesticides, pollution/emissions, etc, etc.

[Dougal's Breakfast]

	Quote:	Odile
	What about the promises made by the Government? You seem to be among the small proportion of Leave voter who did some research and made his own mind. We may disagree totally, but at least I respect that. Most people were swayed by videos ...

I don't think people were. Who takes any notice of what politicians promise? Nobody cares what they have to say. We all know they lie all the time.

There were many reasons for voting leave, but I don't think the bilge spouted by the likes of Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage had much to do with it. I'm not saying all the reasons were necessarily rational, but I'd be surprised if more than a handful of leave voters took those clowns at their word.