The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Reb77Br]

	Quote:	amogles
	Brexit won because few people have positive emotional bonds to burocrats and meddlers.

That was definitely part of the Leave campaign but I think the "take back control" slogan wasn't as subtle as that and primarily meant "from foreigners (in Brussels and at home)". It seemed to be immigration that the Leave campaign was stressing in the run-up to voting day rather than bureaucrats/meddlers.

[StirB]

	Quote:	amogles
	I never realized there was a bus on the ballot slip.

A ballot slip that people saw for 30 seconds, as opposed to lies on a bus and in the media that were piped directly into people's homes for months. Good point, well made.

[Odile]

As well as this totally biased, ridiculous and actually plainly racist video- on the NHS before and after Brexit - where nurses and patients miraculously change colour- and an old woman with a bad cold goes to Casualty post Brexit and come home totally cured a couple of hours later

That was totally disgusting, did you see it:

https://youtu.be/yIYq5xMW98I

[amogles]

	Quote:	StirB
	A ballot slip that people saw for 30 seconds, as opposed to lies on a bus and in the media that were piped directly into people's homes for months. Good point, well made.

As opposed to the pro-EU people having the media to themselves for 40 years?

And about that bus, how often did you actually really see it?

Or is this some new myth the remainers are spinning?

[amogles]

	Quote:	Reb77Br
	That was definitely part of the Leave campaign but I think the "take back control" slogan wasn't as subtle as that and primarily meant "from foreigners (in Brussels and at home)". It seemed to be immigration that the Leave campaign was stressing in the run-up to voting day rather than bureaucrats/meddlers.

I'm not so sure.

I think it was being portrayed that way. But I talked to a lot of people at the time, and despite what the media were saying, immigration was not a topic that came up in a predominant way. I think attempts by certain people on the remainer side to use a broad brush and call the entire leave camaign racist may actually have backfired and hurt them as people realized it wasn't true.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	amogles
	And when a referendum doesn't return the result the EU wants, the EU would never ever demand a repeat of that refrendum.

Unlike the UK, the Irish Government has no authority to commit the country to any EU treaty, that authority is reserved to the people. Under the constitution the people are entitled to accept or reject any offers put to them by the EU....

On two occasions they have not been happy with the first offer and have rejected it and in both occasions they have received offers that were more to their liking. It is a blatant lie to state the they were forced to vote on the same offer twice. And it is very easily discredited - simply pull up the proposal and it is clear that they are not the same. Then for good measure look at the material arguments made by the loosing side and that too is different because of course they were objecting to a different proposal!

[Odile]

	Quote:	amogles
	I'm not so sure. I think it was being portrayed that way. But I talked to a lot of people at the time, and despite what the media were saying, immigration was not a topic that came up in a predominant way. I think attempts by certain people on the remainer side to use a broad brush and call the entire leave camaign racist may actually have backfired and hurt them as people realized it wasn't true.

Out of interest, have you watched this campaign video- your comments please.


https://youtu.be/yIYq5xMW98I

[ch2013]

All fake, there are no drunks or hooligans shown in A&E...

[StirB]

	Quote:	amogles
	As opposed to the pro-EU people having the media to themselves for 40 years?

Hahaha. You are hilarious. You should have your own show.

	Quote:	amogles
	And about that bus, how often did you actually really see it? Or is this some new myth the remainers are spinning?

In the lead up to the election, pretty much all day, every day, with certain unscrupulous politicians selling it very heavily, then backing away from it when they won and realised they couldn't justify that whopper.

[baboon]

	Quote:	amogles
	I'm not so sure. I think it was being portrayed that way. But I talked to a lot of people at the time, and despite what the media were saying, immigration was not a topic that came up in a predominant way. I think attempts by certain people on the remainer side to use a broad brush and call the entire leave camaign racist may actually have backfired and hurt them as people realized it wasn't true.

I am pretty sure.

In pretty well every single vox pop with Brexiters I saw, every discussion away from the media I heard, immigration was mentioned first as their reason for supporting the exit campaign.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	But the problem is that the EU can't do anything about the external agreements that form part of the package. And while the UK are running around trying to prepare for trade deals, there seem to be no movement at all on fight agreements etc....

External agreements are by definition not part of the package.

There's probably a whole lot of other topics that should be addressed but aren't, simply because nothing will happen until after a fundamental shared understanding has been reached and agreed upon on the financial obligations the EU says the UK has to honor.

Going by the Brexit folks on here however that's perfectly sound and reasonable negotiation strategy. The same folks are virtually guaranteed to whingeing later on because everything has to be rushed through. After all it's all EU's fault.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Odile
	As well as this totally biased, ridiculous and actually plainly racist video- on the NHS before and after Brexit - where nurses and patients miraculously change colour- and an old woman with a bad cold goes to Casualty post Brexit and come home totally cured a couple of hours later That was totally disgusting, did you see it: https://youtu.be/yIYq5xMW98I

The right video has generally been whitened (or the left one darkened) to make the right one more appealing.

I fail to see racism in this video. Stereotyping yes, but not racism.

[Odile]

So when the patients in the waiting room and the staff are 'brown' it is a disaster- but when they turn 'white' miracles occur (like a cough and feeling really awful and weak- disappears miraculously after a visit to the 'right' kind of doctors and nurses... !!! wow ...

Anyhoe, who goes to Casualty for a cough and cold - and who can cure such with a quick visit to said casualty dpt?

[Reb77Br]

From what I can tell:

"Inside the EU" and "Outside the EU": dark-skinned receptionist
"Inside the EU" waiting room: several whites plus one dark-skinned man, two darkish-skinned women, one oriental man (close-up and gets to see the doctor)
"Outside the EU" waiting room: white couple and one darkish-skinned woman; dark-skinned man seen waiting at the end of the video
"Outside the EU" treatment room: initial brief back view of woman with black hair who might not be white, brief view of possibly Asian woman looking at X-ray, otherwise all staff white

The "outside the EU" video does seem to be more "white" and not just in the whiteness of the screen, e.g. in the "inside the EU" video it's easier to identify who is non-white, in the "inside the EU" video an oriental man (close-up shows this clearly) gets to see the doctor, while the elderly woman waits, in the "outside the EU" video, she sees the doctor while a dark-skinned man waits.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Urs Max
	I fail to see racism in this video. Stereotyping yes, but not racism.

Now who do you thing the video was aimed at, talk about splitting hairs.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Urs Max
	Going by the Brexit folks on here however that's perfectly sound and reasonable negotiation strategy. The same folks are virtually guaranteed to whingeing later on because everything has to be rushed through. After all it's all EU's fault.

As I understand it this will actually fall apart next October 12 months and not March 2019! And Michael O'Leary pointed out in one interview it is the other carriers interests to have fewer competitors.

[Blueangel]

That video was the subject of my only ever complaint to OFCOM.

[StirB]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-customs-union

So we are going to pay a "divorce settlement" after all. Who knew?

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	As I understand it this will actually fall apart next October 12 months and not March 2019! And Michael O'Leary pointed out in one interview it is the other carriers interests to have fewer competitors.

Didn't he say the schedules for 2nd and 3rd quarter 2019 have to be filed by October 2018? So theres 7-12 months lead time.

To me this means:
Airplanes will fly until March 2019 based on schedules filed by April 2018. No more flights after that, in part due to failed filing of flight schedules by October 2018 (which cover 2nd and 3rd quarter 2019). Assuming no emergency measures are taken.

	Quote:	StirB
	https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-customs-union So we are going to pay a "divorce settlement" after all. Who knew?

Why not simply postpone Brexit instead? Article 50 explicitly allows such an arrangement.

ETA:
In reply to my question: The UK pays £10bln a year, Brexit 2019 is said to cost perhaps £60bln. If Brexit happened in 2022 that would mean three additional yearly payment of 10bln each whereas some transit agreement would stop them in 2019 (and in turn cost some annual fee, but forthcoming decisions wouldn't affect the UK's obligations). Does that make sense?

[fatmanfilms]

Unemployment still falling, no doubt this will be spun as a bad thing by the re-moaners.

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/uk...093900647.html