The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	No, but it does highlight the hysterical nature of the accusations. Have Russia been trying to be influence western elections? Yes. Have they had an impact on the results? Probably not.

Which is something quite different than your remark implies.

Unless you know the extent it's impossible to guess the influence's effect, let alone if it had a material effect. That's simple logic. Considering the small margin for "Leave" your claim may well turn out premature.

Btw, disagreeing with your own unfounded claim doesn't make it hysterical. That's just a rhetorical scapegoat in an attempt to dismiss the other's point, often due to lack of actual arguments.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	No, but it does highlight the hysterical nature of the accusations. Have Russia been trying to be influence western elections? Yes. Have they had an impact on the results? Probably not. Russia must have hacked my pencil! I guess you must never have come across a security guard.

Given a choice I would prefer the Russians to Murdoch although it is a very close thing

	Quote:
	These words from an Anthony Hilton column for the Evening Standard might just sum it up: "I once asked Rupert Murdoch why he was so opposed to the European Union. 'That’s easy,' he replied. 'When I go into Downing Street they do what I say; when I go to Brussels they take no notice."

[pdofr]

	Quote:
	These words from an Anthony Hilton column for the Evening Standard might just sum it up: "I once asked Rupert Murdoch why he was so opposed to the European Union. 'That’s easy,' he replied. 'When I go into Downing Street they do what I say; when I go to Brussels they take no notice."

	Quote:	marton
	Given a choice I would prefer the Russians to Murdoch although it is a very close thing

Or as someone said in a computer security related discussion elsewhere on the internet recently:

"I doubt whether the Russians have any interest in me. I am more concerned with what data my own government holds on me."

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I've been back in the UK for 6 days now, and all I've heard from friends is who's being made redundant at the end of November, how government funding cuts are crippling their work place and ability to provide sufficient care for employees under increasing pressure (police), and whose work hours are being cut. And that's before I've even seen any of my friends who work in the NHS and education. Prices in Tesco and ASDA have shot up since my last extended visit in Feb. I'm looking at prices and thinking "That's the same as I pay in CHF in Migros!" Being a total geek about these things, I spoke to my OH last night, and checked items on my receipts from both supermarkets with his receipt for Migros. It was startling. Had a long talk with a non-political close friend the other night, and even she's saying this government have to go. Financially, she's safe and sound...mortgage paid off, on a very good pension and raking it in as a consultant on a daily rate...but it's what she's seeing around her that has brought home numerous issues with this government's policies. I've just come off the phone with a local charity about collecting white goods, etc, from my house. I was told that they're crying out for goods to be donated because people are hanging on to things a lot longer lately, and their stocks are drying up. It feels like people are battening down the hatches in preparation for the storm to come. No like. Want to come home (to CH)

Same here - incredible how prices have shot up since we last came in January- and how so many products have got smaller- from chocolate bars, to washing stuff, and the loo paper practically falls off the much larger cardboard roll - a symbol perhaps of what is going on

Yesterday in a lovely café in Oakham, 2 old chaps were going on and on about our 'we let Gerry have it' and the success of bouncing bombs, and on and on. I could see the lady at the next table, and her husband (late 60s I'd say) getting a bit restless- and when the left, she said to the old guys, very quietly and politely 'perhaps it is now time to look to the future, and not wallow in the past' in a very strong German accent, but perfect English. She was polite, but it was obvious she was quite shaken and upset.

	Quote:
	Yesterday in a lovely café in Oakham, 2 old chaps were going on and on about our 'we let Gerry have it' and the success of bouncing bombs, and on and on. I could see the lady at the next table, and her husband (late 60s I'd say) getting a bit restless- and when the left, she said to the old guys, very quietly and politely 'perhaps it is now time to look to the future, and not wallow in the past' in a very strong German accent, but perfect English. She was polite, but it was obvious she was quite shaken and upset.

Filed under “never happened”.

????? it was indeed real and surreal - talk to my OH, he was even more shocked than I was (and it takes a lot ...)

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Odile
	2 old chaps were going on and on about our 'we let Gerry have it' and the success of bouncing bombs, and on and on.

What pisses me off with people like this is, they're rarely old enough to have a clue what they're talking about.

I visitied my Aunt the other day, and I'll be seeing her again tomorrow as it's her 86th birthday. My mum would have turned 87 on Saturday. My mother-outlaw over in Athens is 88. They were all still school kids when the war finished. They all, particuarly the mother-outlaw, experienced things that I hope we'll never see, yet both my Aunt and the mother-outlaw are phenomenally pro-EU because they don't want to see Europe at war again.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Filed under “never happened”.

Ah ha, really

[marton]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	What pisses me off with people like this is, they're rarely old enough to have a clue what they're talking about. I visitied my Aunt the other day, and I'll be seeing her again tomorrow as it's her 86th birthday. My mum would have turned 87 on Saturday. My mother-outlaw over in Athens is 88. They were all still school kids when the war finished. They all, particuarly the mother-outlaw, experienced things that I hope we'll never see, yet both my Aunt and the mother-outlaw are phenomenally pro-EU because they don't want to see Europe at war again.

Actually it was the Americans who "let Gerry have it"!
There were 1.5 million US troops in the UK and Eisenhower led the invasion of France!

[pdofr]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	What pisses me off with people like this is, they're rarely old enough to have a clue what they're talking about.

Exactly. What they are doing is spouting war propaganda, something that Britain was very successful at. [1]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I visitied my Aunt the other day, and I'll be seeing her again tomorrow as it's her 86th birthday. My mum would have turned 87 on Saturday. My mother-outlaw over in Athens is 88. They were all still school kids when the war finished. They all, particuarly the mother-outlaw, experienced things that I hope we'll never see, yet both my Aunt and the mother-outlaw are phenomenally pro-EU because they don't want to see Europe at war again.

Doing the arithmetic, my mother would have just been starting university as the war ended. She would have been 90 this year. My father was in the war. He would have been 93 this year. He never really talked about it except for the once when I was about 40, when he said he'd witnessed his commanding officer take a direct hit from a shell; he was 19 at the time.

[1] Well into the 1970s, British TV was full of WWII propaganda. It was very hard to avoid war films.

[st2lemans]

My wife's great uncle was a POW of the Germans, the US, and finally the Brits.

He preferred the Germans to the Brits (but the US overall), as they were nicer and the food was better.

Tom

	Quote:	Blueangel
	What pisses me off with people like this is, they're rarely old enough to have a clue what they're talking about. I visitied my Aunt the other day, and I'll be seeing her again tomorrow as it's her 86th birthday. My mum would have turned 87 on Saturday. My mother-outlaw over in Athens is 88. They were all still school kids when the war finished. They all, particuarly the mother-outlaw, experienced things that I hope we'll never see, yet both my Aunt and the mother-outlaw are phenomenally pro-EU because they don't want to see Europe at war again.

One of the old chaps was definitely old enough - in his 90s I'd say, and the other perhaps in his 80s, and mainly listening. Loz93- OH is not impressed with your post either- and he is a very quiet, humble kind of guy who is not known for making up stories, thanks. Many here know him and respect him- and he is will happily confirm to them.

Now, however you voted, whatever you think about Brexit and if it is a good idea or not- do you really trust this useless, bloated, puffy, confused.... old bloke with getting the best deal- really?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-poli...ws-david-davis scary that the fate of our children and grandchildren, and the UK, is in his hands.

[pdofr]

	Quote:	pdofr
	Exactly. What they are doing is spouting war propaganda, something that Britain was very successful at.

The video below was the last episode of a German TV series made in 2016. It is in English, with a British presenter, and German subtitles. It describes how the anti-German feelings in Britain are the result of 50 years of British propaganda spanning both World Wars.

"Die Windsor sind nicht wirklich britisch - Best of Enemies" ("The Windors are not really British - Best of Enemies") (Youtube)

The full series can be seen at www.best-of-enemies.de. The episode on Energy highlights the differences between Germany and Britain's attitude to investment in engineering.

[fatmanfilms]

listening to Peter Shore’s BREXIT speech in 1975, not much has changed in 42 years

http://thisisengland.info/2017/11/18...rs-neck-stand/

[marton]

Home Office officials have privately admitted the department is having problems increasing its immigration staffing levels as part of its Brexit preparations and may have to recruit Polish and other eastern Europeans to help register the 3 million EU nationals in Britain.

Source

You could not make this stuff up.

	Quote:
	Amber Rudd, the home secretary, has already told MPs that 700 extra immigration caseworkers have been recruited and hopes to recruit an extra 500 by next April. The Home Office said it would be looking to recruit extra staff in the coming years. Even this level of extra staffing falls far short of the needed capacity, leaving each caseworker responsible for 1,500 of the 3 million EU registration applications. If EU nationals were required post-Brexit to join the “rest of the world” queues at airports, the Border Force would also require significant extra numbers

Good News!

Brexit will solve the pension crisis:

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...s-after-brexit

	Quote:
	Good News! Brexit will solve the pension crisis: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...s-after-brexit

5 million UK toddlers do a simultaneous fist pump...

	Quote:
	Good News! Brexit will solve the pension crisis: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...s-after-brexit

Scraping the barrel here. People living on a diet of Micro Chips and Greggs will carry on living on a diet of Micro Chips and Greggs after Brexit.

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Scraping the barrel here. People living on a diet of Micro Chips and Greggs will carry on living on a diet of Micro Chips and Greggs after Brexit.

What about people who can afford to eat healthily now, and won't be able to post-Brex? There's no way you can spin more people not being able to afford to eat healthily as a positive.

We shouldn't keep using extremes to try and justify untenable positions. What about Oligarch billionaires living in London, they can still afford their 5 a day, so all fine

	Quote:
	What about people who can afford to eat healthily now, and won't be able to post-Brex? There's no way you can spin more people not being able to afford to eat healthily as a positive. We shouldn't keep using extremes to try and justify untenable positions. What about Oligarch billionaires living in London, they can still afford their 5 a day, so all fine

Everyone can afford to eat healthily. They either don't want to learn or are too ignorant to know how to cook. The obesity crisis in the UK will carry on regardless of Brexit.