The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Blueangel]

The first link was to a strike action taken by my friends and former colleagues at the place where I'd been a trade union rep until 2003, in the days when there were 835 employees on the site.

I met up with them before one of their marches to raise awareness of the detrimental impact of zero hours contracts on colleagues.

Never mind statistics, try over 300 full time permanent employees who were gradually replaced by zero hours workers over a number of years, and that site is now gone for good.

https://www.wigantoday.net/news/sadn...oved-1-8216685

Screw your statistics. I'm talking about real people who I've known for 30yrs.

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Never mind statistics, try over 300 full time permanent employees who were gradually replaced by zero hours workers over a number of years, and that site is now gone for good.

Woz they immigrantz zero hour workaz?!

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	“Nevermind the statistics, I have some articles from left wing newspapers” Thanks for proving my point.

If you have statistics then try posting a link correctly so that it works

[StirB]

	Quote:	amogles
	you're going to have to explain that to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood

"As a matter of interpretation of the word "person" in the Fourteenth Amendment, U.S. courts have extended certain constitutional protections to corporations"

Would you like to admit that the 14th amendment is indeed part of the constitution instead of trying to belittle my point? Thanks.

[StirB]

Saw this comment this morning, hopefully we can all start Friday with a laugh...

The Brexit impact assessments have turned up!
They were on Damien Green's hard drive.
They show large numbers of people getting f...ed.

[Uncle Max]

Friday Funnies, you say..?



Strip creators Barney Farmer, Lee Healey

[Swisstree]

	Quote:	StirB
	Saw this comment this morning, hopefully we can all start Friday with a laugh... The Brexit impact assessments have turned up! They were on Damien Green's hard drive. They show large numbers of people getting f...ed.

No need for assessments, they were getting f...ed anyway.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Good for people in full time education, people with other commitments that need flexibility, people that have two jobs. The idea behind them was never to have a regular income and get a mortgage in the first place.

And why do they have two jobs? Because neither pays enough.

It's not that zero hour contracts are used (and pay) as much as the employee wants, it's that they pay what they employer decides and has the employee work.

As you say yourself, they're no good for a regular income, hence they don't pay enough to make a living. But some people have no other option.

"However, the report also shows that, while the majority of zero-hours employees choose to work part-time, they are more likely than part-time employees as a whole to say they would like to work additional hours."

[Phos]

	Quote:	StirB
	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood "As a matter of interpretation of the word "person" in the Fourteenth Amendment, U.S. courts have extended certain constitutional protections to corporations" Would you like to admit that the 14th amendment is indeed part of the constitution instead of trying to belittle my point? Thanks.

14th amendment does not prescribe treating corporations as persons.

Courts simply acknowledge the extension of the same rights to an entity as convention for litigation. It is what allows a corporation to be sued.

[StirB]

	Quote:	Phos
	14th amendment does not prescribe treating corporations as persons. Courts simply acknowledge the extension of the same rights to an entity as convention for litigation. It is what allows a corporation to be sued.

No it prescribes treating persons as persons, and corporations are defined as persons, so deserve to be treated as personally as persons by persons. Simples.

[Phos]

	Quote:	StirB
	No it prescribes treating persons as persons, and corporations are defined as persons, so deserve to be treated as personally as persons by persons. Simples.

The 14th amendment does not do that, courts and their decisions do.

[StirB]

	Quote:	Phos
	The 14th amendment does not do that, courts and their decisions do.

That's like saying the 14th Amendment doesn't apply to men or women, just persons. Men and women and companies are defined as persons, so you're splitting hairs.

[Phos]

	Quote:	StirB
	That's like saying the 14th Amendment doesn't apply to men or women, just persons. Men and women and companies are defined as persons, so you're splitting hairs.

The logic is used by courts to define a legal entity for litigations and rulings. But for example, a corporation is not entitle to a vote. It has a subset of rights of natural persons for obvious and practical reasons.

[StirB]

	Quote:	Phos
	The logic is used by courts to define a legal entity for litigations and rulings. But for example, a corporation is not entitle to a vote. It has a subset of rights of natural persons for obvious and practical reasons.

Completely irrelevant whataboutery, we are talking about the definition of a person in the 14th amendment.

The rights to vote are clarified in the 15th amendment.

[Phos]

	Quote:	StirB
	Completely irrelevant whataboutery, we are talking about the definition of a person in the 14th amendment. The rights to vote are clarified in the 15th amendment.

You have it backwards. Corporate personhood is a legal notion used by courts, not a legal definition found in the 14th amendment.

[TobiasM]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	If Zero Hour contracts are so diabolical, then why are so many people happy on them? This is yet another myth that has been peddled by the left leaning press. On the whole, zero hour contracts are a good thing as they allow employees to be flexible whilst maintaining many benefits of being in full employment. A few companies like Sports Direct have exploited them, otherwise, there’s nothing wrong with them.

That's utter crap, no holiday pay, no sick pay, no actual guarantee of work when needed. Sure it suits some, perhaps a student or second jobber, but on the whole its an awful idea.

As for the Fat film makers comment that society will be better when everything is automated, jeez what planet is that fella on?

[marton]

'Sufficient progress' in Brexit talks announced after May's dash to Brussels.

	Quote:
	The new text offers guarantees that Northern Ireland will have regulatory alignment with the Republic, but that in such an event no obstacles to trade will emerge between Northern Ireland and the UK. Earlier this week, Davis had suggested this would be undertaken by continued alignment of the whole of the UK with the EU.

So does this mean a sort of no Brexit??

	Quote:
	On citizens’ rights, both sides said the agreement would ensure that EU nationals in the UK would retain the same rights after Brexit as they enjoyed before.

Good news!

	Quote:
	Tusk said that during a two-year transition period requested by May, the UK would have to accept EU law, including new law, its budgetary commitments and the continued jurisdiction of the European court of justice while having no role in the bloc’s decision-making.

Source

Complete climb down or what??

[TobiasM]

	Quote:	marton
	'Sufficient progress' in Brexit talks announced after May's dash to Brussels. So does this mean a sort of no Brexit?? Good news! Source Complete climb down or what??

No sadly it's not, but it seems that the whole NI border question caused a lot of grief, the opinion in Ireland was that a hard border was a total disregard for all the work acheived in the Good Friday Agreement and now its being suggested that there should be a softer border policy planned between the Irelands, then on the mainland U.K.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	TobiasM
	As for the Fat film makers comment that society will be better when everything is automated, jeez what planet is that fella on?

I never made such a comment. However we have all benefited from the industrial revolution. Many people fear change, I look to make the most of every situation.

[marton]

	Quote:	TobiasM
	No sadly it's not, but it seems that the whole NI border question caused a lot of grief, the opinion in Ireland was that a hard border was a total disregard for all the work acheived in the Good Friday Agreement and now its being suggested that there should be a softer border policy planned between the Irelands, then on the mainland U.K.

No it is not.

Firstly it is not a suggestion but an agreement.

The article says there will be no hard border between Ireland and NI but also no hard border between NI and England due to "this would be undertaken by continued alignment of the whole of the UK with the EU."
What will this alignment constitute? Look at free movement alone if there are to be no hard borders between Ireland and England!