The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

	Quote:	Phos
	Your contradiction here indicates you are not really thinking this through.

The fact you think those two (now three!) statements are contradictory shows me you understand neither how UK nor European politics work. Perhaps the Trump thread is more your speed.

	Quote:
	The fact you think those two (now three!) statements are contradictory shows me you understand neither how UK nor European politics work. Perhaps the Trump thread is more your speed.

See you after Brexit!

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	The difference being that Civil servents will be drawing up legislation with only Britain’s interests in mind. Not some Walloon dairy farmer, or some French Foie Gras producer or some German car manufacturer.

It no different what so ever. You can make the exact same argument by having a civil servant from Cornwall making decisions about what happens in say Armagh.

But of course in your little world that is OK, because he is not a foreigner.

	Quote:	Phos
	See you after Brexit!

Obviously. None of us Inselaffen are going back to the Motherland after the Brexit farrago, as clearly you are obviously not keen to go back to America after their recent missteps.

	Quote:
	Obviously. None of us Inselaffen are going back to the Motherland after the Brexit farrago, as clearly you are obviously not keen to go back to America after their recent missteps.

On the contrary, a US and UK populated with people with a sense of courage and self-determination is in a much better position to navigate their future then a continental Europe that is half asleep. I would consider moving back to the US, and maybe even to a straighten-up UK.

If the EU gets into CH, I would probably leave.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Phos
	If the government is powerless in changing something due to hindrance by Brussels, there is no point in exercising this. So British sovereignty makes an absolute difference to this point.

Try to understand how decision making actually works in the EU.

Do us all a favour and make it a New Year resolution, to do a bit of research and try to understand the topic.

	Quote:	Phos
	If the EU gets into CH, I would probably leave.

Hate to break it to you, the bilateral agreements mean the EU (like me and Loz!) are already in here. Adios.

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Try to understand how decision making actually works in the EU. Do us all a favour and make it a New Year resolution, to do a bit of research and try to understand the topic.

Not necessary. Better to just get rid of that overhead layer altogether.

Snooze!

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Phos
	I would consider moving back to the US...

Oh happy day!

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Oh happy day!

But I'll make sure to continue posting on EF though.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Phos
	But I'll make sure to continue posting on EF though.

Fill your troll boots. I couldn't give a flying .... what you do.

https://blog.ricksteves.com/blog/ugly-american/

[parnell]

	Quote:
	The fact you think those two (now three!) statements are contradictory shows me you understand neither how UK nor European politics work. Perhaps the Trump thread is more your speed.

Let me guess it's your "subtleties" again

Ever heard the phrase "All politics is local"??

Toodlepip - bon voyage ...

	Quote:	parnell
	Let me guess it's your "subtleties" again Ever heard the phrase "All politics is local"??

Not really subtle, the point i was making was so obvious it could be seen from space.

Whilst your glib soundbyte is no doubt amusing, it's not really adding anything here.

[parnell]

	Quote:
	Not really subtle, the point i was making was so obvious it could be seen from space.

Your point - like many of your other points - are unfounded - of course the more local the constituency the more power the people who elect that person have over their actions - and therefore oversight. This is incredibly basic stuff.

	Quote:	parnell
	Your point - like many of your other points - are unfounded - of course the more local the constituency the more power the people who elect that person have over their actions - and therefore oversight. This is incredibly basic stuff.

Extremely obvious. And I should ask....

	Quote:
	Of course it happens in Brussels. What do you think Farage was doing with fishing quotas for example? He was voicing UK community concerns.

When has the EU ever listened to Farage's concerns?

	Quote:	parnell
	Your point - like many of your other points - are unfounded - of course the more local the constituency the more power the people who elect that person have over their actions - and therefore oversight. This is incredibly basic stuff.

But that has nothing to do with my point. However, if you wish to go down this route to its logical conclusion, then again, Brexit makes little material difference here. People can already raise issues to their local MP, who can, if he/she so chooses, raise it in Parliament. This won't change.

	Quote:	Phos
	When has the EU ever listened to Farage's concerns?

They've had to every time he takes the floor. Not sure what your point is. How often do any MPs listen to (or better said, escalate) any concern that isn't of benefit to them?

[parnell]

	Quote:
	But that has nothing to do with my point. However, if you wish to go down this route to its logical conclusion, then again, Brexit makes little material difference here. People can already raise issues to their local MP, who can, if he/she so chooses, raise it in Parliament. This won't change.

Really ??? Did you ever consider that their local MP might not be a member of the governing body (in this case the European parliament) which gave rise to the issue ???

The further away the constituency from the voter no surprise the more waste and bureaucratic absurdity takes place. In fact a similar phenomenon is a large part of the problem with socialism as Milton Friedman has often pointed out - no one spends their money as efficiently or productively as they themselves do.

	Quote:	parnell
	Really ??? Did you ever consider that their local MP might not be a member of the governing body (in this case the European parliament) which gave rise to the issue ??? The further away the constituency from the voter no surprise the more waste and bureaucratic absurdity takes place. In fact a similar phenomenon is a large part of the problem with socialism as Milton Friedman has often pointed out - no one spends their money as efficiently or productively as they themselves do.

Did you ever consider their local MP might not be a member of the Governing party, which gave rise to the issue?

"The further away the constituency from the voter" - this makes zero sense, the voter by their very definition is in the constituency. Seriously, get a basic grasp of UK politics before embarassing yourself further.

	Quote:
	They've had to every time he takes the floor. Not sure what your point is. How often do any MPs listen to (or better said, escalate) any concern that isn't of benefit to them?

So I think your logic admits the more layers there are, the less likely issues surfaces up to the top for discussion.