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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #11161  
Old 17.01.2018, 22:45
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Oops, meant Labour's renationalisation policy.
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  #11162  
Old 17.01.2018, 22:48
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Funny thing about renationalising the trains is that even if it were to work (which it wouldn’t) it wouldn’t help “the most vulnerable” just wealthy commuters, mainly in the South East.
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  #11163  
Old 18.01.2018, 10:15
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Funny thing about renationalising the trains is that even if it were to work (which it wouldn’t) it wouldn’t help “the most vulnerable” just wealthy commuters, mainly in the South East.
That then begs the question; how are "the most vulnerable" benefiting from the system as it stands now?

You imply that they would be worse off under a re-nationalised rail link.
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  #11164  
Old 18.01.2018, 11:40
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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That then begs the question; how are "the most vulnerable" benefiting from the system as it stands now?

You imply that they would be worse off under a re-nationalised rail link.
Well the trains were unusable before de-nationalisation, Strikes, Dirty & rarely even ran.
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  #11165  
Old 18.01.2018, 11:43
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Well the trains were unusable before de-nationalisation, Strikes, Dirty & rarely even ran.
Doesn't really answer the question, though.

Given my friends' frequent spitting-angry posts on FB as well as being able to view their almost daily posts to Southwestern's site, it would seem the conditions you describe above are very much still there, except you pay through the nose for it.
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  #11166  
Old 18.01.2018, 11:50
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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No need to import from the EU, unless they cut prices to match whats available in the open market.
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Are there likely to be fewer horse meat scandals sourcing food from the broader, open market? If standards are going to equal or be better than what we currently tolerate, will costs also be lower? Curious to connect the dots.
Still curious.



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Well the trains were unusable before de-nationalisation, Strikes, Dirty & rarely even ran.
There was a reason Maggie, Major and Co allowed that to happen. It's not been seen as a good thing.
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  #11167  
Old 18.01.2018, 11:56
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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There was a reason Maggie, Major and Co allowed that to happen. It's not been seen as a good thing.
I disagree, what Maggie did was amazing, she turned the UK around. Poor people paid 34% base rate tax on income above £720 a year when she came into office.
Major was wet & never achieved anything.
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  #11168  
Old 18.01.2018, 12:07
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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That then begs the question; how are "the most vulnerable" benefiting from the system as it stands now?

You imply that they would be worse off under a re-nationalised rail link.
They don't benefit from the system as it stands now for the simple reason that poor people tend not to use the train regularly.

I didn't imply they'd be worse off. I'm stating any policy change regarding trains will have little to no effect on those worse off.
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  #11169  
Old 18.01.2018, 12:14
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I disagree, what Maggie did was amazing, she turned the UK around. Poor people paid 34% base rate tax on income above £720 a year when she came into office.
Major was wet & never achieved anything.
Privatisation worked out well for Railtrack and the London Underground Privatisation is the worst thing to do for railways, but selling the fambly silver for a quick buck provided only benefits to shareholders at the expense of the nation... and cost the lives of many. Be wary of triumphing free market economics at the expense of national interest.
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  #11170  
Old 18.01.2018, 12:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Privatisation worked out well for Railtrack and the London Underground Privatisation is the worst thing to do for railways, but selling the fambly silver for a quick buck provided only benefits to shareholders at the expense of the nation... and cost the lives of many. Be wary of triumphing free market economics at the expense of national interest.
Those train lines were not an asset but a huge liability, far better to sell it off to mugs.
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  #11171  
Old 18.01.2018, 12:56
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Those train lines were not an asset but a huge liability, far better to sell it off to mugs.
Well, if the only motivation is short term self interest, I suppose you have a point. Bit tough on those who lost their lives due to such attitudes, but who cares?
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  #11172  
Old 18.01.2018, 13:03
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Well, if the only motivation is short term self interest, I suppose you have a point. Bit tough on those who lost their lives due to such attitudes, but who cares?
It's not short term at all, it's in the countries long term interest that the government does not operate everything. Remember communism?
Who lost their lives due to the sale of the railways
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  #11173  
Old 18.01.2018, 13:11
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It's not short term at all, it's in the countries long term interest that the government does not operate everything. Remember communism?
Who lost their lives due to the sale of the railways
I agree the government shouldn't operate everything. Referring to Communism is a red herring.

Many hundreds of people lost their lives due to negligence of the privatised infrastructure stakeholders. It's the precise reason Railtrack became nationalised not-for-dividend Network Rail. Would it change your mind if I went to the trouble of linking news reports, or can you take care of that bit yourself?
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  #11174  
Old 18.01.2018, 13:14
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I disagree, what Maggie did was amazing, she turned the UK around. Poor people paid 34% base rate tax on income above £720 a year when she came into office.
Major was wet & never achieved anything.
Ah yes, Maggie. One of the main architects of the Single Market.
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  #11175  
Old 18.01.2018, 13:45
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Britain will pay £44.5m for extra security measures in France to prevent another refugee camp forming in Calais or any other Channel port, Theresa May is to announce.

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Another Brexit cost; likely the UK will also likely pay France to increase British border checks that are carried out in France to avoid impossible handling of post Brexit goods imports in British ports.
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  #11176  
Old 18.01.2018, 13:45
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I agree the government shouldn't operate everything. Referring to Communism is a red herring.

Many hundreds of people lost their lives due to negligence of the privatised infrastructure stakeholders. It's the precise reason Railtrack became nationalised not-for-dividend Network Rail. Would it change your mind if I went to the trouble of linking news reports, or can you take care of that bit yourself?
Your saying the safety record was better before which I think is a red herring

Of course driverless trains will make it so much safer in the future.
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  #11177  
Old 18.01.2018, 14:10
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Of course driverless trains will make it so much safer in the future.
Our railways are massively outdated compared to most of our "peer" nations. Bringing railways up to the spec required for driverless operation would cost an astronomical amount. Private companies aren't going to fund this.

Whilst not all industry is best served by nationalisation, the current state of our railways - massive underinvestment, managed decline, bailing out failing franchises with taxpayer money whilst watching profits sail abroad to Germany, the Netherlands and Hong Kong really points to the fact that even in the worst case scenario, nationalisation would be of benefit.
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  #11178  
Old 18.01.2018, 14:13
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Britain will pay £44.5m for extra security measures in France to prevent another refugee camp forming in Calais or any other Channel port, Theresa May is to announce.

Source

Another Brexit cost; likely the UK will also likely pay France to increase British border checks that are carried out in France to avoid impossible handling of post Brexit goods imports in British ports.
£45m is preferable to the long-term cost of processing and paying for thousands of opportunistic migrants once they reach the UK would be far higher.
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  #11179  
Old 18.01.2018, 14:18
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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£45m is preferable to the long-term cost of processing and paying for thousands of opportunistic migrants once they reach the UK would be far higher.
Maybe the opportunistic ones are few and far between though (is there such a thing as an opportunistic migrant who has parted with most of his life-savings to give to traffickers, travelled from, say, Africa in a leaky rubber dinghy over rough seas with dozens of others, then trekked across a thousand miles of mainland Europe?).

More likely they are "determined" and "purposeful", in which case border patrols in Calais isn't going to really stop them.
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  #11180  
Old 18.01.2018, 14:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Our railways are massively outdated compared to most of our "peer" nations. Bringing railways up to the spec required for driverless operation would cost an astronomical amount. Private companies aren't going to fund this.

Whilst not all industry is best served by nationalisation, the current state of our railways - massive underinvestment, managed decline, bailing out failing franchises with taxpayer money whilst watching profits sail abroad to Germany, the Netherlands and Hong Kong really points to the fact that even in the worst case scenario, nationalisation would be of benefit.
Please google "Network Rail". The company responsible for bringing the railways up to spec is already nationalised
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