The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Blueangel]

For anyone whom has friends that it may concern, Nathalie Loiseau is being interviewed on this morning's Andrew Marr Show, specifically regarding the rights of British residents in France.

This is not, and never has been, about a second referendum- but a vote on the final deal, or no deal. Yes, that is how democracy works.

It should not be based on lies, Russian manipulation, and a tiny majority- how more undemocratic can that be.

	Quote:	marton
	So how many people are marching against a second referendum?

There were about 50 in Glasgow, with more police and horses than manifestors.

And a few in a pub with Farage in Harrogate, going on about bringing back the British Empire!

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:
	This is not, and never has been, about a second referendum- but a vote on the final deal, or no deal. Yes, that is how democracy works. It should not be based on lies, Russian manipulation, and a tiny majority- how more undemocratic can that be.

So accept the deal or hard BREXIT, or do you mean cancel BREXIT which is clearly a second referendum.

Ariston, and on, and on and on....

In short, NO.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:
	This is not, and never has been, about a second referendum- but a vote on the final deal, or no deal. Yes, that is how democracy works. It should not be based on lies, Russian manipulation, and a tiny majority- how more undemocratic can that be.

Except it is not democracy! Democracy in the UK means a sovereign parliament, where an MP represents and votes in the best interests of their constituents not on the outcome of a non binding referendum. This is illustrated by the fact that the majority of the population voted for parties supporting BREXIT in the last GE, but the Parliament has been unable to implement that decision without buying of the DUP.

And then there is the question of what exactly is supposed to happen with the vote? The UK is not the only one that gets to decide on the deal - what happens if the UK votes to accept it and say the Parliament of the Walloons reject it? And what exactly would a no deal mean - that the government should not seek to get a deal with the EU going forward, despite the fact that the UK would be unlikely to get a trade deal approved at the WTO for the foreseeable future. And what about people who want to vote to remain, should that be an option?

Of course- if the deal is bad or in case of no deal, which would be disastrous.

And another Brexiter who can opt out because he can afford it ...and other reasons:

https://tompride.wordpress.com/2018/...eMFisLEpVEW--I


Just seen Met Police estimating 840k marchers!!!!

[John William]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Perhaps they are just too intelligent as they realise a second referendum will never happen. The people had a chance to vote, it was a once in a generation opportunity.

They said that about the Scottish Independence vote in 2014 and now according to Sturgeon,
Theresa May will gladly allow a second referendum on Scottish Independence ( called Indyref 2 )
once Brexits out of the way.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	John William
	They said that about the Scottish Independence vote in 2014 and now according to Sturgeon, Theresa May will gladly allow a second referendum on Scottish Independence ( called Indyref 2 ) once Brexits out of the way.

Perhaps Britain can also vote on Scottish independence issue, why just Scotland?

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Perhaps Britain can also vote on Scottish independence issue, why just Scotland?

If the English were allowed to vote, the unionists would have no chance.

They should let us vote on Northern Ireland too.

The United Kingdom serves no useful purpose any more. Time to ditch it.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:
	If the English were allowed to vote, the unionists would have no chance. They should let us vote on Northern Ireland too. The United Kingdom serves no useful purpose any more. Time to ditch it.

Why not just make it very simple then a vote on dissolving the Union, it would solve the BREXIT issue as well. England can live in splendid isolation, Scotland can go join EFTA/EEA, the DUP can go in search of someone else to fund them and Wales can decide to stick with England or go it's own way too...

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Why not just make it very simple then a vote on dissolving the Union, it would solve the BREXIT issue as well. England can live in splendid isolation, Scotland can go join EFTA/EEA, the DUP can go in search of someone else to fund them and Wales can decide to stick with England or go it's own way too...

I agree totally. It's clear that the constituent parts of the union are no longer politically and culturally compatible (if, indeed, they ever were). The evidence of our western neighbour suggests that countries which leave the union seem perfectly capable of functioning as independent states. Scotland, in particular, would do just fine. I'm not sure about Wales (I'd like to think she'd be ok, but she isn't exactly much of an economic powerhouse these days), and I don't think anybody outside Ulster really cares what happens to Northern Ireland.

Just as long as we don't let London ditch the rest of England, mind... now that would be a disaster!

[curley]

	Quote:
	And today an estimated 670.000 peacefully marched in London for a vote on the final deal - wow.

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Just another 17 million to go.

I never march for anything, I still want a say.
Everything still open.

	Quote:
	Lovely to see so many people enjoying their rights to peaceful protest. Good on them!

If only they would enjoy actually going to the ballot as well. But that would mean actually making a decision (yeah, okay, not really, LOL) - at least taking a stand.

Maybe saussages and beer should be offered at English polls?

However, as an outsider I do wish the first one to actually leave the EU were a country with more backbone and solidarity. Now the next one will have to set the standards. Maybe they should stay in after all. At least they will not produce any stupid precedent.

	Quote:
	The United Kingdom serves no useful purpose any more. Time to ditch it.

so when we mentionned 'Little England' and were told we were rude - we were quite accurate then

Leave means leave - they say. And I'll reply, fraud is fraud, and lies are lies, like the ones below:

https://youtu.be/0xGt3QmRSZY

And the Police have been prevented from investigating PROVEN fraud further, because of 'political sensitivities' - dictatorship, anyone?

[curley]

Actually I just wondered: What if the Swiss vote yes on the latest SVP initiative, Switzerland cancels the free movement of people agreement?

The answer to the thread title would be: Does not make any difference wether you stay in the EC or not to the GB's in Switzerland.

I know nobody expects this to happen at the moment. But one thing is for sure: If it does, it does here.

Indeed, we are all going through a double whammy- and some of us more than others.

[lewton]

	Quote:	curley
	Actually I just wondered: What if the Swiss vote yes on the latest SVP initiative, Switzerland cancels the free movement of people agreement? The answer to the thread title would be: Does not make any difference wether you stay in the EC or not to the GB's in Switzerland. I know nobody expects this to happen at the moment. But one thing is for sure: If it does, it does here.

They did it?
I had given up hope that they would dare do that.

	Quote:
	so when we mentionned 'Little England' and were told we were rude - we were quite accurate then

Nothing "little" about a European nation of forty odd million.

Funny coming from a Swiss, though.

[John William]

	Quote:
	Nothing "little" about a European nation of forty odd million. Funny coming from a Swiss, though.

Although there's nothing funny about the national obsession ( football ) and the 52 years of hurt and
counting since England last won the World Cup !!

To many a bigger disaster than Brexit.

[curley]

	Quote:	lewton
	They did it? I had given up hope that they would dare do that.

They did what?

There is no voting here before end of November.

Is this an English thing to hope things but not bother what's actually happening?
LOL, sorry, not personal.