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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #16341  
Old 10.01.2019, 23:11
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Totally agree.
Let's do this b***s!
Let's see which union will survive hard Brexit.
Both.
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  #16342  
Old 10.01.2019, 23:53
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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swiss and UK have already signed their agreements
From 20 Dec 2018...

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Our citizens’ rights agreement with Switzerland also covers arrangements for the unlikely scenario that no deal is concluded with the EU by the time we leave. Even in this situation, the rights of UK nationals already living in Switzerland will be covered in the same way, with some small differences to the social security coordination arrangements. We are in the process of finalising “no deal” arrangements with Liechtenstein and the EEA EFTA states, and plan to publish a similar agreement with these countries very soon.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/m...-liechtenstein

No deal would make a difference to Brits it Switzerland. It may be minor, but it's not, by far, the only consideration to those of us who still have close ties to the UK.

I was talking to a friend last night, a fellow expat who I've known for 35yrs. He's soon to return from a month in the UK visiting his elderly parents, adult children and grandchildren. He's a very level headed kind of guy, so I was surprised (to say the least) when he said he can't wait to leave the place because "It's horrific".
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  #16343  
Old 11.01.2019, 08:01
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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......when he said he can't wait to leave the place because "It's horrific".
Cheap comment really, trying to imply the whole of the UK is horrific.

Last time I was there , I thought it was wonderful.

All depends where you are, same as anywhere.
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  #16344  
Old 11.01.2019, 08:25
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Cheap comment really, trying to imply the whole of the UK is horrific.

Last time I was there , I thought it was wonderful.
It's completely different living there vs visiting there. The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards as well as a breakdown of law and order with decreased policing and increased violence. Many major cities in the UK can truly be described as awful places to live if you don't have the cash to insulate yourself. I certainly wouldn't move back there now.
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  #16345  
Old 11.01.2019, 09:19
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It's completely different living there vs visiting there. The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards as well as a breakdown of law and order with decreased policing and increased violence. Many major cities in the UK can truly be described as awful places to live if you don't have the cash to insulate yourself. I certainly wouldn't move back there now.
I guess it's because of the EU membership, but will be improving fast soon after Brexit.
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  #16346  
Old 11.01.2019, 09:34
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I guess it's because of the EU membership, but will be improving fast soon after Brexit.
Britains social decline has been a gradual process spurred by decades of political incompetence... Brexit is a bump along the way and I can't see it helping living standards overmuch at least in the next decade or so while we transition. Brexit or no Brexit, the damage has already been done.
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  #16347  
Old 11.01.2019, 10:12
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards .
50 years ago only the rich had a telephone, a fridge, a television, a car or central heating. I would say the standard of living has increased hugely in that time as poor people believe it's their right to be able to have all those things.
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  #16348  
Old 11.01.2019, 10:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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50 years ago only the rich had a telephone, a fridge, a television, a car or central heating. I would say the standard of living has increased hugely in that time as poor people believe it's their right to be able to have all those things.
50 years ago was only 1969. Where the hell were you living at that time?

My grandparents lived on a bog-standard housing estate and had all those things, same as the rest of the estates in the area. And this wasn't down in some prissy London "Margo and Jerry" suburb, either.

It's nothing to do with people "believing it's their right". Manufacturing and materials costs came down which brought the cost of items down, making it more affordable to more people.

Ironically, it's mostly due to business with the EU (in its various incantations over the years) which made things more cost effective and competitive.
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  #16349  
Old 11.01.2019, 10:45
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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50 years ago was only 1969. Where the hell were you living at that time?

My grandparents lived on a bog-standard housing estate and had all those things, same as the rest of the estates in the area. And this wasn't down in some prissy London "Margo and Jerry" suburb, either.

It's nothing to do with people "believing it's their right". Manufacturing and materials costs came down which brought the cost of items down, making it more affordable to more people.

Ironically, it's mostly due to business with the EU (in its various incantations over the years) which made things more cost effective and competitive.
Clearly a modern housing estate.
Existing Council houses definitely did not have central heating, people shared phones.

My grandmother was nursed at home for the last 6 months of her life, she died in 1976, her day nurse who was married did not have a fridge & my grandmother left her her fridge in her will.

in 1971 there were 19 million cars in the UK (population 56 million) by 2007 were 31 million cars (Population 61 million) Car ownership grew far faster than the population in general as standard of living increased in those 36 years.
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  #16350  
Old 11.01.2019, 10:54
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Project fear over estimated Bank job losses
https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/in...094803896.html
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  #16351  
Old 11.01.2019, 10:56
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Clearly a modern housing estate.
Existing Council houses definitely did not have central heating, people shared phones.

My grandmother was nursed at home for the last 6 months of her life, she died in 1976, her day nurse who was married did not have a fridge & my grandmother left her her fridge in her will.
So all just anecdotal then. So nobody is right or wrong in this case.

Don't know what the council houses were like where you were but my sister just moved into an ex council house which most definitely did come with central heating put in when the house was built and replaced in the last few years.

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in 1971 there were 19 million cars in the UK (population 56 million) by 2007 were 31 million cars (Population 61 million) Car ownership grew far faster than the population in general as standard of living increased in those 36 years.
Or...

More women went out to work in the ensuing years and the family needed or could afford more than one car.

Agree that the standard of living increased in that time. Everything became more affordable and people travelled more.

Shame it's all on the brink of going back to the dark ages. Almost makes you nostalgic.
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  #16352  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:06
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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50 years ago only the rich had a telephone, a fridge, a television, a car or central heating. I would say the standard of living has increased hugely in that time as poor people believe it's their right to be able to have all those things.
I know, right. These uppity poor people demand a lot, don't the? They should feel themselves lucky they aren't tilling the fields for their feudal lord FMF...maybe after Brexit we can get back to these traditional values.
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  #16353  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:12
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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More women went out to work in the ensuing years and the family needed or could afford more than one car.

Agree that the standard of living increased in that time. Everything became more affordable and people travelled more.
So we both don't accept Richdog's claim, "The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards."
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  #16354  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:14
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I know, right. These uppity poor people demand a lot, don't the? They should feel themselves lucky they aren't tilling the fields for their feudal lord FMF...maybe after Brexit we can get back to these traditional values.
I never said that, stop being a jerk, I was refuting the claim 'The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards'
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  #16355  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:16
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I never said that, stop being a jerk, I was refuting a claim 'The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards'
Depends on the time frame I suppose. Are we saying it is better to live in the UK now than it was in 1880, then you'd probably say yes. If we are saying was it better in 2014 than 2018, well then I am sure there are some stats somewhere which will tell us.
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  #16356  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:22
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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So we both don't accept Richdog's claim, "The UK is experiencing a consistent decline in living standards."
No. We are discussing the rate of ownership of white goods, cars and telephones in the late sixties. He was, quite rightly, pointing out the the socio-economic failures over the years in public services.

You quoted only half his sentence then took it into an anecdotal discussion about material goods.

I didn't see it as anything deeper than that.
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  #16357  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:22
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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50 years ago only the rich had a telephone, a fridge, a television, a car or central heating.
Nonsense!

70 years ago, my grandparents (a factory work and a beautician) had TWO phones with separate numbers, as well as a fridge, car, and central heating.

Hell, even my mother had a car 60 years ago as a teenager! (apparently, I was conceived in the back seat )

Tom
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  #16358  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:26
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Depends on the time frame I suppose. Are we saying it is better to live in the UK now than it was in 1880, then you'd probably say yes. If we are saying was it better in 2014 than 2018, well then I am sure there are some stats somewhere which will tell us.
The time frame I calmed was the last 50 years, stop trying to twist what I am saying. You know perfectly well since 1880 or 1969 standard of living has increased in the UK.

Any recent reduction can probably be blamed on over use of easy credit, which was not easily available in 1969.
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  #16359  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:29
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Any recent reduction can probably be blamed on over use of easy credit, which was not easily available in 1969.
How does that justify the crippling underfunding of the NHS, Police force, education, and all the other public services crumbling away?

All on the dodgy never-never?
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  #16360  
Old 11.01.2019, 11:34
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Any recent reduction can probably be blamed on over use of easy credit, which was not easily available in 1969.
Because it wasn't needed in 1969 - the multiple of the average salary to buy the average house was much lower. See, not every aspect of living conditions improves over time...
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