The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[John William]

At last the first of the British Govt Public Information films

Here's the first of the 1960's era public information films being recycled ( due to the Hard Brexit short
notice ) by the UK to give the British transport industry and it's drivers a foretaste of the red tape and
customs procedures they are likely to encounter after the 29th March; when driving to and from
the continent.

In fact what about the UK and the EU trading under TIR rules after Brexit ??

Surprised TIR hasn't been mentioned at all during the run up to Brexit, as it's still there and in force
in many countries although since the formation of the EU:
The TIR procedure is mostly used in Eastern European countries that are not in the EU, namely Russia,
Ukraine & Turkey, and parts of the Near East. Since the formation of the EU single market, the TIR
procedure has become unnecessary for intra-EU goods transport.


British Public Information film about Continental driving under TIR rules

	Quote:	Urs Max
	As ever so often, Loz, perhaps read what you link. Heiko Maas: "The agreement stands, as it is. I doubt very much that the agreement can be fundamentally reopened. If there were a better solution, it would already have been put forward."

Germany's Maas: We need to talk about whether to reopen Brexit accord

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Germany's Maas: We need to talk about whether to reopen Brexit accord

Apart from the obvious semantics, how is that fundamentally different from what Urs Max wrote?

[Blueangel]

Me watching Boris Johnson's speech.

How does this work?

[baboon]

	Quote:	John William
	At last the first of the British Govt Public Information films Here's the first of the 1960's era public information films being recycled ( due to the Hard Brexit short notice ) by the UK to give the British transport industry and it's drivers a foretaste of the red tape and customs procedures they are likely to encounter after the 29th March; when driving to and from the continent. In fact what about the UK and the EU trading under TIR rules after Brexit ?? Surprised TIR hasn't been mentioned at all during the run up to Brexit, as it's still there and in force in many countries although since the formation of the EU: The TIR procedure is mostly used in Eastern European countries that are not in the EU, namely Russia, Ukraine & Turkey, and parts of the Near East. Since the formation of the EU single market, the TIR procedure has become unnecessary for intra-EU goods transport. British Public Information film about Continental driving under TIR rules

I guess Ireland would use this for trans-shipments. However for the UK it is largely irrelevant as - excepting stuff transiting the EU to non-EU countries - the EU border is the relevant one regardless of which EU country the shipment might be going to. So for all EU exports the border will always be Dover/Calais or whatever as there is no further relevant international transit thereafter.

[John William]

	Quote:	John William
	At last the first of the British Govt Public Information films Here's the first of the 1960's era public information films being recycled ( due to the Hard Brexit short notice ) by the UK to give the British transport industry and it's drivers a foretaste of the red tape and customs procedures they are likely to encounter after the 29th March; when driving to and from the continent. In fact what about the UK and the EU trading under TIR rules after Brexit ?? Surprised TIR hasn't been mentioned at all during the run up to Brexit, as it's still there and in force in many countries although since the formation of the EU: The TIR procedure is mostly used in Eastern European countries that are not in the EU, namely Russia, Ukraine & Turkey, and parts of the Near East. Since the formation of the EU single market, the TIR procedure has become unnecessary for intra-EU goods transport. British Public Information film about Continental driving under TIR rules

Yes here it is although the TIR Convention is now called the Common Transit Convention CTC and
Britain has announced it will sign up for it ( although to all intents and purposes it already is in
the CTC but as a member state of the EU )
Anyway regardless of whether the UK has a Hard Brexit or not, the UK becomes a member of the
CTC after 29th March.

Which means the above video is very apt in relation to what International trade and lorry transport
was like before the UK joined the Common Market, that became the EU and no doubt will return
to again with a Hard Brexit !!

Gov,uk - Britain to remain in the Common Transit Convention after Brexit

[curley]

	Quote:	John William
	At last the first of the British Govt Public Information films

Two guys per truck. Those were the days.

[TobiasM]

	Quote:	justpassingby
	The talk was with the British Ambassador and representatives of the Swiss and English departments for Brexit. They said the details are on their websites. I‘d have to find them. Gov.uk and British embassy for Switzerland. They said deal and no deal are covered in their talks. Sure they can lie as can everyone (who are stretching the truth continually) Brexit is very emotional but last night was very calm and factual. I recommend going to a roadshow if you get the chance. Just my opinion

Lol, I was there and it really hadn't progressed on from last years suppositions.

Key points like there will be no change to flights to Switzerland from the UK, were damn obvious, that has nothing to do with Brexit as BA and other airlines pay for their slots.

They haven't taken into account what Switzerland will do if its forced to change its own deals with the EU following Brexit.

Loved the ambiguous slogan in the corner though. Business is Great

It should have been followed with tagline, just not in Britain.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	baboon
	I guess Ireland would use this for trans-shipments. However for the UK it is largely irrelevant as - excepting stuff transiting the EU to non-EU countries - the EU border is the relevant one regardless of which EU country the shipment might be going to. So for all EU exports the border will always be Dover/Calais or whatever as there is no further relevant international transit thereafter.

Not sure if that's still possible (I'd be surprised if it didn't) but in the TIR times trucks were often checked (and sealed) at the origin to avoid/reduce waiting times abroad. That said, the waiting times of old would still be far too long today, and the risk of a supply chain breakdown (caused by a strike for example) probably inacceptable for JIT and related production principles.

[baboon]

	Quote:	John William
	Yes here it is although the TIR Convention is now called the Common Transit Convention CTC ....

Actually it isn't - it's a separate thing. TIR also still exists and covers more countries than CTC.
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_custom...d-transport_en
Although for both the EU is - as I said earlier - a single territory so CTC is in reality of limited relevance as the final destination is simply the EU and therefore the first port of entry.

[justpassingby]

i guess different viewpoints have different interpretations of presentations but that’s fine.

And just to complete my story, I complained to the FT and they apologized for how I felt, offering incentives to stay with them, but I canceled with appropriate refund.

Now let‘s see what comes.

[marton]

	Quote:	baboon
	I guess Ireland would use this for trans-shipments. However for the UK it is largely irrelevant as - excepting stuff transiting the EU to non-EU countries - the EU border is the relevant one regardless of which EU country the shipment might be going to. So for all EU exports the border will always be Dover/Calais or whatever as there is no further relevant international transit thereafter.

Important export markets for UK that might require truck deliveries and so TIR are Turkey, Switzerland and Norway(food and beverages only).

[Odile]

Weird that everyone I meet last few days say to me/us 'OMG what a mess- are they totally mad?'

[bigblue2]

	Quote:	Odile
	Weird that everyone I meet last few days say to me/us 'OMG what a mess- are they totally mad?'

and the answer to that is yes

[TobiasM]

Hmmm, looking at the audience in Derby, well what can you say?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...al-Brexit.html

[Odile]

Demographics in action- this Saturday is a big day:

From Polly Toynbee int he Guardian:

You could call it swing Saturday or crossover day, for this Saturday, 19 January, marks an important moment. This is the day, in theory, when the country turns remain. Even if not a single person has changed their mind since the referendum, the demographic shift alone will have done the heavy lifting. Enough old leavers will have died and enough young remainers will have come on to the electoral register to turn the dial on what the country thinks about Brexit.

The psephologist and founding YouGov president, Peter Kellner, calculates that the leave vote has been declining by about 1,350 a day, taking into account the differential turnout: the young turn out to vote much less often than the old. By using exactly the same proportion of every age group turning out to vote exactly as they did in 2016, demographics alone will have transformed the UK into a remainer nation.

	Quote:	Odile
	Demographics in action- this Saturday is a big day: From Polly Toynbee int he Guardian: You could call it swing Saturday or crossover day, for this Saturday, 19 January, marks an important moment. This is the day, in theory, when the country turns remain. Even if not a single person has changed their mind since the referendum, the demographic shift alone will have done the heavy lifting. Enough old leavers will have died and enough young remainers will have come on to the electoral register to turn the dial on what the country thinks about Brexit. The psephologist and founding YouGov president, Peter Kellner, calculates that the leave vote has been declining by about 1,350 a day, taking into account the differential turnout: the young turn out to vote much less often than the old. By using exactly the same proportion of every age group turning out to vote exactly as they did in 2016, demographics alone will have transformed the UK into a remainer nation.

Poly Toynbee is 72 and obviously far too old to have an opinion. I think she should just STFU.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	curley
	Two guys per truck. Those were the days.

Before a tachometer

[Odile]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Poly Toynbee is 72 and obviously far too old to have an opinion. I think she should just STFU.

She didn't give an opinion - but just facts.

OH is 73, and has more brains than a lot of young people I know, for sure.

[Fish Paste]

It could be Brexit is dead.
Now we have an impasse.

No deal Brexit is not going to be allowed.
May’s Deal Brexit was the only show in town, and was voted down.

There is no other deal to be had (imo) and the brexiteers should have taken it, to improve upon in the future.

Now anything can happen, referendum, GE, Article 50 extension, Article 50 cancelled, May could resign, EU elections.
In Merkel’s words, it’s a shitstorm.

Makes me proud to be British.