The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[greenmount]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	Article 50 defines the 2 year term, not Theresa May. Also, I believe that the proposed deal between UK and EU was the best result that could be achieved at that point in time. The EU's intention was to make it unattractive for a country to leave but I don't believe that anybody realistic in the EU ever expected this deal to be signed by the UK as it isn't exactly a good deal. I'm not sure if May did well but at least she has bigger balls than the undemocratic Cameron, who poorly organized a referendum, refused to implement a deal and ran off with his tail between his legs.

I wonder if you believe what you write or is just part of your anti-EU plethora.
The article 50 defines the term and many other articles define other things too and they are not always strictly followed (e.g. see the recommended budget deficits always exceeded in some of the euro area countries ) but it could have been negotiated if UK really wanted that. Let's face it, she's no better than Cameron, she thought that if she played tough she'd get the best deals.

"EU" which is comically personified as an enemy unit when a state-member doesn't get what they want (usually to be allowed to have "more equal" rights than the rest) consists of a bunch of countries that decide together at the end of the day.

	Quote:	k_and_e
	The countries have to agree but it is definitely the EU that is negotiating. Also, there is no deal with individual countries but a deal with the EU.

The countries are the EU. They decided that any deal is supposed to be a compromise serving the interests of each and all of them. We will say it over and over again till this is understood even in the back of the class... Mr. Wilders, would you pay attention once?

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	greenmount
	I wonder if you believe what you write or is just part of your anti-EU plethora. The article 50 defines the term and many other articles define other things too and they are not always strictly followed (e.g. see the recommended budget deficits always exceeded in some of the euro area countries ) but it could have been negotiated if UK really wanted that. Let's face it, she's no better than Cameron, she thought that if she played tough she'd get the best deals. "EU" which is comically personified as an enemy unit when a state-member doesn't get what they want (usually to be allowed to have "more equal" rights than the rest) consists of a bunch of countries that decide together at the end of the day. The countries are the EU. They decided that any deal is supposed to be a compromise serving the interests of each and all of them. We will say it over and over again till this is understood even in the back of the class... Mr. Wilders, would you pay attention once?

Thanks for putting me in the extreme right corner. Much appreciated.

[Troublawesome]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	Thanks for putting me in the extreme right corner. Much appreciated.

Exactly where you belong.

	Quote:	Odile
	Andrew Neil is not always a friend of the remain cause- but he pulverised that stupid man. And yet, they continue to spout, WTO rules, no problem- even here on EF, again and again. Do they actually understand what it means, or ...?!?! Oh and here are a few silly maps for a giggle - you have to try and laugh or else .... https://inktank.fi/12-fun-maps-that-...HOT5nyiZ3cxLJQ

Funny how Remainers firmly believe Andrew Neil is out to get them. He's just doing what he always does, which is to give both sides a hard time. This is what makes him the best in the business. That "man" fortunately isn't in government, rather he's a political commentator. Just imagine though if he was, I don't know, Shadow Home Secretary?

What It’s Like to Die Horribly on a BBC Politics Show

[Odile]

Stupidity and nonsense are the same- politician or not.

So what is the answer to Andrew Neil's comment- pray tell? You obviously must know, or you wouldn't be daft enough to stick your neck out.

: ???

	Quote:	Odile
	Stupidity and nonsense are the same- politician or not. So what is the answer to Andrew Neil's comment- pray tell? You obviously must know, or you wouldn't be daft enough to stick your neck out. : ???

The answer was dead simple that I'm very surprised he didn't come to it. Leave under no deal then you have zero tariffs with the EU for a set period in order to minimise disruption, say 6-12 months. If no trade deal is struck, you then follow this period by echoing the tariffs that the EU applies on its imports. It's not rocket science.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	The answer was dead simple that I'm very surprised he didn't come to it. Leave under no deal then you have zero tariffs with the EU for a set period in order to minimise disruption, say 6-12 months. If no trade deal is struck, you then follow this period by echoing the tariffs that the EU applies on its imports. It's not rocket science.

How do you have zero tariffs with the EU for a set period when there is no deal with the EU for this set period.

Under WTO rules whatever tariffs you apply to EU imports you have to apply to imports from all countries

	Quote:	marton
	How do you have zero tariffs with the EU for a set period when there is no deal with the EU for this set period. Under WTO rules whatever tariffs you apply to EU imports you have to apply to imports from all countries

That's why it would be for a set period. A country has never left the EU before so I think there is some leeway, if not then the UK can simply have tariff free imports from all countries for a set period of time until it gets its act together. Most of the tariffs that are currently collected go straight to Brussels anyhow.

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	That's why it would be for a set period. A country has never left the EU before so I think there is some leeway, if not then the UK can simply have tariff free imports from all countries for a set period of time until it gets its act together. Most of the tariffs that are currently collected go straight to Brussels anyhow.

The point of tariffs is to protect local businesses; tariff free imports from all countries will wipe out British farming and most of British manufacturing.

[Odile]

Don't know whether to laugh or cry. And this, Mesdames et Messieurs, this is what we are up against.

[marton]

Key EU medicines regulator closes London office with loss of 900 jobs
European Medicines Agency heads for Amsterdam 63 days before Brexit

[Fish Paste]

Seems to be 2 interesting amendments next week.
1) Labour - no ‘no deal’ brexit, binding.
2) Tory - no ‘no deal’ brexit, advisory.

2) is designed to stop the tories voting with Labour, however I think there is such a lack of trust, Labour will get it.

[Fish Paste]

duplicate

	Quote:	marton
	The point of tariffs is to protect local businesses; tariff free imports from all countries will wipe out British farming and most of British manufacturing.

Yes, which is why it’s a set period and there’s mechanisms that can be used to offset this like reducing VAT.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	Troublawesome
	Exactly where you belong.

Then please explain why, instead of making silly statements.

Note that I am pro-Brexit but also pro-EU.

[Odile]

In the meantime, Farage has just got himself an upgrade- from 'being of interest' to FBI, to being actively investigated, and BoJo too, together with Bannon.

Hope the dreaded Isabel Oakeshott gets to be prosecuted as a traitor for hiding the facts she knew about all along:

https://bylinetimes.com/2019/01/25/b...VBVRCZ2221tO8M

[marton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Yes, which is why it’s a set period and there’s mechanisms that can be used to offset this like reducing VAT.

Like to explain how reducing VAT will stop UK farmers being wiped out by zero import tariffs when VAT on food is already mostly zero??

[22 yards]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	Note that I am pro-Brexit but also pro-EU.

How does that work, then? You're all for a union of countries (presumably because you believe the countries are better/stronger together than individually), but you don't like the idea of the UK benefiting from this arrangement?

[22 yards]

	Quote:	marton
	Like to explain how reducing VAT will stop UK farmers being wiped out by zero import tariffs when VAT on food is already mostly zero??

Negative VAT, marton, obviously. Loz's proposed -35% rate of VAT will see British consumers paid to Buy British.

	Quote:	marton
	Like to explain how reducing VAT will stop UK farmers being wiped out by zero import tariffs when VAT on food is already mostly zero??

Farmers are still protected by non tariff barriers plus as it would be time limited then you could utilise some short term government subsidies.