The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[John William]

	Quote:	marton
	I also belong to a UK based pro Brexit forum. One recent example is people will need to change their habits and learn to eat Cheddar cheese instead of French cheese. Firstly it is patriotic and secondly there is no guarantee French cheese will continue to be available at competitive prices. Nobody painted that on a bus!

Oh yes - I can just see it now - Sir Bruce Forsyth's I'm backing Britain song to be released on
the Brexiteer DVD label in association with PYE records for the princely sum of 5 shillings !!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdCPiIwp4gk

[Blueangel]

	Quote:
	My point is that rather than listening to what Polly Toynbee and people on EF say people are thinking and saying, we should listen to what the people themselves are saying - and what they are saying, in my experience, is not what Polly Toynbee and people on EF are saying they're saying. Any clearer?

I'm in Switzerland because of the prospect of the EU Referendum. My partner came home from a night shift, after watching a tv debate about the prospect of a refendum in work, and said he had a bad feeling about it all. He wanted to leave the country and asked me to leave with him. The people on his international team of colleagues, were all nervous about it.

Between September 2016 and June 2018, I spent over 6mths in the UK, and entirely in a town that is resolutely Labour and Leave. Yet if I say what I heard and saw there, it's fobbed off as anecdotal. Twice, I literally threw tradesmen out of my home there. They were only invited to quote for work, but went off on one about Brexit. One told my OH "You speak good English for a foreigner" then told me "You don't want gas fires cos these foreigners don't know how to use them". A third guy phoned back with his quote but said he didn't want to work for me because my partner is a foreigner. I was stunned that he went to the trouble of phoning back.

	Quote:
	Again, for the hard of thinking: lots of people, both in newspapers and here on EF, have tried to explain why people voted for Brexit. Rather than listen to second-hand opinions, I have gone and read what Brexit voters are saying in their own words. I thought, perhaps, that people might be interested in seeing what I have learnt there. Obviously I was wrong.

I still log onto the website for my hometown local rag in the UK, at least once a week (it's a hard habit to break). The comments sections have been littered with Leave voters diatribes for over 2yrs now. I only have to read Lisa Nandy's twitter feed to get a feel of the town. She's walking a knife edge of being elected on an anti-austerity Labour platform but enacting the Leave vote of her constituents. She still gets regular abuse for standing up against Corbyn in 2016, with added derision from Leave voters who don't trust her to do their bidding. She can't win, but still does her best to appease all sides whilst doing the job she was elected to do.

On the flipside, the town where my vote is registered (last place of residence in the UK), is resolutely Conservative and Remain, yet the local Conservative MP is an avid Leaver.

[RufusB]

	Quote:	marton
	Voting for MPs in UK is local so people vote on local issues not national, it is fanciful to believe MPs would be voted out on national issues.

You could argue this happened to Nick Clegg over university fees.

[Odile]

	Quote:
	If it is a forum from Cannock, it is very much self-selecting. Most of the mutants there haven't developed the opposable thumbs needed to open a laptop. Some of them might have some luck with their prehensile tails though.

One of the people I am regularly in touch with, and totally on the remain side- is a young man who was our lodger in Leics. Recently retrained as primary teacher working with special needs and social services. From just round the corner from Cannock- he even looks like a younger version of DB and often wondered if they are related Totally opposite pov though- but same accent

[MusicChick]

	Quote:	marton
	I am surprised you are attempting to drive division rather than unity?

Unity of opinion? Of course that I am protecting the opposite, should it suit the issue.

[Odile]

From DB 'I have gone and read what Brexit voters are saying in their own words.'

yes, it is good to talk to people who are experiencing it all first hand. Which is why I've been doing just the same, but different- in touch with groups of people all over the UK, but especially in NE (North East not Neuchâtel) - and 'talk' to them on daily basis. Not 'elites', not 'Guardianistas' - real people, directly affected- and who see Brexit as a massive lie, that will leave them a lot poorer, without jobs, and with NHS, social services and education, and so much more, in total disarray and even worse lack of funding.

It has divided families and communities, friends, colleagues - and people are truly scared and in despair.

[RufusB]

	Quote:	Odile
	From DB 'I have gone and read what Brexit voters are saying in their own words.' yes, it is good to talk to people who are experiencing it all first hand. Which is why I've been doing just the same, but different- in touch with groups of people all over the UK, but especially in NE (North East not Neuchâtel) - and 'talk' to them on daily basis. Not 'elites', not 'Guardianistas' - real people, directly affected- and who see Brexit as a massive lie, that will leave them a lot poorer, without jobs, and with NHS, social services and education, and so much more, in total disarray and even worse lack of funding. It has divided families and communities, friends, colleagues - and people are truly scared and in despair.

Well I live in the North West, have family even further North and have friends from Southampton to Glasgow and all points in between. Anecdote: My parents voted one way, I voted another. No division here because we are entirely capable of separating political viewpoints from familial relationships. We're mostly just getting on with it because, well, we live here. I'd say we're more pissed off and incredulous than anything else, whichever way we voted.

The NHS, social services and education funding have been dire since well before Cameron waded in.

[John William]

Chris Grayling Brexited from Calais

I see the first of Britain's Brexit Ministers has been banned from setting foot in the Port of Calais,
as a result of a bitter row that the Transport Secretary, Chris Grayling had with the head of the
Port of Calais, Jean-Marc Puissesseau. In which Grayling reckoned Calais isn't up to the job of
handling Post Brexit trade in the event of a No Deal Brexit and therefore Chris Grayling's
looking at diverting cross channel traffic to Ostend instead.

Politics Home - Chris Grayling banned from the Port of Calais

Yep, no one divided or at loggerheads in Hampshire either. Most folks are Remain down here, with many students/younger folk about.

If anything people are united in disgust at the government and let-everyone-down Corbyn; we've no opposition, no balance, the HOC is just one big blob of crap.. and the dodgy ERG is the tail that wags the dog. Anyway, there's an apathy and a disgust down this neck of the woods.

And, btw, a retired teacher neighbour of mine and a very good friend voted for Brexit. He is not at all comfortable with the EU and wants rid - he's not thick, not racist or hateful in any way. I don't agree with him on many points, but he's still my friend.

I don't get the hate, to be honest - we'd get through this sh!te quicker without it.

[John William]

Hitting the British charts on the run up to Brexit Day is an old Doris Day song which epitomises a
Hard Brexit and could reach the Top 20 by the 29th March.

Que será, será, Whatever will Be, will Be, The future's not ours to see, Que será, será

[greenmount]

	Quote:	John William
	Que será, será, Whatever will Be, will Be, The future's not ours to see, Que será, será

Indeed, que sera, sera. I was never really surprised by "Brexit", only by the way it was done (what a disappointment, it really shows no country deserves unconditional respect, ha!) and the fact that it's still a huge issue two years after...
It's a long and not at all an amiable "divorce", but that was to be expected.. I don't understand the anger and the accusations towards EU. Each party tries to protect their own interests. There are tough negotiators on each side, but it's the EU who has a (much) better leverage. It's like in almost every other situation but people became acutely aware only now. Call it "bullying" if it makes someone feel better (isn't it always "bullying" when it happens to us?), but it really is... business as usual.
Que sera, sera.

[Odile]

A dangerous fantasy, sold to the most vulnerable via lies and fraud. Lammy says it well:

https://www.indy100.com/article/davi...-video-8724301

[amogles]

	Quote:	RufusB
	The NHS, social services and education funding have been dire since well before Cameron waded in.

This.


All been in terminal decline, definitely since the 1980s.


To blame it all on one particular government or on Brexit (or on the EU even) is cherry picking in my view.


If you want things to work, you need to spend time, energy and money fixing them. Just throwing some money around here and there only to quietly take it back at the next budget isn't the way to build a world class healthcare or education system.

[Odile]

Of course, do you think Brexit will deliver on this however?


Not always been a fan of Baroness Varsi, but she says it as it is:

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4New...1683058285326/

[baboon]

Interesting piece here basically rubbishing the dire predictions of e-day shortages (completely agree btw - there might be some hiccups but nothing as drastic as some are claiming), focusing instead on the longer term and how the EU are likely to, erm...encourage the UKs few remaining industries to relocate.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ain-industries

[bigblue2]

remember a couple of years ago when some french port strikers decided to nick a ferry life boat and drive it around the port for a couple of days, just for kicks, and the chaos that caused in Kent?

Now imagine what will happen if the French / EU decide to start checking lorries and paperwork for ever vehicle, if they allow stowaways into the uk, so the uk then has to check every vehicle as it enters, not a lot of free space in Dover and none at arrivals of the tunnel.

So yes, fresh food shortages are a real possibility, Kent county council are busily planning the new operation stack at manston airport, which in itself is a joke as there are no main roads or motorways from the port or tunnel into manston.

Given the french like to riot at the drop of a hat at the best of times the weeks post brexit will be interesting times.

ETA - I've taken the tunnel many many times over the years, when one train broke down (not in the tunnel) it caused 8 hour delays, that was just them being one train down!!

[greenmount]

	Quote:	bigblue2
	Given the french like to riot at the drop of a hat at the best of times the weeks post brexit will be interesting times.

Sounds like a cliche but it's so true...

[Odile]

LIE.... and deny. Lie ... and deny. Lie.... and deny- and on and on- Then blame the EU, of course:

https://www.facebook.com/LBC/videos/405892626882968/

That look when your mum and dad come home from parents evening.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:
	That look when your mum and dad come home from parents evening.

Perfect material for a meme.