The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[bowlie]

0735 GMT 2,451,828 signatures,

Only another 15m to go. Of course this not vote of the British electorate, it is a vote of citizens and residents.

P.S. Ms May. In a democrachy the will of the people can change. (Look what happened between Cameron’s and your elections) And I suspect that given the choice of no deal, the deal on the table or going back to square one the will of the people could well have changed.

[gaburko]

	Quote:	bowlie
	P.S. Ms May. In a democrachy the will of the people can change. (Look what happened between Cameron’s and your elections) And I suspect that given the choice of no deal, the deal on the table or going back to square one the will of the people could well have changed.

Get rid of the Parliament and the Government and re-institute the Monarchy! Screw democracy, Make Britain Great again!

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	bowlie
	0735 GMT P.S. Ms May. In a democrachy the will of the people can change. (Look what happened between Cameron’s and your elections) And I suspect that given the choice of no deal, the deal on the table or going back to square one the will of the people could well have changed.

There are several types of democracy. The will of the people only has legal form where you have a sovereign people, Switzerland and Ireland come to mind.

Taking back control should probably start with a discussion on the type of democracy the country should have.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	lewton
	You must really like May if you can force yourself to focus on the 2-week unconditional extension instead of the 2-month conditional extension.

I think its been correctly mapped out now though by Europe hasnt it ? They know that May's deal wont pass, they have given a 2 week but instead of saying "and thats it" they have said "in which you can present your alternative" which is the beautifully delivered cross for a Boris Johnson let thumping header which is leadership challenge / governement Collapse / general election which then leads to second referendum which then leads to article 50 revocation which then leads us back to where it all started.

It's actually delivered pretty impressively in terms of political engineering.

The real question, is who is in on it ? Tony Blair - definitely. all the EU leaders - definitely.

Some of the cabinet have talked to the EU negotiating team ? Probably.

Is May herself in on it which is why she gave the stinging speech to wind them up ? Possibly, would show amazing courage to pull of that kind of trick.

Is all of our parliament in on it ? Could it be, that they all know what the Master plan is and the whole thing is a well planned charade to move the country back to where they want it to be while making the people think its just an unlucky combination of events ? that'd be a shocker but you never know.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	I have the impression the FvD are quickly toning down their anti EU propaganda now they may have been voted into a position where they may actually have to deliver something?

Didm't Baudert say something along the lines of, that if Britain leaves the EU, he sees it as the Dutch duty to replace them in being the biggest thorn in the EU's side?

If that's toning it down, I'm curious to know what toning it up would be.

[amogles]

	Quote:	EdwinNL
	Why would they? Also elections voor de EU in May, but the most important ones are scheduled for March 2021, surely they can give and take some, but letting go of their main issues would devastate them for the national elections for parliament, if they can keep up a good show there is even more growth in it for them and if the current trend keeps on and they can form a coalition in one way or the other Thierry has even a chance of becoming prime-minister.

Especially if the PVV collapses, FvD needs to play tough to pick up as many of the voters as possible.

A bit like Salvini playing tough to impress all the 5-star and Forza voters who are disillusioned with their own parties. And if the opinion polls are anything to go by, making a very good job of it.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	amogles
	Didm't Baudert say something along the lines of, that if Britain leaves the EU, he sees it as the Dutch duty to replace them in being the biggest thorn in the EU's side?

I think that's a reasonable statement because I always expected the Dutch to jump first, and I believe they would have, but Wilders just couldn't keep himself out of court for 5 mins.

Just checked the petition over 10mins, and it's still receiving 37 signatures per second.
10:32 2,728,265
10:42 2,750,513

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Just checked the petition over 10mins, and it's still receiving 37 signatures per second. 10:32 2,728,265 10:42 2,750,513

One thing I don't get is why people are shouting all over the internet that "It's the Russians, don't you know??!!"

Didn't Putin want the UK out of the EU and eventually for the EU to be broken up? Why would Russia be overplaying a petition to REVERSE Article 50?

It was more of an idle musing as I've been reading Tweets, FB rants, tabloid comments, etc.

[gaburko]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	One thing I don't get is why people are shouting all over the internet that "It's the Russians, don't you know??!!"

I think the Russians themselves are dumbfounded. Comrade Putin, we don't know how, but they've screwed themselves without our tourists visiting this time.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	One thing I don't get is why people are shouting all over the internet that "It's the Russians, don't you know??!!"

I'm dealing with the opposite. OH has become a little too enthralled with the petition, possible DOSS, etc... (Greek Geek) A few hours after he'd gone to bed, he randomly shouted out the latest total, which scared the living daylights out of me, then had the audacity to wake me at 5:30 with an update. I'm not impressed...

[amogles]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	Didn't Putin want the UK out of the EU and eventually for the EU to be broken up? Why would Russia be overplaying a petition to REVERSE Article 50?

I thought the tin-foil-hat folks were saying Putin was backing both sides because what he really wants is to sow as much discord as possible.

Like the cruel master who throws a dry and worthless bone to his dogs just because he likes to watch them fight over it.

[Sandgrounder]

I'm dead...

https://newsthump.com/2019/03/22/man...gzQDkCBpE4OZ-A

	Quote:
	Man who spent two years saying ‘we’re leaving on 29th March so suck it up snowflake’ eerily quiet this morning [...] Simon Williams has been telling everyone that we’re leaving on 29th March ‘no matter what you snowflakes think’ in just about every online discussion he’s lost in the last two years, and was flatly refusing to accept reality this morning. He told us, “Leaving on the 29th is the law, and laws never ever change.” Admirably demonstrating the average Brexiters tenuous grasp of the legislative branch of government. He concluded, “You can’t change the law just because the people who change laws want to change the law, that’s undemocratic!”

[22 yards]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	I'm dead... https://newsthump.com/2019/03/22/man...gzQDkCBpE4OZ-A

I know that man!!!!

(But he can't speak for himself at the moment.)

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	22 yards
	(But he can't speak for himself at the moment.)

The petition is on course to top 3 million before 14:00 and 4 million by midnight. We'll see....

[Ace1]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Two of my former client companies sent British workers to Western Sahara. It doesnlt matter where the votes come from as long as they tally up with the details on the electoral roll.

Not even that. Anyone can sign this, just by clicking the "I'm British, honest guv" box and confirming their email address.

	Quote:	bowlie
	0735 GMT 2,451,828 signatures, Only another 15m to go. Of course this not vote of the British electorate, it is a vote of citizens and residents.

Nope, it's a vote of anyone who wants to vote, nationality or place of residence immaterial.

[curley]

	Quote:	bowlie
	0735 GMT 2,451,828 signatures, Only another 15m to go. Of course this not vote of the British electorate, it is a vote of citizens and residents.

	Quote:	Ace1
	....... Nope, it's a vote of anyone who wants to vote, nationality or place of residence immaterial.

It's not a vote at all. A vote has two choices.
This one is 'sign it or shut up'

The only thing this could serve is as basis for a second referendum as GB calls it. Considering that will again only be advisory it's - to an outsider - just a pastime.

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	curley
	The only thing this could serve is as basis for a second referendum as GB calls it. Considering that will again only be advisory it's - to an outsider - just a pastime.

Leaving aside the current state of affairs where the government is basically shot to pieces and most people would quite happily see them stand aside and allow a cabinet of donkeys to step in...


...petitioning parliament is a good interim barometer of how the electorate is feeling and the current issues and topics which are important.

As said earlier, petitions used to be collected on paper with proper signatures but nobody needed to prove they were on the electoral roll or even eligible to vote, it was just a good indication that 10,000 or 10 million or whatever people held strong enough feelings about a subject.

Regardless of whether you are for or against Brexit, the spotlight does seem to have shifted towards whether the government is capable of salvaging anything from the "omnishambles" cul-de-sac it has backed the country into.

If you feel strongly enough that the whole thing is not sufficiently managed and the country will slide into the gutter with the current management of the situation then you would sign the petition.

[22 yards]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	The petition is on course to top 3 million before 14:00

Well before; within the next 20 minutes, I would suggest. It's over 2,940,000 now.

My reference was to someone who's taking a holiday from EF at the moment.

[22 yards]

	Quote:	curley
	It's not a vote at all. A vote has two choices.

Tell that to the North Koreans.

Maybe Mrs May will draw inspiration from this for any parliamentary vote on her leadership!

[curley]

	Quote:	22 yards
	Tell that to the North Koreans. Maybe Mrs May will draw inspiration from this for any parliamentary vote on her leadership!

Ahhhh! GB is on the same level as North Koreans? Gee, why didn't you tell me that at the beginning of this thread?