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Old 24.07.2018, 00:21
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

It's more about what is omitted, and as this article explains, there was room for additions to be made...

https://news.sky.com/story/jeremy-co...ation-11446710
  #362  
Old 24.07.2018, 15:21
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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Depends on how much attention people pay to Jeremy Corbyn and what he does/says. If they're not paying much attention, maybe they see no reason to protest.
He's only the leader of the opposition. He could well be the next PM.

So a pretty inconsequential and marginal role really. Why should anybody care?
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  #363  
Old 24.07.2018, 22:02
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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It's more about what is omitted, and as this article explains, there was room for additions to be made...

https://news.sky.com/story/jeremy-co...ation-11446710
Which aspects or cases of the IHRA definition are at odds with the recently adopted PLP definition?

I don't see how that question can be answered based on the article alone so in reality it doesn't (explain to my satisfaction).
  #364  
Old 25.07.2018, 00:20
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

Fair enough.

In case you don't have a link to hand, this is the IHRA definition - https://www.holocaustremembrance.com...n-antisemitism

This is the most thought out comparison I've read between the two texts - https://www.opendemocracy.net/uk/bri...e-of-two-texts

I'll leave you to come to your own conclusions.
  #365  
Old 25.07.2018, 10:56
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

It's very nice to defend a man who has friends who admire Hitler, who writes soeeches to be read at their rallies. Who takes a personal interest in the fight against the "Jewish State", while being much softer on myriad less democratic and more oppressive (but non Jewish) countries.

When Corbyn doesn't come down on Hamas for failing to condemn the anti-semitism and Hitler admirers in their ranks, that's OK. It's understandable. But when Trump fails to condemn Charleston protesters, that proves beyond all doubt he is a dangerous white supremacist.

Anybody else notice the inconssitency here?
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  #366  
Old 27.07.2018, 22:27
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

I admit I haven't read any of the 365 posts in this thread.

But it has hit mainstream media in Germany:

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/auslan...a-1220609.html
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Old 28.07.2018, 18:35
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

The Labour party is led by antisemites and could yet win general elections.
Sic transit gloria mundi.
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Old 05.08.2018, 19:01
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

Corbyn still won't changeLabour's definition of antisemitism. probably because it would expose him as antisemite.
Hid friendship & support of known antisemites & terrorists is well documented, but he is still the leader of Labour.
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  #369  
Old 12.08.2018, 13:22
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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It's very nice to defend a man who has friends who admire Hitler, who writes soeeches to be read at their rallies. Who takes a personal interest in the fight against the "Jewish State", while being much softer on myriad less democratic and more oppressive (but non Jewish) countries.

When Corbyn doesn't come down on Hamas for failing to condemn the anti-semitism and Hitler admirers in their ranks, that's OK. It's understandable. But when Trump fails to condemn Charleston protesters, that proves beyond all doubt he is a dangerous white supremacist.

Anybody else notice the inconssitency here?
Feel freee to demonstrate how asking questions is the same as defending someone.
  #370  
Old 12.08.2018, 14:00
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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It's very nice to defend a man who has friends who admire Hitler, who writes soeeches to be read at their rallies. Who takes a personal interest in the fight against the "Jewish State", while being much softer on myriad less democratic and more oppressive (but non Jewish) countries.

When Corbyn doesn't come down on Hamas for failing to condemn the anti-semitism and Hitler admirers in their ranks, that's OK. It's understandable. But when Trump fails to condemn Charleston protesters, that proves beyond all doubt he is a dangerous white supremacist.

Anybody else notice the inconssitency here?
Even Trump has recognised his failure and reversed his position!

Now we just need Corbyn's moment of repudiation.

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Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump

The riots in Charlottesville a year ago resulted in senseless death and division. We must come together as a nation. I condemn all types of racism and acts of violence. Peace to ALL Americans!
  #371  
Old 12.08.2018, 15:27
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

I'm not a Jezza Corbyn fan by any stretch of the imagination, he's a bit too much of a sop to lead a political party BUT, is it just me that thinks there's a massive case of "whataboutism" from the Tories using him as the "look at this, don't look at us and all our balls-ups!!" diversion.

Just trying to work out if I would find a guy who had some interwoven events with Hitler supporters or anti Semites or whatever ne'er do wells a decade ago more of a threat than a party which is currently doing its damnedest to tank the economy and ruin the country.

Tough call.

Tories had better hope they don't replace him with someone squeaky clean and competent - then they'd be screwed.
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  #372  
Old 12.08.2018, 16:09
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

If the labour backers actually got their crap together and voted in
someone like keir starmer or another intelligent and somewhat caring
person, it would do wonders in UK politics at this time.. england/wales
is totally rudderless sadly..
  #373  
Old 12.08.2018, 20:04
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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... BUT, is it just me that thinks there's a massive case of "whataboutism" from the Tories using him as the "look at this, don't look at us and all our balls-ups!!" diversion.
Slight problem in that his worst critics are his own MPs.

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Just trying to work out if I would find a guy who had some interwoven events with Hitler supporters or anti Semites or whatever ne'er do wells a decade ago more of a threat than a party which is currently doing its damnedest to tank the economy and ruin the country.

Tough call.
I had this debate with my mates from home last week when the 2013 video clip emerged. Some of them are fully paid up Labour party members and active within the party, but they're coming round to seeing that Corbyn's incapable of leading the party forward. One of them is utterly gutted that "he fell for the hype" to a degree. He's talked to a few of his local MPs in West London, and the rumour amongst party activists is that Corbyn will be gone before Christmas. Apparently, him reporting Margaret Hodge was the final straw for many (he was the sole witness to the exchange that she was accused of, allegedly).

The problems with Corbyn are...

he's stubborn as hell. So am I, so I can recognise it in him.

His political beliefs haven't matured in 30yrs, which gives the impression that nothing he's witnessed in that time has had any impact upon him.

Throughout his parliamentary career, he's been at war with his own party. The fact that there was an opposition was (and still is) largely incidental.

He constantly demands support but offers none, even to his own MPs (case in point - Luciana Berger).

Every time he's swam against the public's or Labour's opinion, his actions have been deliberate, impeccably timed and very calculated. Therefore, when he shares a platform with anti-semitic rabble on Holocaust Remembrance Day, that was no accident. That's not how he operates. In fact, he probably got off on it.

But most of all, I will never forgive him from staging the coup against Kinnock, which weakened the party at the exact point when Thatcher was on the wane. For the second time in his career, he's the primary obstacle between Labour seizing power from an incredibly weak government. I saw him screw over one generation, and now he's doing it again. No single politician is worthy of the devotion to allow that to happen.

Corbyn has as much chance of changing his opinion on Israel and Jews as I have of waking up tomorrow morning declaring Led Zepp to be the worst band ever. Not going to happen in this lifetime.


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... and voted in
someone like keir starmer or another intelligent and somewhat caring
person...
A lot of people still see the Ian Tomlinson case as a huge mark against Starmer. Personally, I like him, but he needs to master his 'rabbit in the headlights' expression when he gets a 'off piste' question. I'd take Chuka over him any day of the week.
  #374  
Old 12.08.2018, 21:18
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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I'm not a Jezza Corbyn fan by any stretch of the imagination, he's a bit too much of a sop to lead a political party BUT, is it just me that thinks there's a massive case of "whataboutism" from the Tories using him as the "look at this, don't look at us and all our balls-ups!!" diversion.

Just trying to work out if I would find a guy who had some interwoven events with Hitler supporters or anti Semites or whatever ne'er do wells a decade ago more of a threat than a party which is currently doing its damnedest to tank the economy and ruin the country.

Tough call.

Tories had better hope they don't replace him with someone squeaky clean and competent - then they'd be screwed.

1.Corbyn's racist associations happen regularly, his last letter of support to Hamas was a few weeks ago.

2. The economy under the conservatives is doing relatively well. If Corbyn will have real power the UK will have a real economical problem.

3. Would you consider voting for someone who consitently supported Rapists - called them Brothers, headed an organiztion who promoted rape, ignored calls to rape in his facebook group, wrote supportive letters to clergy accused of child molestation (who afterwards were disrched from CoE for their views), visited them while on house arrest ? corbyn did all that and more with antisemites. Is it such a tough call ?
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  #375  
Old 12.08.2018, 21:35
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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2. The economy under the conservatives is doing relatively well. If Corbyn will have real power the UK will have a real economical problem.
At the macro level that is true, but at the micro level, there are a lot of people who would not agree and they are the ones with the votes. Under Corbyn it is hard to see how it could do well, but at the micro level a lot of voters would benefit at least in the early years.
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Old 12.08.2018, 21:41
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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1.Corbyn's racist associations happen regularly, his last letter of support to Hamas was a few weeks ago.

2. The economy under the conservatives is doing relatively well. If Corbyn will have real power the UK will have a real economical problem.

3. Would you consider voting for someone who consitently supported Rapists - called them Brothers, headed an organiztion who promoted rape, ignored calls to rape in his facebook group, wrote supportive letters to clergy accused of child molestation (who afterwards were disrched from CoE for their views), visited them while on house arrest ? corbyn did all that and more with antisemites. Is it such a tough call ?

Err... I did say that I wasn't a Jezza fan, I was more pointing a finger at the Tories using this current bandwagon to deflect from their own shortcomings.
  #377  
Old 12.08.2018, 22:21
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

You said it was a tough call.
Is it difficult for you choose between the conservatives and Corbyn?
  #378  
Old 12.08.2018, 23:06
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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You said it was a tough call.
Is it difficult for you choose between the conservatives and Corbyn?
Corbyn isn't a party.

Given the state of the UK and the Tory party, they don't make themselves easy to choose.

If the Labour party had a more capable and down to earth leader, who knows? The Tories so far haven't shown any aptitude for running a nation.

It's all hypothetical, you know. There's so far no election on the horizon and I'm no longer eligible to vote in the UK so it's a moot point.
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Old 12.08.2018, 23:32
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

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It's all hypothetical, you know. There's so far no election on the horizon and I'm no longer eligible to vote in the UK so it's a moot point.
As we stand, the Conservatives only need one sitting MP to die in office or be forced to retire from politics. They're current working majority is 0.

https://www.parliament.uk/mps-lords-...f-the-parties/

Personally, I have never, and will never vote Conservative. I've voted Labour once in 1997.

As for the right for expats to vote,. I've posted this before...

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The Labour party has been accused of betraying British citizens living abroad by refusing to back a bill that would remove a time limit on their right to vote, the Guardian can reveal.


British expatriates lose their right to vote in UK elections after 15 years overseas. Extending votes to all expats with no time limit was a Conservative party manifesto promise in the 2017 election.
The overseas electors bill is being introduced into law as a private member’s bill sponsored by the Conservative MP Glyn Davies. It is working its way through parliament.



In a private letter to a campaigner for the bill, seen by the Guardian, Cat Smith, the shadow minister for voter engagement and youth affairs, said the party would not support the bill because it would involve too much administration.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ho-cannot-vote
  #380  
Old 12.08.2018, 23:36
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Re: Jeremy Corbyn refuses to denounce terrorist 'friends' Hamas and Hezbollah

Thanks for making it clear: You consider the labour party under Corbyn a legitimate party to vote for. You can't divorce a party from it's leader.


Many, maybe even the majority of UK voters could share your opinion.



When Corbyn was made the head of Labour, I thought this is suicide for the labour Party - maybe the extreme fringes of UK society could vote for him, but definitely the majority of voters in one of the worlds most repected democracies won't. I was wrong.



If Anti-west, pro racist Corbyn, becomes UK PM the implications for the west will be very negative.
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