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  #321  
Old 19.07.2016, 12:08
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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"a few"?
Over 200 abortion clinic attacks in the US by Christians versus say half a dozen US attacks by people claiming to be Islamists.

Or we should ignore the Christian attacks because they failed at killing large numbers although that was their aim?
if you want to crack down on christianity instead of islam, be my guest.

you act as if people that question islam are automatically ignoring or even pro christian nonsense.

id like to see less religion overall, but i suppose we have to make priorities in where we can make the most progress towards a better world.
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  #322  
Old 19.07.2016, 12:51
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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At what point will the French people begin to ask whether their country's involvement in Libya, Iraq, Syria etc.. is really worth the carnage being brought back home?

The facts speak for themselves, from 2004 when Chiraq refused to be involved in the Iraq war until 2012, there were almost no Islamist terrorist incidents on French soil. France and Germany experienced none of the Al Queda related violence visited upon those nations which did go to war in Iraq i.e. Britain, Spain and the USA.

And yet since Hollande's coming to power in 2012 he has metamorphosed from a left wing, rather meek bank clerk to a right wing war monger. His promise to intensify attacks in Syria and Iraq only a few hours after the Nice atrocity only reinforced this new belligerent stance. The French must be getting sick and tired of his vain platitudes, and this latest sentiment from Valls that the French better get used to terrorism is surely the final straw.

The war on terror will never be won by bombing derelict buildings in the desert, they need to come out with a more coherent strategy because this current one isn't working.
The war on terror does need a coherent strategy of destroying Islamist strongholds/states/caliphates. As the west already learned and russia is re-learning now: the cost is high and the regimes which replace them are bad (the Iraqi army is only slightly better than AQ/ISIS when it comes to human rights), but the alternative is worse.

As long as the Arab world doesn't offer a viable culture, allowing citizens a decent life, terror will have a fertile breeding ground.
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  #323  
Old 19.07.2016, 13:17
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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It isn't their aim to kill large numbers. Their aims are very specific. Unlike Islamic terrorism.
You mean apart from the people who stated their aims were to bomb/burn clinics complete with all medical staff and patients (clue - most of them).
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  #324  
Old 19.07.2016, 13:24
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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You mean apart from the people who stated their aims were to bomb/burn clinics complete with all medical staff and patients (clue - most of them).
Alot are fire-bombed at night. If their aim is mass murder, they suck.

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Since 1977 there have been eight murders, 17 attempted murders, 42 bombings, and 186 arsons targeted at abortion clinics and providers across the United States. In some cases, a small group of clinics have been targeted multiple times.
http://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9827886...attacks-mapped
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  #325  
Old 19.07.2016, 13:42
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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if you want to crack down on christianity instead of islam, be my guest.

you act as if people that question islam are automatically ignoring or even pro christian nonsense.

id like to see less religion overall, but i suppose we have to make priorities in where we can make the most progress towards a better world.
No, I want to crack down on murderous nutters regardless of which invisible friend has voices in their heads. Cracking down on religions never works; failures run from the Inquisition to Communist states.

Hopefully with the spread of modern education, scientific advances and better understanding of Nature then other religions will trend downwards like Christianity is in most of Western Europe.
For example, in 1985 40% of people in UK claimed to be Anglican and now below 20%. Source

And "In a meeting with German bishops last year, Pope Francis warned of an “erosion” of Catholic faith in the country, highlighting trends that show the Church there is losing members at an increasing rate. “The sacraments are approached steadily less often,” "
Source

Of course the nutters are likely to be the last to leave.
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  #326  
Old 19.07.2016, 13:52
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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No, I want to crack down on murderous nutters regardless of which invisible friend has voices in their heads. Cracking down on religions never works; failures run from the Inquisition to Communist states.

Hopefully with the spread of modern education, scientific advances and better understanding of Nature then other religions will trend downwards like Christianity is in most of Western Europe.
For example, in 1985 40% of people in UK claimed to be Anglican and now below 20%. Source

And "In a meeting with German bishops last year, Pope Francis warned of an “erosion” of Catholic faith in the country, highlighting trends that show the Church there is losing members at an increasing rate. “The sacraments are approached steadily less often,” "
Source

Of course the nutters are likely to be the last to leave.
and women's rights, sharia, mass rape, rotherham-like stuff?

if we could make religion at best be a neutral contribution to society im fine with it. its a net negative (with or without killings), certainly in the case of islam.
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  #327  
Old 19.07.2016, 13:52
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Alot are fire-bombed at night. If their aim is mass murder, they suck.


http://www.vox.com/2015/12/1/9827886...attacks-mapped
Ah, battle of the quotes "In the United States, violence directed towards abortion providers has killed at least eleven people, including four doctors, two clinic employees, a security guard, a police officer, two people (unclear of their connection), and a clinic escort"

I find this more convincing as they give the names.

Source
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  #328  
Old 19.07.2016, 14:08
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Oh right, like Maalbek and the Banlieue? Even the Muslim immigrants living there will tell you they are not happy. The bulk of politicians also seem to agree that dumping them in ghettos was a bad idea and are re-thinking how to handle migration.
Maalbek the underground station? I don't think there are many people living there, Muslim or otherwise.

Large concentrations of immigrants into specific areas is not unique to France or Belgium, it's a pretty common phenomenon in many places and not necessarily due to them being dumped there.

When immigrants arrive in a place they automatically gravitate to an area where there are people they already know or are from their culture. A street in Bradford with one Asian family becomes interesting to others and in no time at all the majority of people on the street are also Asians. Same thing in other streets/neighbourhoods in other cities and other countries.

Integration is a two way street, immigrants have to want to integrate and put in the necessary effort to do so and the locals have to want to accept them and be prepared to put in to effort to help them to integrate.
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  #329  
Old 19.07.2016, 14:15
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

The increased terrorist attacks in Western Europe we see have more to do with the cultural divide than the religious one. The inconsistency to this statement is that the cultural differences are rooted from religious traditions.

The point is that multiculturalism in Europe has failed. It's gotten to the point that this is the institutionalised norm and where people are supposed to, no expected to, celebrate diversity. And no one is allowed to ask what exactly are the benefits some of these cultures have brought to Europe?

This policy has resulted in state sponsored destroying of social cohesion. It positively discriminates against minorities looking for equality from communities where equality doesn't exist. Europe used to integrate minorities, now through utter pig-headedness of politicians and the media they allow minorities to integrate Europe.

The result is that now you have segregated communities that are tolerated. No one asks what goes on in them due to long arm of political correctness. Thousands of cases of FGM a year, not one conviction. Sharia courts in Europe. Honour killings. Inbreeding. Yet no one asks in the name of multiculturalism.

These communities also feel disengaged and separated with no identity with the country they’re living in which is why it’s so easy for members of them to become radicalized.

With the migrant crisis, the situation is only going to get worse. You import the Third World, you import the Third World lifestyles and values that come with it. Across Europe there’s a huge rise in support for nationalist political parties. And people scratch their heads, shrug their shoulders and ask “why?”. And it’s simple, if Europe’s politicians can’t deal with these very real problems, then people will vote for extreme parties that will. It mustn’t ever get to this stage.
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  #330  
Old 19.07.2016, 14:26
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

There are plenty of pockets of multiculturalism throughout the world that work perfectly and beautifully fine. They don't all do suicidal terrorist attacks on their neighbours.
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  #331  
Old 19.07.2016, 18:40
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

Ah, what a coincidence, or four.
Three relatives of Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel are Islamic extremists who were jailed in Tunisia.
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  #332  
Old 19.07.2016, 18:46
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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There are plenty of pockets of multiculturalism throughout the world that work perfectly and beautifully fine. They don't all do suicidal terrorist attacks on their neighbours.
Yes but I can't think of one of them which has large scale North African immigration that works even reasonably ok.
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  #333  
Old 19.07.2016, 18:49
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Yes but I can't think of one of them which has large scale North African immigration that works even reasonably ok.
Me neither. I was really only thinking of Far East Asian neighbourhoods that exposed me to a lot of interesting cuisine. Chinatown.
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  #334  
Old 19.07.2016, 18:50
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Integration is a two way street, immigrants have to want to integrate and put in the necessary effort to do so and the locals have to want to accept them and be prepared to put in to effort to help them to integrate.
I remember when Nigerians were pouring into Ireland to take advantage of the loophole granting automatic citzenship when your child was born on Irish soil - they were chaining themselves to the parliament railings to prevent them being moved into communities that could integrate them.

You say they "have to want to immigrate" - how do you measure that "want" ? Do you prevent any coming in who do not have sufficient "want" ? Are you prepared to forcibly repatriate them ?

They have no desire to integrate - they are simply incentivised to move here because of our welfare state.
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Old 19.07.2016, 18:53
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Me neither. I was really only thinking of Far East Asian neighbourhoods that exposed me to a lot of interesting cuisine. Chinatown.
Well Pakistan is a proper powderkeg so not sure all Far East versions are fantastic either. If people in the West even were aware of the level of STATE LEVEL discrimination in say Malaysia to remove the incentives for large scale immigration they might wake up a bit - this Kumbayah ("wilkommenskultur") nonsense is getting the long overdue wake up it deserves.
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Old 19.07.2016, 18:59
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Well Pakistan is a proper powderkeg so not sure all Far East versions are fantastic either. If people in the West even were aware of the level of STATE LEVEL discrimination in say Malaysia to remove the incentives for large scale immigration they might wake up a bit - this Kumbayah ("wilkommenskultur") nonsense is getting the long overdue wake up it deserves.
I agree. The regressives are only able to silence the conversations amongst themselves, but people not even in those conversations are already thinking differently. The government and media narratives have already lost its credibility. Polls show widespread disbelief. I suppose that silent majority express it when they vote. Thank God for democracy.
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Old 19.07.2016, 20:24
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

They are understood to be brothers and cousins of Bouhlel’s wife who was in the process of divorcing him.
First cousins, 2nd cousins, or ?

Is it really relevant what the relatives of a soon to be ex-wife were guilty of in a distant country?
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Old 19.07.2016, 20:29
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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Is it really relevant what the relatives of a soon to be ex-wife were guilty of in a distant country?
You think that a family of Jihadis are likely to intermarry with a family of secular folks?? Kindly PM me for some exciting waterfront property opportunities!
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  #339  
Old 19.07.2016, 23:02
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

A look inside the hate-preaching Imams of Nice and how disaffected youths can quickly and easily get radicalized:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36807283

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At the same time, self-styled preachers emerged with a message targeted at disaffected Muslim youths. Playing on widespread feelings of resentment about poverty and discrimination, they told their audience that they would always be treated as foreigners in France.

In Vallauris, one charismatic figure pitched up in a high-rise housing estate in 2010. People came from all over the region to hear him preach every Friday, until, after three years, the authorities dismantled his makeshift mosque.

"What he said really shook me," Imene Ouissi recalls. "I had gone there because everyone was talking about it. He spoke the language of the kids, so they identified with him. His message was: you must not stay in a land of villains, you will never succeed here. You must go to a Muslim country."

Kamel, a youth worker in the Nice area, says one of the reasons for the recent success of the Salafist ideology that has inspired jihad, is that it provides a ready and easy way of justifying the actions of petty criminals.

"The kids are told that they are in a land of unbelievers, so when they steal and attack people it is justifiable; the petty criminal is turned into a holy warrior, and is promised status, sexual gratification and eternal life."
..
The problem, he says, is that having 40% unemployment "lowers the immunity" of marginalised communities, allowing "microbes" to spread.Another reason for the prevalence of jihadist ideas in parts of the Riviera hinterland has been the presence of good recruiters. Omar Diaby, a criminal from Nice also known as Omar Oumsen, is believed to have sent about 40 local youths to Syria before settling there himself three years ago.
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Old 19.07.2016, 23:47
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Re: Terrorist attack in Nice, France - truck runs over crowd

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A look inside the hate-preaching Imams of Nice and how disaffected youths can quickly and easily get radicalized:
As long as the hate is directed at the West and the French, it won't be called bigotry. It may even get funded through a "socio-economic" plan.
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