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View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
Yes 93 26.50%
No 258 73.50%
Voters: 351. You may not vote on this poll

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  #23601  
Old 24.07.2020, 15:26
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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In theory.

In practice we have seen the opposite. The tone and quality of arguments coming from the left has come crashing down since Trump came to power. It seems he is bringing out the worst and most primitive in those who oppose him.
.
I think he also brings the worst in many people who are supporting him and that's why things are the way they are. There's too much controversy around him and I don't remember reading so much stuff about POTUS when Obama - for instance - was in power.

Of course, that is not to say I exclude the possibility of him winning again. Unfortunately BLM might play a role here.
  #23602  
Old 24.07.2020, 15:27
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Exactly. I will say it again - that trying to argue a political point by putting down those here who in your mind support certain political opposition to you..is doing a diss-service to the debate:

See what I quoted?

Marton - not everybody who disagrees with your posts is a troll.

Let's get back to Trump. Let's not get back to what people assume is a "Trump follower".
No problem, I will patiently wait for the examples of Antifa murders and prepare to swallow my words.

As for Right wing terrorism
Quote:
Right-wing attacks and plots account for the majority of all terrorist incidents in the United States since 1994.
Right-wing extremists perpetrated two thirds of the attacks and plots in the United States in 2019 and over 90 percent between January 1 and May 8, 2020.
Source

Meanwhile back to Trump as they say;
Quote:
A new Fox News poll released yesterday shows Trump trailing Biden in Michigan, Minnesota, Pennsylvania.
Former Vice President Joe Biden leads President Trump in the battleground states of Pennsylvania and Minnesota by double digits and in Michigan by 9 percentage points
Here is a photo of a dangerous Antifa protestor this week confronting Federal agents sent to Portland by Trump.
Name:  antifaprotestor240720.jpg
Views: 328
Size:  138.4 KB

Compare with typical peaceful Right Wing protestors
Name:  RWarmed240720.jpg
Views: 320
Size:  165.2 KB
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  #23603  
Old 24.07.2020, 15:34
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Of course - that was my point. You call it an over-analysis, I call it thinking and having an opinion. It is not bad.

Back to the left/the right poles...It seems to me that the polarity isn't so extreme. (Useless) emotional charge, yes. But the polarity isn't as terrible as the media want it to be: people in fact imho don't wish their opponents to see eye to eye on issues. They don't want accord or agreement of any sorts because they know with it there is no progress. I think they wish for better opposition. That's all. People don't vote Trump because of him, I think. But because they want Dems to improve. They wish better opposition and toning down the emotional charge to get away from reflexes towards reflection. That's the only reason I personally do not thjnk Trump would be an enemy to the US. I hope it will improve the opposition...and vice versa. So, polarity - not so much. Emotional charge - is extreme. That needs to get looked into. What is gonna make a US move from media addiction, consumerism, looking for sensations and cheap/quick emotions. It goes back to individuals and their inner happines with themselves and their life so they'd quit outsourcing and compensating. Sorry for the shortcut. I got a tough audition in a min, gotta hear the notes.
"They don't want accord or agreement of any sorts because they know with it there is no progress." But that is the opposite of how US politics are set up. They can only make progress via bipartisan actions in Congress, otherwise they have insufficient votes and are unable to progress.
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  #23604  
Old 24.07.2020, 15:55
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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In theory.

In practice we have seen the opposite. The tone and quality of arguments coming from the left has come crashing down since Trump came to power. It seems he is bringing out the worst and most primitive in those who oppose him.

Obama being in power, he did much the same to the right. Which is what enabled Trump to make such an effortless and clean sweep of the primaries in 2016.

Polarized candidates do not unfortunately lead to a smarter opposition. Pushing parties into survival mode is not favourable to the development of nuanced positions that are willing to recognize that certain things your opponent says or does may actually be right.
A major factor was Tump's ability to make promises that more cautious politicians would not make and to convince voters that he would deliver on them.
Of course he was unable to deliver three-quarters of them but he seems able to convince his voters that he is doing his best and is just being thwarted by political enemies.
Some examples of extreme promises;
Bring back coal
Pay off the National Debt
Rebuild the US infrastructure
Increase GDP to 4+%
Renegotiate the Iran agreement.
Bring back manufacturing
Build a wall
Release his tax returns &&&&&&&&
  #23605  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:01
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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In theory.

In practice we have seen the opposite. The tone and quality of arguments coming from the left has come crashing down since Trump came to power. It seems he is bringing out the worst and most primitive in those who oppose him.
I wouldn't blame him but those who behave like this. They are accountable for their reactions. They also can opt for whatever reaction, incl. zero reaction.

Quote:
Polarized candidates do not unfortunately lead to a smarter opposition.
It is not candidates who induce reactions..Reactions are done by people. People have their own judgement. Polarized? As I said. They in reality aren't. They are not polarizing, either. I think media polarize, simplify and reduce, play people's nerve and affective system as opposed to rationality...Media carricature candidates. And people respond, because, as I said earlier - it is an opportunity for over-eager, exaggerated emotions, drama and outrage. That keeps media consumers coming back for more. Trump knows it, all business men know it. All parties know it.

So..whoever brings the best/worst in people..it is a nice metaphore of giving up control/responsibility over kneejerk reactions. Grown ups don't have anything/anyone bringing the best/worst in them. They do it themselves because they are the ones chosing a reaction. Media infantilize consumers and polarize them into war camps.
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  #23606  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:08
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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No doubt you have examples?

If not, no worries, just simply return to your trolling.

Article on this topic topic here from a not unbiased source.
Remember Daniel H in Chemnitz?

In fact you were the one to claim here on this very forum that his death had nothing to do with the knife that was stuck into him at the very moment his heart stopped beating.

And before you go off on some tangent and say there is no proof, I will remind you of your earlier post i am replying to.

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Incidentally Antifa has never been accused of killing anyone unlike many white supremacist groups.
You didn't say proven. You said accused.
  #23607  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:16
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Here is a photo of a dangerous Antifa protestor this week confronting Federal agents sent to Portland by Trump.
Attachment 139931

Compare with typical peaceful Right Wing protestors
Attachment 139932
Ridiculous in so many ways.
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  #23608  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:38
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Remember Daniel H in Chemnitz?

In fact you were the one to claim here on this very forum that his death had nothing to do with the knife that was stuck into him at the very moment his heart stopped beating.

And before you go off on some tangent and say there is no proof, I will remind you of your earlier post i am replying to.



You didn't say proven. You said accused.
That was in Germany, I suppose marton asked about USA? We keep mixing up things here and it's just tedious to follow this discussion.

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Ridiculous in so many ways.
Which one?
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  #23609  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:48
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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No problem, I will patiently wait for the examples of Antifa murders and prepare to swallow my words.

As for Right wing terrorism


Meanwhile back to Trump as they say;
I was about to protest again about using "Right" in this context but opened you link and at least we know they don't really mean "Right" but far-right. It seems it's a common error.

Quote:
To be clear, terms like right-wing and left-wing terrorism do not—in any way—correspond to mainstream political parties in the United States, such as the Republican and Democratic parties, which eschew terrorism. Instead, terrorism is orchestrated by a small minority of extremists.
Quote:
First, right-wing terrorism refers to the use or threat of violence by sub-national or non-state entities whose goals may include racial or ethnic supremacy; opposition to government authority; anger at women, including from the incel (“involuntary celibate”) movement; and outrage against certain policies, such as abortion.6 This analysis uses the term “right-wing terrorism” rather than “racially- and ethnically-motivated violent extremism,” or REMVE, which is used by some in the U.S. government.7 Second, left-wing terrorism involves the use or threat of violence by sub-national or non-state entities that oppose capitalism, imperialism, and colonialism; pursue environmental or animal rights issues; espouse pro-communist or pro-socialist beliefs; or support a decentralized social and political system such as anarchism. Third, religious terrorism includes violence in support of a faith-based belief system, such as Islam, Judaism, Christianity, and Hinduism, among many others. As highlighted in the next section, the primary threat from religious terrorists comes from Salafi-jihadists inspired by the Islamic State and al-Qaeda. Fourth, ethnonationalist terrorism refers to violence in support of ethnic or nationalist goals—often struggles of self-determination and separatism along ethnic or nationalist lines.

Last edited by greenmount; 24.07.2020 at 17:59.
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  #23610  
Old 24.07.2020, 17:54
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Assume for a moment that the candidate were Kamala Harris. Imagine the outrage if the question instead were
"Are you concerned about the fact that the candidate is a black woman?".

Obviously it's perfectly Ok to be sexist, racist and ageist. Provided you aim at the "correct" target.
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  #23611  
Old 24.07.2020, 18:07
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Assume for a moment that the candidate were Kamala Harris. Imagine the outrage if the question instead were
"Are you concerned about the fact that the candidate is a black woman?".

Obviously it's perfectly Ok to be sexist, racist and ageist. Provided you aim at the "correct" target.
Yes. I can't imagine a survey like this in France or Italy or Germany etc etc. It is ridiculous imo.

Edit: or given the differences in demographics they do make some sense, but could have been phrased differently - would you have liked a different candidate or smth. along the line.
  #23612  
Old 24.07.2020, 19:29
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Mail voting will start quite early, if I understand correctly. What actually happens if you cast your vote for one of the candidates as soon as they have been formally nominated, and between then and Nov 3 this candidate dies? Does your vote automatically then count for the running mate of the late candidate?
  #23613  
Old 24.07.2020, 19:45
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Mail voting will start quite early, if I understand correctly. What actually happens if you cast your vote for one of the candidates as soon as they have been formally nominated, and between then and Nov 3 this candidate dies? Does your vote automatically then count for the running mate of the late candidate?
I’m sure each of the states have their own rules. Voting in the US is a state affair. There are a handful of states that only accept votes by mail.
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Old 24.07.2020, 19:46
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Edit: or given the differences in demographics they do make some sense, but could have been phrased differently - would you have liked a different candidate or smth. along the line.
That would just be PC prettypainting nonsense, say it like it is (Carlin said it best).

Yes, his age is a concern, no doubt. Calling his skin color or sex problematic is simply inacceptable.
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Old 24.07.2020, 19:48
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Remember Daniel H in Chemnitz?

In fact you were the one to claim here on this very forum that his death had nothing to do with the knife that was stuck into him at the very moment his heart stopped beating.

And before you go off on some tangent and say there is no proof, I will remind you of your earlier post i am replying to.

You didn't say proven. You said accused.
Daniel H was murdered by a Syrian asylum seeker, not an ANTIFA member.
No other Antifa members were involved.

There was some media publicity about an Antifa tattoo but that was later corrected when it was correctly identified as an RAF (Red Army Faction) tattoo.
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Old 24.07.2020, 19:57
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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That would just be PC prettypainting nonsense, say it like it is (Carlin said it best).
It can be confusing

Is it:

a. Candor culture
b. Anti-empathetic language
c. Triggers
d. simply honesty?

Which of those would Trump fit?
  #23617  
Old 24.07.2020, 20:35
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Back on topic: Fake News

Yahoo has just removed its comment section as it was tired of so many readers calling out their B.S and lies. Cant have that now can we?

The war mongering psycho Donald Trump is being prevented from bringing troops home home, you know, the opposite of sending them to war. So, actually, its the deomocrats who are the war mongerers: FACT.

THE U.S. MILITARY HAS BEEN fighting in Afghanistan for almost nineteen years. House Democrats, working in tandem with key pro-war GOP lawmakers such as Rep. Liz Cheney, are ensuring that continues.

https://theintercept.com/2020/07/02/...n-and-germany/


My biggest issue is war, not catering to emotionally insecure angry mob millenials and their preffered pronouns. War, not feelings. And so far Donald Trump is the most Anti-War president we've had since Bill Clinton. FACT.
Ths anti war President ordered more drone attacks in 3 years than Obama did in eight; I suppose it all depends on how you define "war".
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Old 24.07.2020, 21:03
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It's not as if the left don't also use that term to dismiss things that don't suit their narrative.

This is why it is important to read both sides. By systematically refusing to read a Fox article, you are refusing to expose yourself to points of view that may help you better understand the other side of the argument.

And now the boot is on the other foot and the left is doing the same to Trump. So what goes around comes around.
You seem to be supporting the view that all the FOX employees are pro GOP and pro Trump.

In fact the actual Fox News journalists are neutral and good at their jobs.

Here is an example from today
Quote:
Fox News briefly cut away from Friday's White House daily briefing shortly after press secretary Kayleigh McEnany showed a video presentation focusing on violence and rioting in Portland, Ore.

"All right, we were not expecting that video, and our management here at Fox News has decided we will pull away from that at this time," anchor Harris Faulkner informed viewers on Friday afternoon as the network cut away from the briefing room back to its New York headquarters.
This was supposed to be a COVID_19 briefing not a campaign for Trump.

On the other hand the opinion leaders like Hannity and Carlson are heavily biased and not required to stick to proven facts like the News journalists.
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  #23619  
Old 24.07.2020, 22:26
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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That would just be PC prettypainting nonsense, say it like it is (Carlin said it best).
.
Oh, thanks.

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Calling his skin color or sex problematic is simply inacceptable.
And I agreed with you on this one....sigh. It is unacceptable for us in Europe but we're talking about USA where everything seems to be heavily polarised and focused on social issues these days. I can imagine some people would have preferred a female candidate, minority or not*. Well, in fact gender equality seems to be taken more seriously in Europe too but that's not the point here.
*the more "boxes" a candidate scores, the better...I assume.
So while you think it's all BS, maybe the survey should be read in that key. I don't know, it's just an opinion. I might repeat myself - I found it ridiculous too.

Last edited by greenmount; 24.07.2020 at 22:41.
  #23620  
Old 24.07.2020, 22:29
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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You seem to be supporting the view that all the FOX employees are pro GOP and pro Trump.

In fact the actual Fox News journalists are neutral and good at their jobs.

Here is an example from today


This was supposed to be a COVID_19 briefing not a campaign for Trump.

On the other hand the opinion leaders like Hannity and Carlson are heavily biased and not required to stick to proven facts like the News journalists.
Hannity, Carlson and Ingraham are absolutely awful. The whole format of opinion shows is. I explicitly include Cuomo and Lemon here. AC Cooper of course is an opinion show but at least he is sharp and somewhat entertaining.

The Chris Wallace interview of Trump on FOX was class.
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