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View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
Yes 93 26.50%
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  #24141  
Old 28.09.2020, 01:32
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Maybe they did not want to embarrass Trump by publishing that seven Republicans were indicted for this Republican election fraud?
In reality, this two-year-old case was reported at the time in many MSM outlets including the NY Times, the Washington Post, the Atlantic, NBC amongst others.
It's just as relevant today. This is evidence that Trump does have a point yet people are unaware, meloncollie may have never even heard about it even though she's clearly interested.

And ennui, instead of addressing the issue, perfers to stick his head in the sand rather than addressing the issue.
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  #24142  
Old 28.09.2020, 01:40
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Dems want to win, hide Biden from a microphone until after the election - utterly preposterous he’s ‘the best shot’ of unseating a lunatic
  #24143  
Old 28.09.2020, 02:10
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It's just as relevant today. This is evidence that Trump does have a point yet people are unaware, meloncollie may have never even heard about it even though she's clearly interested.

And ennui, instead of addressing the issue, perfers to stick his head in the sand rather than addressing the issue.
There are thousands of elections in the US every year, local, state, federal.
One fraud is just that, one fraud. It does not demonstrate a regular pattern of fraud.
Anyway, this demonstrates the strength of the system, the fraud was identified and rectified.
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  #24144  
Old 28.09.2020, 02:14
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It's just as relevant today. This is evidence that Trump does have a point yet people are unaware, meloncollie may have never even heard about it even though she's clearly interested.
FBI Director Christopher Wray testified before Congress that the agency has historically not seen widespread voter fraud in major elections:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisond...cutting-trump/

FBI Director Christopher Wray testified to Congress on Thursday that the agency has not historically seen “any kind of coordinated national voter fraud effort in a major election,” including through mail-in voting, undermining repeated baseless claims by President Donald Trump and his allies that mail-in voting will lead to widespread voter fraud.



---

If you'd like to take a deep dive, the Forbes article links the Brennan Center For Justice, which has compliled a list of studies on the subject of voter fraud claims:
https://www.brennancenter.org/our-wo...r-fraud-claims


Has there ever been a case of voter fraud? Of course. But the numbers are small. The claims the WH is making about widespread voter fraud, especially wrt mail-in ballots, rigged elections, etc. are baseless. Trump's strategy seems to be to cast doubt on the electoral process in advance, setting the stage for challenges.
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  #24145  
Old 28.09.2020, 02:26
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It's just as relevant today. This is evidence that Trump does have a point yet people are unaware, meloncollie may have never even heard about it even though she's clearly interested.

And ennui, instead of addressing the issue, perfers to stick his head in the sand rather than addressing the issue.
Her head, thank you. And you are simply wrong.
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  #24146  
Old 28.09.2020, 11:58
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Trump's anti-China actions are running into problems.
A federal judge on Sunday temporarily blocked President Trump's TikTok ban just hours before it was set to go into effect.

A judge in California issued a preliminary injunction last week blocking the administration’s WeChat ban.

The World Trade Organization said that President Donald Trump's tariffs on Chinese goods break international trade rules, the ruling from the WTO will have little practical effect, however.

Meanwhile,
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White House chief of staff Mark Meadows on Sunday delivered a pointed rebuke of FBI Director Chris Wray after he testified that there isn't evidence of coordinated national voter fraud, despite President Donald Trump's baseless claims otherwise.

Wray had told the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee there has been voter fraud at the local level "from time to time," but maintained, "we have not seen, historically, any kind of coordinated national voter fraud effort in a major election, whether it's by mail or otherwise."
In Trump's Alice in Wonderland world up is down and true is false.
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  #24147  
Old 28.09.2020, 16:36
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Dems want to win, hide Biden from a microphone until after the election
I didn't know that. What's Biden going to use in the debate tomorrow? A megaphone? Or is he just going to shout?
  #24148  
Old 28.09.2020, 16:46
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I didn't know that. What's Biden going to use in the debate tomorrow? A megaphone? Or is he just going to shout?
Hopefully there's a ventriloquist available
  #24149  
Old 28.09.2020, 17:27
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I didn't know that. What's Biden going to use in the debate tomorrow? A megaphone? Or is he just going to shout?

If I were the democrats, I would switch off the microphone, ask the audience to make as much noise as possible while Biden talks, and hope that nobody will notice.
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  #24150  
Old 28.09.2020, 21:16
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

More info on Trump's tax in the Guardian here,

Also in the Guardian "Trump 2016 campaign 'targeted 3.5m black Americans to deter them from voting"
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  #24151  
Old 28.09.2020, 22:17
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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If I were the democrats, I would switch off the microphone, ask the audience to make as much noise as possible while Biden talks, and hope that nobody will notice.
Well, maybe the problem is you, then.

Because I -- as well as most people that I know -- can understand Biden just fine.
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  #24152  
Old 28.09.2020, 22:19
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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And right now we are at an existential crisis in this country. We need a return to decency if we are to survive.
So very, very true.
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  #24153  
Old 29.09.2020, 10:01
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The RVAT videos are a small ray of hope. This is a grass-roots campaign where people who have been long time Republicans - everyday voters, from military veterans, business people, Christian evangelicals, parents, from all over the country - share their reasons why they will not vote for Trump and the Republican party this time around, indeed, why many will enthusiastically support Biden. A common theme is that although they may disagree with Biden on many policy points, at least he is a decent man. And right now we are at an existential crisis in this country. We need a return to decency if we are to survive.
.
I have read some article about the R. Party and can see their issues, however, we're talking about a 328 million country. I think USA will survive anyway, with a diminished prestige and reputation but it will. Apart from bringing to the world a new political style and the idea that politicians are allowed to behave like internet trolls or people talking in a bar not in front of a nation from a position of responsibility and power, do you think there were irreparable damages that Trump brought? In terms of administration, legislation? As I see it all he did was to consolidate his family's power and his propellers. And of course - to divide and polarise, turn some groups of people against the others. (well, that's not new)

I didn't dislike the guy that much before having to "deal" with some of his fanatic fans on EF (I realised he does manage to win the hearts of all....sorts of people), so I admit I might have missed many things in this 4 years "saga". The noise he likes to make is a huge smoke screen and things are not so obvious for those whose interest in American politics is rather limited. So sorry for asking. That was not to say it's not high time for him to leave, I can see he's done enough damage even if I don't follow his every move, reply or tweet.

Last edited by greenmount; 29.09.2020 at 10:14.
  #24154  
Old 29.09.2020, 10:27
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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More info on Trump's tax in the Guardian here,

Also in the Guardian "Trump 2016 campaign 'targeted 3.5m black Americans to deter them from voting"
That was one of Dominic Cummings tactics. Convincing anti-Brexit voters they didn’t need to go out and vote as there was no way the pro-Brexit camp could ever win. And it worked. All’s fair in love and Politics.
  #24155  
Old 29.09.2020, 10:39
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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All’s fair in love and Politics.
They used to say "All is fair in Love and War." But yeah, Politics is War these days.
(for some)
  #24156  
Old 30.09.2020, 05:20
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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There are thousands of elections in the US every year, local, state, federal.
One fraud is just that, one fraud. It does not demonstrate a regular pattern of fraud.
Anyway, this demonstrates the strength of the system, the fraud was identified and rectified.
The point is, this kind of fraud can be used thanks to mail-in ballots and the way they're implemented in some states. The possibility wouldn't usually exist without mail-in ballots. This single case proves it's not just a theoretical possibility but real. That's all it takes to prove the validity Trump's statement.



And please prove that this was the only case.
  #24157  
Old 30.09.2020, 08:53
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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And please prove that this was the only case.
And while you are at it please prove that freshly fallen snow is always white.
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  #24158  
Old 30.09.2020, 10:21
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I have read some article about the R. Party and can see their issues, however, we're talking about a 328 million country. I think USA will survive anyway, with a diminished prestige and reputation but it will. Apart from bringing to the world a new political style and the idea that politicians are allowed to behave like internet trolls or people talking in a bar not in front of a nation from a position of responsibility and power, do you think there were irreparable damages that Trump brought? In terms of administration, legislation? As I see it all he did was to consolidate his family's power and his propellers. And of course - to divide and polarise, turn some groups of people against the others. (well, that's not new)
.
I wish I shared your optimism, but sadly I do think we are in an existential crisis right now.

Trump is more likely a symptom than a cause. He validates the hatreds of his base and encourages them to go ever farther into acting on them - but he did not instil those hatreds.

He is the spark that lit the fire that has the potential to blow the country up. He plays on our worst impulses. But even if he one day goes away we will still have Trumpism, those simmering hatreds, dividing us.

The country might not break apart under his watch - but the stage is set for the next would-be strongman. We are moving towards replacing democracy with authoritarianism, and half the country is all on board with that.

Our institutions have been gutted and shown to be ineffectual in the face of challenges. We have almost lost our checks and balances, raw power wins. We no longer agree on what constitutes law, let alone agree to abide by it. Perverting our democratic norms is shrugged off, or worse, seen as a smart power move.

And half the country is all on board with that.

And many who are not have given up, simply keeping their heads down.

What I see most chilling is the growing number of 'finger in the wind' followers. I am ashamed to say that I have some of those in my family. Many comfortable-but-not-one-percenters, once-principled, have seen the direction in which power is shifting and have jumped aboard the self-preservation train, following Trumpism to keep their slice of the pie. Or rather, to prevent anyone currently not at the table from getting a crumb, to shore up what feels to them like a precarious hold on that slice. These are not Trump's base, but they are in position to do far more damage.

Regardless of what happens in November, Trump opened a pandora's box.

I hope to God that I am wrong.
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  #24159  
Old 30.09.2020, 10:42
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Thank you for your well-written post, melloncolie. I hoped this administration didn't pervert key institutions but I guess I was very optimistic indeed.

Yeah, Trump is not only a president like many before, he's a "movement". Wonder how will he be represented in future history books. (I can guess)

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What I see most chilling is the growing number of 'finger in the wind' followers. I am ashamed to say that I have some of those in my family. Many comfortable-but-not-one-percenters, once-principled, have seen the direction in which power is shifting and have jumped aboard the self-preservation train, following Trumpism to keep their slice of the pie. Or rather, to prevent anyone currently not at the table from getting a crumb, to shore up what feels to them like a precarious hold on that slice. These are not Trump's base, but they are in position to do far more damage.
.
It's only an illusion he's there to protect their slice of the pie. But if they might have a reason to believe that, imagine the absurd situations where people who never had a slice of the pie to begin with, are now convinced they'll have one..
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  #24160  
Old 30.09.2020, 11:41
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Meloncollie, that’s quite an assessment. When people go into self-preservation mode, moral aptitude becomes a low priority.

If Trump wins, there will be protests and violence. America’s democracy will be tested while the country becomes more divided. Those angry enough will encourage civil unrest while others will just duck their heads and hope their lives will not be affected. And, of course, Trump’s supporters will be more empowered than ever before.

I, too, hope my pessimism is wrong.
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