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View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
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  #5801  
Old 13.03.2017, 20:12
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

"Affordable healthcare" is a term we can interpret according to our individual income. Or political pov. To present it as a right, an entitlement, basically mean making a lot of people pay nothing (and making a lot of others pick up the slack, even if indirectly).
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  #5802  
Old 13.03.2017, 20:22
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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"Affordable healthcare" is a term we can interpret according to our individual income. Or political pov. To present it as a right, an entitlement, basically mean making a lot of people pay nothing (and making a lot of others pick up the slack, even if indirectly).
Isn't this how societies work in general though? There is always give and take. Not suprisingly, I believe access to healthcare is a right. Otherwise people will die needlessly.

Far too many people have no access or are rendered bankrupt by out of control costs. There are a lot of structural problems with US healthcare that need to be solved, including unequal distribution of resources and wide variation in cost.


By the way, I saw an Interview with Ivanka Trump today. She said she had a dress that was her "secret weapon". Thought of you immediately, MC.
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Old 13.03.2017, 20:28
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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making a lot of people pay nothing (and making a lot of others pick up the slack, even if indirectly).
I have no problem at all with that. In fact, I am very happy to pay every last penny of my non-trivial annual tax bill if it supports affordable universal health care coverage in this country. It is a disgrace that healthcare is not free altogether.

I am less happy to finance the USA being the policeman of the world, but unfortunately, I have limited choice as to how the U.S. government spends my taxpayer money at the moment. I cannot vote either, but believe me, I can't wait to be able to vote. Taxation without representation!!! I believe they fought a war on that one.

My personal measure of a civilized society is the standard of living afforded to the weakest member of said society, which includes food, education, and healthcare. POV I guess.
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  #5804  
Old 13.03.2017, 21:34
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Isn't this how societies work in general though? There is always give and take. Not suprisingly, I believe access to healthcare is a right. Otherwise people will die needlessly.

Far too many people have no access or are rendered bankrupt by out of control costs. There are a lot of structural problems with US healthcare that need to be solved, including unequal distribution of resources and wide variation in cost.


By the way, I saw an Interview with Ivanka Trump today. She said she had a dress that was her "secret weapon". Thought of you immediately, MC.
Did you see the Interview with Ivanka Trump where she said we are being spied on by all sorts of devices including microwave ovens!!
Actually one of these would be useful so I can check how my dinner is progressing

I am a supporter of healthcare for everyone.
I find hard to understand Birthers who fight to stop abortions and save babies but are happy to watch people die due to inadequate funding!
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  #5805  
Old 13.03.2017, 22:00
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Did you see the Interview with Ivanka Trump where she said we are being spied on by all sorts of devices including microwave ovens!!
Actually one of these would be useful so I can check how my dinner is progressing

I am a supporter of healthcare for everyone.
I find hard to understand Birthers who fight to stop abortions and save babies but are happy to watch people die due to inadequate funding!
Marton, I think you're confusing Ivanka with Kellyanne Conway. Kellyanne made some outrageous comment yesterday and now she's dialing it back. One of my friends on facebook though advised people to say "hello Mr Presidnt" to thir microwave. ;-)

But yeah....people supporting the preborn only drive me nuts.
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  #5806  
Old 13.03.2017, 22:09
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Marton, I think you're confusing Ivanka with Kellyanne Conway. Kellyanne made some outrageous comment yesterday and now she's dialing it back.

But yeah....people supporting the preborn only drive me nuts.


It's an ideological thing.
The unborns are without sin.

Those who get sick and die early probably made a mistake, didn't try hard or often enough to get rich or just committed some sin that god was going to punish anyway.

That said, they could probably save a lot of money anyway by taxing sugar and carbs.

The US's obesity problem is going to literally suffocate their healthcare-system (and likely bring down the nation altogether).

What UBL, AQ and ISIS couldn't do - soft drinks and fastfood will easily accomplish.
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  #5807  
Old 13.03.2017, 22:11
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Marton, I think you're confusing Ivanka with Kellyanne Conway. Kellyanne made some outrageous comment yesterday and now she's dialing it back. One of my friends on facebook though advised people to say "hello Mr Presidnt" to thir microwave. ;-)

But yeah....people supporting the preborn only drive me nuts.
Sorry, you are correct - I meant Conway
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  #5808  
Old 13.03.2017, 22:13
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Spicer: Trump didn't mean wiretapping when he tweeted about wiretapping.

Spicer also said that Trump was referring to the Obama administration broadly -- and not accusing Obama of personal involvement -- when he tweeted that "Obama had my 'wires tapped' in Trump Tower" and accused Obama of being a "bad" or "sick guy."
Source

No comment...
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Old 13.03.2017, 22:26
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The Congressional Budget Office today projects that 14 million people will lose coverage by 2018 under the Republican ObamaCare replacement bill.
Source

Quote:
17 Jan 2017
"We're going to have insurance for everybody," Trump told The Washington Post. "There was a philosophy in some circles that if you can't pay for it, you don't get it. That's not going to happen with us."
"[They] can expect to have great health care. It will be in a much simplified form. Much less expensive and much better," he said.
Source
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  #5810  
Old 14.03.2017, 01:10
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The Girl Guides of Canada are cancelling all travel to the United States because of fears that their members might have trouble at the border due to travel restrictions enacted by Donald Trump.
Source

The law of unintended consequences......

Not that the Girl Guides are a major business for the US; more that many other people and organisations are likely to follow suit!
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  #5811  
Old 14.03.2017, 08:33
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Those who get sick and die early probably made a mistake, didn't try hard or often enough to get rich or just committed some sin that god was going to punish anyway.
Maybe their "sin" was to be born in the wrong place at the wrong time to people of the wrong colour, resulting in less chance to "get rich" no matter how hard they tried.

I can't make my mind up if you are being serious or not, I hope not.

The rest of your post I would agree with.
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Old 14.03.2017, 09:01
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

It is a great humanitarian idea. I aplaud to all sharing this virtuous plan, theoretically it sounds perfect. Free healthcare. Or almost. NHS should be an example, so many people are so happy with it, high quality care. I also lived in a system of free healthcare or almost - doctors didn't get paid but it is ok, my family survived on peanuts and we got new docs (Vietnam, Poland, Ukraine - after the local docs left). And it is sustainable, because people are relatively responsible beings, not weighing on the system with neigence and unhealthy habits. Another inspirational thing is - negative birthrate which makes free healthcare possible in some way. Right?

It sounds good, I could feel good about it. I wouldn't, though. I cannot even if I wanted. I believe that in order to boost self care, preventative minds, smart responsible consumers - and quality of service, health needs to be treated as a comodity.
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  #5813  
Old 14.03.2017, 09:27
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It is a great humanitarian idea. I aplaud to all sharing this virtuous plan, theoretically it sounds perfect. Free healthcare. Or almost. NHS should be an example, so many people are so happy with it, high quality care. I also lived in a system of free healthcare or almost - doctors didn't get paid but it is ok, my family survived on peanurs and we got new docs (Vietnam, Poland, Ukraine). And it is sustainable, because peoplw are relatively responsible beings, not wrighing on the system with neigence and unhealthy habits. Another inspirational thing is - negative birthrate which makes free healthcare possible in some way. Right?

It sounds good, I could feel good about it. I wouldn't, though. I cannot even if I wanted. I believe that in order to boost self care, preventative minds, smart responsible consumers - and quality of service, health needs to be treated as a comodity.
I guess it can work in a rich country with high taxation and high salaries for the medical staff - thus able to attract qualified work force at any given time.
For the rest of the world though...health it is a commodity, indeed.
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Old 14.03.2017, 09:39
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Health (care) is treated as a commodity in far too many places. And just because you may be paying for it directly, it doesn't follow that the quality is better. It just means the queue is shorter because less people have "qualified" for it. But paying more for something always guarantees a better service or product, right?
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Old 14.03.2017, 09:40
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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My personal measure of a civilized society is the standard of living afforded to the weakest member of said society, which includes food, education, and healthcare. POV I guess.
In East Germany they were educated, fed, had jobs, pension and healthcare. I wonder where it all went wrong?
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Old 14.03.2017, 09:46
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It sounds good, I could feel good about it. I wouldn't, though. I cannot even if I wanted. I believe that in order to boost self care, preventative minds, smart responsible consumers - and quality of service, health needs to be treated as a comodity.

It only works if you have adequate prevention, and good regulation to ensure that people have and can afford healthy choices. For example, in the US, a lack of fresh food - food "deserts", no access to preventative care. Also few jobs within walking or transport distance. Not so easy in large swaths of semi rural America with no public transport. And in some inner cities. But, communities are starting to explore growing their own food in urban settings.


Where we used to live, low wage workers often lived farther away from their job, and relied on driving long distances, without public transport. It takes time and resources for adequate self care.

And while lifestyle changes are important, they are not always enough. Clean water, clean air - which we used to take as a given are not. Crumbling infrastructure is a huge public health risk.

Don't mistake this for victimization however. This is the environment in which those who wish to make changes must operate.

If you want people to be personally responsible, as a society, you have to ensure that people have the tools and resources to do so. They might need some help to start.
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Old 14.03.2017, 10:07
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Health (care) is treated as a commodity in far too many places. And just because you may be paying for it directly, it doesn't follow that the quality is better. It just means the queue is shorter because less people have "qualified" for it. But paying more for something always guarantees a better service or product, right?
Probably is the only way to ensure there are any medical services available.
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Old 14.03.2017, 10:08
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

A congressman from Kansas, and an MD about healthcare.....

You can read the whole thing at

https://www.statnews.com/2017/03/03/...sas-obamacare/

“Just like Jesus said, ‘The poor will always be with us,’” he said. “There is a group of people that just don’t want health care and aren’t going to take care of themselves.”

Pressed on that point, Marshall shrugged.

“Just, like, homeless people. … I think just morally, spiritually, socially, [some people] just don’t want health care,” he said. “The Medicaid population, which is [on] a free credit card, as a group, do probably the least preventive medicine and taking care of themselves and eating healthy and exercising. And I’m not judging, I’m just saying socially that’s where they are. So there’s a group of people that even with unlimited access to health care are only going to use the emergency room when their arm is chopped off or when their pneumonia is so bad they get brought [into] the ER.”

A 2013 study by the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation found Medicaid’s impact on physical health inconclusive. But adults who gained access to Medicaid under the ACA showed markedly improved mental health and increased use of preventive services like mammograms and cholesterol checks, which increased by 60 and 20 percent, respectively.
.........................................

A week later, the Congressman softened his comments considerably, more or less saying it was necessary to care for the poor.
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Old 14.03.2017, 10:17
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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In East Germany they were educated, fed, had jobs, pension and healthcare. I wonder where it all went wrong?
Some think it started with Gorbachev's Perestroika back in spring '85. I personally think at least some of it was also caused by Howard Jones, leather ties, big hair, the Commodore Amiga, and New Coke.
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Old 14.03.2017, 10:20
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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A week later, the Congressman softened his comments considerably, more or less saying it was necessary to care for the poor.
Isn't just great when people talk out of their hat?

And you would think they should know better...
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