Will Trump be a Good President? - Page 341

Chuff · #**6801** 07.04.2017, 18:15

	Quote:	Urs Max
	Members of which faction say they were dropped from planes, and how many people do so? As I recall the attack caught the victims asleep, how well can you see bombs drop in the dark?

Wow, are you serious? Use some basic common sense, Urs.

Upon hearing or feeling one, someone will have got out of bed and looked outside. Jet planes are also not riding on waves of silent magic.

Not to mention, the people have seen more warfare in the last 5 years than anyone has a right to, they probably know better than anyone ever should what bombs being dropped looks, sounds and feels like.

EDIT -

Witness descriptions http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/05/mi...-syria-attack/

	Quote:
	"At 6:30 in the morning, the plane struck. I ran up on our roof and saw that the strike was in front of my grandfather's house," Mazin told CNN.

Also: http://www.thenational.ae/world/midd...th-toll-climbs

	Quote:
	BEIRUT // A witness who filmed the nerve-gas attack on Khan Sheikhoun from a nearby hilltop gave a graphic account yesterday of the massacre that claimed the lives of 75 people, including 20 children. Hussam Salloum, a volunteer with an air-raid warning service in rebel-held areas, described watching a Sukhoi-22 aircraft, a Syrian army jet, approach the town at low altitude.

So yeah, your post is pretty ridiculous.

marton · #**6802** 07.04.2017, 18:34

	Quote:	kriss kross
	Trump did say he will be the greatest jobs president! Companies added 263,000 jobs for the month, ADP and Moody's Analytics said. That was well above the 185,000 expected from economists surveyed by Reuters and also better than the 245,000 reported for February. The report comes amid hopes that President Donald Trump can deliver on his pro-growth agenda of lower taxes, less regulation and more infrastructure spending. Source

The US economy added just 98,000 jobs in March as a cold snap, a government hiring freeze and a faltering retail sector appear to have put the chill on Donald Trump’s promise to boost hiring.

Source

Must be fake news

Urs Max · #**6803** 07.04.2017, 18:52

	Quote:	Chuff
	So yeah, your post is pretty ridiculous.

You are of course free to ignore stuff that doesn't support your prejudice, doesn't make your position any more valid or less hypocrit. From your own link
"A UN investigation in August found that chemical weapons had been used in Syria, both by the national air force and ISIS militants."

Nor does it make it the US strikes any less illegal.

#**6804** 07.04.2017, 19:17

	Quote:	Chuff
	you really are not a particularly intelligent person.

	Quote:	Chuff
	the fact that this even needs explaining to you is itself worrying.

	Quote:	Chuff
	are you kind of, well... thick?

	Quote:	Chuff
	So yeah, your post is pretty ridiculous.

Ever thought of appearing on Question Time? Only if you'd be benevolent enough to share your great gift of insight of course.

#**6805** 07.04.2017, 19:18

Trump's just turned out like the rest of them.

Ex-UK ambassador to Syria: 'No proof' of chemical attack

Tom1234 · #**6806** 07.04.2017, 19:19

	Quote:	Urs Max
	Except that the US have no business for that kind of action. US militar action may be legal under US law but it's illegal under international law.

Someone needs to fight the wars. We can't all sit on the sidelines pretending to be neutral, eh Urs?

Didn't you study history at school?

Urs Max · #**6807** 07.04.2017, 19:48

	Quote:	Tom1234
	Someone needs to fight the wars. We can't all sit on the sidelines pretending to be neutral, eh Urs? Didn't you study history at school?

It's quite rich of you to use "we" when you're profiting quite nicely from what you criticize. Consider leaving the glasshouse before you start throwing stones.

For how many months have you personally served in a war-like situation by the way?

Tom1234 · #**6808** 07.04.2017, 20:19

	Quote:	Urs Max
	It's quite rich of you to use "we" when you're profiting quite nicely from what you criticize. Consider leaving the glasshouse before you start throwing stones.

Do you really think Switzerland would be like it is today if every country remained neutral in the face of every aggressor. Seriously?

Do they teach you that at school or is that your own opinion?

	Quote:	Urs Max
	For how many months have you personally served in a war-like situation by the way?

How is that relevant?

I haven't been to the moon but I still know it's not made of cheese.

And, I'm not criticising Switzerland - I'm criticising your opinion. How many times do I need to tell you that you are not the Swiss spoke-person on this forum (self-appointed or otherwise).

Please try not to speak for Switzerland - the people really are not all like you.

Blueangel · #**6809** 07.04.2017, 20:39

	Quote:	Chuff
	It's a highly logical assumption. Who else do you think could have theoretically dropped chemical bombs via plane in Syria, other than the Russians?

Let's go back 8mths...

August 2016

	Quote:
	A Syrian rescue service operating in rebel-held territory said on Tuesday a helicopter dropped containers of toxic gas overnight on a town close to where a Russian military helicopter had been shot down hours earlier. The opposition Syrian National Coalition (SNC) accused President Bashar al-Assad of being behind the attack. Assad has denied previous accusations of using chemical weapons.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mi...-idUSKCN10D0OZ

Sep 2013

	Quote:
	U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry said on Sunday that tests proved positive for use of the chemical weapon sarin in Syrian chemical attacks.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-sy...98007F20130901

April 2013

	Quote:
	The Syrian government’s reported use of sarin in its war against rebel forces is ominous. It suggests dissemination of the nerve agent could become more frequent there — whether by the Syrian military or by opposition forces in possession of captured stockpiles.

It only takes a helicopter. Both Russia and Assad have form in this department, but nobody knows for sure if the rebels don't also have possession of it.

Blueangel · #**6810** 07.04.2017, 20:43

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Trump's just turned out like the rest of them. Ex-UK ambassador to Syria: 'No proof' of chemical attack

I take the word of MSF who are on the ground treating the victims over any ex-this that or the other.

marton · #**6811** 08.04.2017, 00:50

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Let's go back 8mths... August 2016 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mi...-idUSKCN10D0OZ Sep 2013 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-sy...98007F20130901 April 2013 It only takes a helicopter. Both Russia and Assad have form in this department, but nobody knows for sure if the rebels don't also have possession of it.

it is possible the rebels have captured stocks of sarin (even though Assad claims he destroyed all stocks years ago) but the rebels do not have the aircraft to deliver it?
And let us not forget sarin has a maximum 5 year shelf life; usually the Middle East versions are impure and consequently have shelf lives measured in weeks or months.!

Sarin can be delivered in artillery shells but due to instability and short shelf life usually the shell has two compartments with different chemicals that are mixed in flight to create the sarin. This approach sounds too complex for the rebels; plus nobody has demonstrated they have the sort of high quality Hazmat suits needed to handle this chemical!

marton · #**6812** 08.04.2017, 12:23

Somebody asked if Trump's action was legal.

If you look at the photo of Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago “situation room” and the team who decided to strike then you see there was no one from Justice Dept. or the Department of Defence. So possibly they did not know if it was legal or not!

Usually they need Congressional approval for such an action. The president can always claim action was urgently needed but hard to see how he could justify that for this case; it is not as if the airfield attacked was at any risk of running away.

Anyway looks like the Justice Dept. and the Department of Defence can claim deniability about the decision.

Blueangel · #**6813** 08.04.2017, 15:08

Please let this be true! Please!

	Quote:
	Donald Trump is considering sacking Steve Bannon and Reince Priebus, two of the President’s closest advisers, in a major shake-up of White House staff, according to unconfirmed reports. A senior aide to Mr Trump was quoted by a US news outlet as saying “things are happening, but it's very unclear the president's willing to pull that trigger". "The tension, the exhaustion, the raw nerves have gotten much harder to disguise." It is understood that the changes could include the departure of Mr Bannon, the President’s chief strategist, and Mr Priebus, the White House Chief of Staff. Axios reported a top aide to Mr Trump saying the sackings were a matter of “when” not “whether”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7672171.html

Urs Max · #**6814** 08.04.2017, 19:34

	Quote:	Tom1234
	Do you really think Switzerland would be like it is today if every country remained neutral in the face of every aggressor. Seriously?

Where exactly do I say so?

In case you haven't noticed the major aggressor in this case is the USA. Do you really want to say their destabilizing the Middle East is a good thing?

	Quote:
	1Usually they need Congressional approval for such an action. The president can always claim action was urgently needed but hard to see how he could justify that for this case; it is not as if the airfield attacked was at any risk of running away.

US law is only one aspect as it's an international matter. International law defines interventions in another country legal under two conditions only:
- upon request of the recognized government, which makes Russia's and Iran's help legal
- based on a UN resolution. Those that exist don't call for warfare-like level of action.

Thus US warfare in Syriah is illegal under international law.

marton · #**6815** 08.04.2017, 19:55

	Quote:	Urs Max
	Where exactly do I say so? In case you haven't noticed the major aggressor in this case is the USA. Do you really want to say their destabilizing the Middle East is a good thing? US law is only one aspect as it's an international matter. International law defines interventions in another country legal under two conditions only: - upon request of the recognized government, which makes Russia's and Iran's help legal - based on a UN resolution. Those that exist don't call for warfare-like level of action. Thus US warfare in Syriah is illegal under international law.

US warfare in Syriah is illegal under international law.

Like the Russian warfare in Ukraine

Of course two wrongs do not make a right; I was just demonstrating that some countries seem to ignore International law when it is convenient for them; "the law that defines interventions in another country legal under two conditions only".

Surprised that nobody here so far has tried to blame the recent St. Petersburg atrocity on the US destabilising the Middle East.

Russia has over the last 3 or 4 years been pushing the borders of what is acceptable international diplomatic behaviour; I do not have a problem with the US reacting but I only hope it does not lead to a major conflict.

Have you seen the newspaper reports that Farage and many others in the alt right have reacted negatively to this US strike? Of course they are entitled to their opinions but these are opposite to my expectations from them; I was actually glad to see that

.

marton · #**6816** 08.04.2017, 20:04

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Please let this be true! Please! http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7672171.html

There are a number of reports of internal strife and chaos within the White House team; how true these are I have no idea!
It is clear that Trump thrives on such misdirection.

Myself I would be happy to see Bannon and Miller gone; Priebus seems to be relatively harmless.

Trump had a strategy to insert supporters at senior levels (beachheads and such) within the various Govt. departments (bit like the Soviet Union commissars who kept groups on topic) but it seems many are now leaving

.
Of course, to be effective they needed regular support from Trump but I guess he has a lot of other important stuff on his plate to do now?

#**6817** 08.04.2017, 20:54

	Quote:	Tom1234
	Someone needs to fight the wars. We can't all sit on the sidelines pretending to be neutral, eh Urs? Didn't you study history at school?

Can we parachute you in to lead the charge?

Tom1234 · #**6818** 08.04.2017, 21:03

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Can we parachute you in to lead the charge?

I'm pretty sure wars are fought like that any more. Do try and keep up.

#**6819** 08.04.2017, 21:12

	Quote:	Tom1234
	I'm pretty sure wars are fought like that any more. Do try and keep up.

Oh really? I'll let these guys know:

Casualties of the Iraq War
British fatalities during Operation Telic
United States military casualties in the War in Afghanistan
British Forces casualties in Afghanistan since 2001

marton · #**6820** 08.04.2017, 22:10

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Oh really? I'll let these guys know: Casualties of the Iraq War British fatalities during Operation Telic United States military casualties in the War in Afghanistan British Forces casualties in Afghanistan since 2001

Off topic again.

You cannot keep a focus on Trump can you