Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics
View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
Yes 61 27.35%
No 162 72.65%
Voters: 223. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #7801  
Old 10.07.2017, 10:03
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Kt. Zürich
Posts: 8,583
Groaned at 249 Times in 215 Posts
Thanked 11,609 Times in 6,342 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Today's tweets, Grandad shuffled out of his bedroom again and went to G20



1. Trump is forming a Cyber Security unit with Putin to stop election hacking That is like turkeys voting for Christmas!

2. Putin was asking questions about the DNC server? - not believable.

3. The CIA was not involved in the DNC investigation Old men do get confused about acronyms.

4. 4 [Intelligence Agencies] (had to apologize) From where does Trump have such strange fantasies?

I suppose Trump's next step will be to say he believed Putin and so Mueller the special prosecutor (or special counsel) is no longer needed!
Another Trump U turn or Trump just trolling?

Quote:
Donald J. Trump‏@realDonaldTrump 6h

The fact that President Putin and I discussed a Cyber Security unit doesn't mean I think it can happen. It can't-but a ceasefire can,& did!
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank marton for this useful post:
  #7802  
Old 10.07.2017, 10:49
olygirl's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: d' Innerschwiiz
Posts: 5,367
Groaned at 235 Times in 156 Posts
Thanked 11,778 Times in 3,585 Posts
olygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond reputeolygirl has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...tirring-anthem

Dictator Kim has competition. Substitute "America" with "Trump" to make the video spot on.
Reply With Quote
  #7803  
Old 10.07.2017, 12:28
kriss kross's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: BE
Posts: 204
Groaned at 98 Times in 65 Posts
Thanked 1,655 Times in 782 Posts
kriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputation
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Yeah.......focused on the interests of his family and friends, not the US in general....especially the loosers in flyover country who voted him in. Suckers.
That's the elitist attitude that made Trump the president!
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank kriss kross for this useful post:
  #7804  
Old 10.07.2017, 12:59
Castro's Avatar
à la mod
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Basel-Land of Smiles
Posts: 5,109
Groaned at 104 Times in 84 Posts
Thanked 14,647 Times in 4,718 Posts
Castro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
That's the elitist attitude that made Trump the president!


This is a far more potent symbol of elitism than Clinton's throwaway comment about 'deplorables'
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Castro for this useful post:
  #7805  
Old 10.07.2017, 15:12
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 5,153
Groaned at 160 Times in 135 Posts
Thanked 6,569 Times in 3,373 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post

This is a far more potent symbol of elitism than Clinton's throwaway comment about 'deplorables'
Especially considering the original word, integrity, was removed and replaced by the family name. It couldn't be more "anschaulich" (graphic?).
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Urs Max for this useful post:
  #7806  
Old 10.07.2017, 16:52
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kt Zh
Posts: 5,348
Groaned at 26 Times in 25 Posts
Thanked 7,743 Times in 3,360 Posts
edot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
That's the elitist attitude that made Trump the president!
Oh please. Not that again.

People who voted for Trump.....

Are never getting coal/manufacturing jobs back
Have kids with student loans who may end up with crushing debt
Are looking at public education systems turned to shit
Will possibly loose their healthcare coverage
Might even find their illegal, but law abiding immigrant friends and relatives deported without any help

On and on and on.

Oh sure, I value education, and I lean left. But, the real elite in this mess are Trump, his friends, his cabinet, lobbyists, people like DeVos and Price, who want to basically create a wider gulf between the haves and the have nots.

And maybe this is elite, but if an average person voted for Trump, expecting that MAGA was going to help them, they were mislead and it was a stupid choice. Stupid. And that stupidity was fed by corporate media. That's my opinion from what I've observed. Don't agree? I don't give a rat's ass.

The problem is endemic....it's incompetence, selfishness, power grabbing by both sides. It's not Trump per se, but he is a symptom.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank edot for this useful post:
  #7807  
Old 10.07.2017, 20:25
kriss kross's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: BE
Posts: 204
Groaned at 98 Times in 65 Posts
Thanked 1,655 Times in 782 Posts
kriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputation
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Might even find their illegal, but law abiding immigrant friends and relatives deported without any help
Surely that's an oxymoron?
Reply With Quote
  #7808  
Old 10.07.2017, 22:37
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 6,380
Groaned at 221 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 7,910 Times in 4,272 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Surely that's an oxymoron?
Well, they might have come illegally or overstayed their visa, but kept themselves out of any other problem - thing that it is much more admirable and difficult than you want to admit. To be invisible means you expose yourself to greedy employers, lack of health or other type of insurance...and what not. You really are on your own...so yeah, some people are to be admired not necessarily kicked out.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank greenmount for this useful post:
  #7809  
Old 10.07.2017, 22:47
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kt Zh
Posts: 5,348
Groaned at 26 Times in 25 Posts
Thanked 7,743 Times in 3,360 Posts
edot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Surely that's an oxymoron?

It happens regardless of the semantic device.
Reply With Quote
  #7810  
Old 10.07.2017, 23:10
kriss kross's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: BE
Posts: 204
Groaned at 98 Times in 65 Posts
Thanked 1,655 Times in 782 Posts
kriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputationkriss kross has an excellent reputation
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Well, they might have come illegally or overstayed their visa, but kept themselves out of any other problem - thing that it is much more admirable and difficult than you want to admit. To be invisible means you expose yourself to greedy employers, lack of health or other type of insurance...and what not. You really are on your own...so yeah, some people are to be admired not necessarily kicked out.
There obviously are illegal immigrants who are to be admired, probably a lot of them are really decent folk too.

But if you allow them to stay it doesn't really send the right message. You should be discouraging people to enter the country illegally.

It's also not really fair to those people who did everything right to enter the country in a legal manner.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank kriss kross for this useful post:
  #7811  
Old 10.07.2017, 23:22
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 9,253
Groaned at 181 Times in 156 Posts
Thanked 17,624 Times in 7,484 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
There obviously are illegal immigrants who are to be admired, probably a lot of them are really decent folk too.

But if you allow them to stay it doesn't really send the right message. You should be discouraging people to enter the country illegally.

It's also not really fair to those people who did everything right to enter the country in a legal manner.
and furthermore its the beginning of a slippery slope.

If illegals who work without paying into disability insurance, AHV, pension etc are to be admired, it makes it a bit difficult to not admire indigineous people who chose to save some money using the same trick.

If the same laws don't apply for everybody, you rapidly descend into third world style lawlessness.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
  #7812  
Old 10.07.2017, 23:58
BokerTov's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: USA, former Zurich
Posts: 2,043
Groaned at 14 Times in 14 Posts
Thanked 4,774 Times in 1,650 Posts
BokerTov has a reputation beyond reputeBokerTov has a reputation beyond reputeBokerTov has a reputation beyond reputeBokerTov has a reputation beyond reputeBokerTov has a reputation beyond reputeBokerTov has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Is that enough?
Well...[insert sarcasm here]
Attached Thumbnails
will-trump-good-president-61uoqymmj4l._sl1000_.jpg  
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank BokerTov for this useful post:
  #7813  
Old 11.07.2017, 00:26
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kt Zh
Posts: 5,348
Groaned at 26 Times in 25 Posts
Thanked 7,743 Times in 3,360 Posts
edot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

An interesting piece from the Atlantic

https://www.theatlantic.com/news/arc...s-down/527103/


Apparently arrests are up, but because those arrests are not at the borders, they require processing time. Guess some semblance of due process is a good thing. There are fewer people crossing the border, so this along with increased processing times means that deportations are down.

What's concerning a lot of people is the increase in arresting undocumented folks without a criminal record, and arresting people in courthouses.

Some of the people arrested have US spouses, family, jobs and even businesses. It would be nice if everyone came in legally and never overstayed their visa, but crap happens. The US really needs to establish an amnesty program. The immigration process itself is an inefficient nightmare. Went through it 15 years ago, and what I've heard from others suggests it's not improved much. At all.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank edot for this useful post:
  #7814  
Old 11.07.2017, 00:30
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 9,253
Groaned at 181 Times in 156 Posts
Thanked 17,624 Times in 7,484 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
The US really needs to establish an amnesty program.
Amnesty programs are what got countries like Belgium where they are.

If the easiest way to settle is to come in illegally and await an amnesty you are pushing people into illegality and losing control of the process.
Reply With Quote
  #7815  
Old 11.07.2017, 00:30
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 6,380
Groaned at 221 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 7,910 Times in 4,272 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
and furthermore its the beginning of a slippery slope.

If illegals who work without paying into disability insurance, AHV, pension etc are to be admired, it makes it a bit difficult to not admire indigineous people who chose to save some money using the same trick.

If the same laws don't apply for everybody, you rapidly descend into third world style lawlessness.
I would legalise their situation, depending on each case of course. They don't pay contributions because they can't. Didn't Obama do something similar btw?
Reply With Quote
  #7816  
Old 11.07.2017, 00:35
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 9,253
Groaned at 181 Times in 156 Posts
Thanked 17,624 Times in 7,484 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
I would legalise their situation, depending on each case of course. They don't pay contributions because they can't. Didn't Obama do something similar btw?
What then is the difference to legals who can't afford their contributions?
Reply With Quote
  #7817  
Old 11.07.2017, 00:35
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kt Zh
Posts: 5,348
Groaned at 26 Times in 25 Posts
Thanked 7,743 Times in 3,360 Posts
edot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Amnesty programs are what got countries like Belgium where they are.

If the easiest way to settle is to come in illegally and await an amnesty you are pushing people into illegality and losing control of the process.

Have you been through US immigration? This is not a process under control. I have to disagree with you - a time limited amnesty program makes sense to me.

And by the way, this...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmc.../#789ef69b1de0

Suggests that 50% of undocumented households do pay taxes. So many are contributing, perhaps more than US citizens, and certainly more than Trump.

If amnesty were offered to the undocumented, might increase tax revenues.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank edot for this useful post:
  #7818  
Old 11.07.2017, 01:37
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 9,253
Groaned at 181 Times in 156 Posts
Thanked 17,624 Times in 7,484 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
Have you been through US immigration? This is not a process under control.
Then fix it. Be tough if need be but be fair.

How can forcing people into illegaliity be fair?

Quote:
View Post
I have to disagree with you - a time limited amnesty program makes sense to me.
Amnesties tend to be things that come back. If the authorities work out that giving amnesties is easier than doing their work properly, they will continue to do so. And if people work out this is the smoothest path through the system they will use it. Thus it becomes the de facto path.

Quote:
View Post
How can you expect new citizens to be law abiding if you reward them for being the opposite?

And by the way, this...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmc.../#789ef69b1de0

Suggests that 50% of undocumented households do pay taxes. So many are contributing, perhaps more than US citizens, and certainly more than Trump.
Doesn't make it better in my view. Just shows how broken the system is.

Quote:
View Post
If amnesty were offered to the undocumented, might increase tax revenues.
If optimizing tax revenues takes precedence over maintaining the rule of law, your system is badly broken. This needs to be a wake up call, not an excuse for breaking it further.
Reply With Quote
  #7819  
Old 11.07.2017, 09:57
FunnyBone's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Earth
Posts: 651
Groaned at 33 Times in 23 Posts
Thanked 935 Times in 434 Posts
FunnyBone has a reputation beyond reputeFunnyBone has a reputation beyond reputeFunnyBone has a reputation beyond reputeFunnyBone has a reputation beyond reputeFunnyBone has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Another reason for the Mexico-US permeable border that is often overlooked (on purpose?) is that these Mexicans are actually encouraged to come, even when that is done illegally. The jobs in agriculture are mainly done by Mexican families, so :

- the farms, construction, other fields need people
- the Mexicans know they are needed and wanted, and they are willing to sacrifice the adult generation so that the next one, or perhaps even the second generation, can have more opportunities.

What I mean by sacrifice is that these workers are usually paid peanuts for their work; they pay taxes on that income; and hardly withdraw monetary benefits directly. Indirectly, they do in form of education for their kids in public schools, which brings a host of issues to those schools (there is a doc about that as well), ER visits, etc.

There are more comprehensive documentaries - no time to dig for it but a quick search on youtube, and here is a short one outlining the issue:


Is this really creating a mess of the US? Who's to blame for it? Overall, when all said and done, does it hurt the US or helps it? Many questions, but the more important question to me is: "Who benefits from this maelstrom?", politically and economically. Did the previous waves of immigrants hurt or helped the US?
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank FunnyBone for this useful post:
  #7820  
Old 11.07.2017, 11:50
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Kt Zh
Posts: 5,348
Groaned at 26 Times in 25 Posts
Thanked 7,743 Times in 3,360 Posts
edot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond reputeedot has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Quote:
View Post
]

Is this really creating a mess of the US? Who's to blame for it? Overall, when all said and done, does it hurt the US or helps it? Many questions, but the more important question to me is: "Who benefits from this maelstrom?", politically and economically. Did the previous waves of immigrants hurt or helped the US?
Generally speaking, immigration helps. It has always helped. Immigrants do lots of jobs that US citizens won't (e.g., all the agriculture stuff). And on average, immigrants are innovative, willing to learn, etc. But of course, not all are wonderful.

I think it's a convenient message to send to those people who feel let down, to say that too many immigrants take your jobs, clog up your ER, vote for too many Democrats. Uh, no.

Undocumented folks pick the fruit so you don't have to. Guess that's elitist too. Oh well......

And I hear people say "Well, my grandma came to the US legally, so should everyone else. " Yeah, like in 1920. Processes were different.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank edot for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
A generic "will my salary be good enough" post Larsh Employment 51 12.12.2017 13:51
Will Hillary Clinton run for president again? PanFastic International affairs/politics 145 29.11.2016 09:03
Poll: Will Trump win the 2020 elections? k_and_e International affairs/politics 6 14.11.2016 21:29
Will Trump be the next US President? Phil_MCR International affairs/politics 2618 14.11.2016 12:16
Shall I inform my employer that I will be self employed or be a owner of a company? Broth76 Business & entrepreneur 6 09.07.2012 17:59


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 21:58.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0