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View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
Yes 61 27.35%
No 162 72.65%
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  #11321  
Old 15.01.2018, 09:44
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Either way irrelevant.
True.

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If you don't vote you accept the decision of those that do.
Here I disagree. If you don't like the rules, then why bother playing? This is precisely the reason I don't vote. By voting you hand people like Khan a mandate. As the vast majority of people didn't vote for him, when he comes out with garbage like this, we can logically say that he doesn't represent the views of most Londoners.

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C'mon Loz, I can't count how many times I've read stupid declarations of politicians on behalf of people....while in reality people have totally different opinions or are even ashamed to be represented by them. For me - he's just another politician, maybe not better but defo not worse than others. Criticising him more, under these circumstances, smells like you're having some bias...glad that you think you don't have that bias, though.
Agreed, but it becomes a serious matter when the Mayor of a city puts a country's relationship with a major ally at risk just so that he can virtue signal. And with Trump it seems UK politicians (mainly from Labour) are queuing up to do the same. Chuka Umunna is another, he said that Trump "runs counter to British values". Well who the hell made him spokesman for what British values are?
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  #11322  
Old 15.01.2018, 09:56
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Here I disagree. If you don't like the rules, then why bother playing? This is precisely the reason I don't vote. By voting you hand people like Khan a mandate. As the vast majority of people didn't vote for him, when he comes out with garbage like this, we can logically say that he doesn't represent the views of most Londoners.
For a FPTP voting system I wouldn't necessarily disagree. However as this election followed a more reasonable voting system, you're wrong.

Given that London tends to be left-leaning these days and given that polls have clearly shown that the UK is opposed to a Trump state visit it is pretty reasonable to suppose he does represent the views of most Londoners in this case.

BTW I am an ex-Londoner, lived there and loved it for 15 years and still have a good number of friends there. You?
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  #11323  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:03
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Agreed, but it becomes a serious matter when the Mayor of a city puts a country's relationship with a major ally at risk just so that he can virtue signal. And with Trump it seems UK politicians (mainly from Labour) are queuing up to do the same. Chuka Umunna is another, he said that Trump "runs counter to British values". Well who the hell made him spokesman for what British values are?
I agree. But as I said, nothing surprises me anymore. What happens these days all over the world actually...is just incredible. Who would have though a decade ago that a British mayor would say things like this about an American president? When all the diplomacy has disappeared? Why do people feel the need to make so many controversial, if not brute declarations. Does it have to do with the social media and the new type of communication? Why so obvious and little courtesy in general? Ditto for Trump and many others, obviously.
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  #11324  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:13
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Who would have though a decade ago that a British mayor would say things like this about an American president? When all the diplomacy has disappeared? Why do people feel the need to make so many controversial, if not brute declarations. Does it have to do with the social media and the new type of communication? Why so obvious and little courtesy in general? Ditto for Trump and many others, obviously.
Quite simply, Trump started it. As you (I'm sure) know, there is history between Sadiq Khan from when Trump, as usual, shot from the hip without any regard for either diplomacy or facts.
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  #11325  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:13
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Erm:

Size of electorate: 5,739,011
Number of votes for Sadiq Khan: 1,310,143
When they're elected, you moan about it. When they're unelected, you moan about it. Can't bloody win with you on this because you're so contrary.

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Agreed, but it becomes a serious matter when the Mayor of a city puts a country's relationship with a major ally at risk just so that he can virtue signal. And with Trump it seems UK politicians (mainly from Labour) are queuing up to do the same. Chuka Umunna is another, he said that Trump "runs counter to British values". Well who the hell made him spokesman for what British values are?
Why have you not brought Andy Burnham into this?

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Mayor says he won't meet Donald Trump if he visits Manchester on state visit Mayor Andy Burnham said the snub was a 'matter of principle'
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....onald-13980368
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  #11326  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:15
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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When they're elected, you moan about it. When they're unelected, you moan about it. Can't bloody win with you on this because you're so contrary.

Why have you not brought Andy Burnham into this?

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....onald-13980368
Who?
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  #11327  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:17
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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When they're elected, you moan about it. When they're unelected, you moan about it. Can't bloody win with you on this because you're so contrary.

Why have you not brought Andy Burnham into this?

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co....onald-13980368
LOL

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  #11328  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:20
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

I'd also like to confirm I won't be meeting Trump when he comes to Switzerland.
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  #11329  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:28
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Quite simply, Trump started it. As you (I'm sure) know, there is history between Sadiq Khan from when Trump, as usual, shot from the hip without any regard for either diplomacy or facts.
Of course Trump started this thing, in his own, unique style we've got accustomed to, but I still believe one doesn't have to respond in the same manner. On the contrary, Khan would have earned more points if he could still welcome him, or by using a more subtle irony.
Someone here said London is great and doesn't need to be defended. Well, same applies when someone makes stupid declarations or brings up false info, there is no point in answering with the same currency.
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Old 15.01.2018, 10:30
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I agree. But as I said, nothing surprises me anymore. What happens these days all over the world actually...is just incredible. Who would have though a decade ago that a British mayor would say things like this about an American president? When all the diplomacy has disappeared? Why do people feel the need to make so many controversial, if not brute declarations. Does it have to do with the social media and the new type of communication? Why so obvious and little courtesy in general? Ditto for Trump and many others, obviously.
I say good on Khan for saying something most Londoners agree with. Britain shot itself in the foot with Brexit, London didnt support that. May was hoping by seriously ass kissing Trump she could offset the catastrophe that awaits Britain. I am glad that its going tits up for her, more so I am proud that Britain won't host a wannabe autocratic, sociopathic, sexist, bigoted, psuedo dictator.
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  #11331  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:31
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Who would have though a decade ago that a British mayor would say things like this about an American president? When all the diplomacy has disappeared? Why do people feel the need to make so many controversial, if not brute declarations. Does it have to do with the social media and the new type of communication?
No is the simple answer.

It's not unusual for the Mayor of London to be very vocal and critical. And despite how Khan is being portrayed by some in this thread, he's an absolute pussycat compared to his predecessors, Boris Johnson and Ken Livingstone.

Quote:
Livingstone attacks President Bush
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3011999.stm

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Boris Johnson: His best put-downs of Obama, Clinton and Trump
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/07/13/po...ans/index.html
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  #11332  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:32
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I say good on Khan for saying something most Londoners agree with. Britain shot itself in the foot with Brexit, London didnt support that. May was hoping by seriously ass kissing Trump she could offset the catastrophe that awaits Britain. I am glad that its going tits up for her, more so I am proud that Britain won't host a wannabe autocratic, sociopathic, sexist, bigoted, psuedo dictator.
It's debatable...who agrees with what, IMHO. However, don't you see - they're scoring points against each other now. Labour vs. May et co....
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Old 15.01.2018, 10:51
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I say good on Khan for saying something most Londoners agree with.
Just laughing at the irony of this. The main thrust of Trump supporters' cheering on the "shithole" comment was that he's saying what everyone is thinking.

Apply this to Khan (and it does seem to be the average Londoner's sentiment, to be honest - obviously with exceptions, for the sake of balance ) and everyone is clutching at their pearls and having a meltdown...
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  #11334  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:56
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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No is the simple answer.

It's not unusual for the Mayor of London to be very vocal and critical. And despite how Khan is being portrayed by some in this thread, he's an absolute pussycat compared to his predecessors, Boris Johnson and Ken Livingstone.
Thank you, Blueangel. I didn't know these things.
I've read the article in your link and after reading White House's reply seems like nobody was really interested in engaging in a dialogue.

Quote:
Livingstone attacks President Bush
Ken Livingston, London Mayor
Livingstone described the Bush administration as "unsupportable"
London Mayor Ken Livingstone has launched an astonishing attack on US President George W Bush, calling him "corrupt".

Mr Livingstone made his attack during an address to schoolchildren in a debate on the Iraq war.

He said he would get as much pleasure from Mr Bush being forced out of office as he had done from the downfall of former Iraq leader Saddam Hussein.

He is not the legitimate president
Ken Livingstone on George W Bush
The outburst was immediately criticised by London politicians who fear a negative effect on the mayor's efforts to attract American tourists here.

Mr Livingstone was answering questions on the Iraq war and other subjects during a two-hour meeting with 200 schoolchildren at City Hall on Thursday morning.

'Red mist'

After making a pointed reference to Mr Bush, he was asked by Channel 4 broadcaster Krishnan Guru-Murthy, who was chairing the meeting, to explain his making a personal attack on the US president when he disliked answering personal questions himself.

The mayor said: "I think George Bush is the most corrupt American president since Harding in the Twenties.

I've never heard of the fellow
White House spokesman Ari Fleischer on Ken Livingstone
"He is not the legitimate president."

He later added: "This really is a completely unsupportable government and I look forward to it being overthrown as much as I looked forward to Saddam Hussein being overthrown."

Conservative mayoral candidate Steve Norris described Mr Livingstone's attack on President Bush as "utterly irresponsible".

"The red mist comes down and his judgement flies out of the window. He has no right whatever to insult President Bush," he said.

"He has every right to his own view but not to express it when he is mayor of this city."

But Mr Livingstone later played down notions his comments could have an effect on tourism.

The mayor said it was as ridiculous as thinking British tourists would be put off some holiday destinations because of the opinions held of Tony Blair by local politicians.

Asked about Mr Livingstone's comments, White House Press Secretary, Ari Fleischer, said: "First of all, I've never heard of the fellow. Second, I'm not going to dignify it with a response."

And in a statement, officials from the US embassy in London, said: "Mayor Livingstone's opinions about the United States are a matter of complete indifference to the American embassy, the American government and the American people."
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  #11335  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:57
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Just laughing at the irony of this. The main thrust of Trump supporters' cheering on the "shithole" comment was that he's saying what everyone is thinking.

Apply this to Khan (and it does seem to be the average Londoner's sentiment, to be honest - obviously with exceptions, for the sake of balance ) and everyone is clutching at their pearls and having a meltdown...
The difference being that Trump allegedly made the comments (he denies using that language) in a private meeting. Khan has come out and publicly said Trump isn't welcome.
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  #11336  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:58
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Just laughing at the irony of this. The main thrust of Trump supporters' cheering on the "shithole" comment was that he's saying what everyone is thinking.

Apply this to Khan (and it does seem to be the average Londoner's sentiment, to be honest - obviously with exceptions, for the sake of balance ) and everyone is clutching at their pearls and having a meltdown...
But Khan's skin is brown, therefore he's not entitled to express white people's sentiment.
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  #11337  
Old 15.01.2018, 10:59
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Thank you, Blueangel. I didn't know these things.
I've read the article in your link and after reading White House's reply seems like nobody was really interested in engaging in a dialogue.
You missed the bit about Hitler and blaming the Jews in your quoted piece.
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  #11338  
Old 15.01.2018, 11:10
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The difference being that Trump allegedly made the comments (he denies using that language) in a private meeting. Khan has come out and publicly said Trump isn't welcome.
The sentiment remains the same, though. Supporters of both arguing that it is what people are thinking, whether Trump back-peddles or not.

You can apply it to any other of Trump's publicly-stated queasy opinions, though, if you think the shithole thing was made up.
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  #11339  
Old 15.01.2018, 11:17
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The difference being that Trump allegedly made the comments (he denies using that language) in a private meeting. Khan has come out and publicly said Trump isn't welcome.
The first "exchange" between Trump and Sadiq Khan was a Trump tweet. Don't think that usually qualifies as a private meeting.
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  #11340  
Old 15.01.2018, 11:21
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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True.



Here I disagree. If you don't like the rules, then why bother playing? This is precisely the reason I don't vote. By voting you hand people like Khan a mandate. As the vast majority of people didn't vote for him, when he comes out with garbage like this, we can logically say that he doesn't represent the views of most Londoners.



Agreed, but it becomes a serious matter when the Mayor of a city puts a country's relationship with a major ally at risk just so that he can virtue signal. And with Trump it seems UK politicians (mainly from Labour) are queuing up to do the same. Chuka Umunna is another, he said that Trump "runs counter to British values". Well who the hell made him spokesman for what British values are?
"the Mayor of a city puts a country's relationship with a major ally at risk " Talking about putting relationships with a major ally at risk, are you really a Brexit supporter?

"the vast majority of people didn't vote for him" Face the reality, no politician ever gets the vote of the majority of the electorate; excluding Iran and Russia where they often get over 100%

Every elected politician has the mandate to represent the whole electorate even when the majority are too lazy or dumb to bother to vote.
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