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View Poll Results: Will Trump be a good President?
Yes 93 26.50%
No 258 73.50%
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  #14921  
Old 05.08.2018, 13:12
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Those journalists who want to ethically and correctly inform public can't do it via mainstream media. To expect it is naieve. Very few achieve that. Trump was right. I really do not want this to be the truth. But the sooner we own up to ourselves that our illusion of honest media is just a dream, the better. I honestly wish it was somebody else who'd point it out, but who cares.
"]Those journalists who want to ethically and correctly inform public can't do it via mainstream media." No doubt you are able to furnish evidence of sufficient cases of incorrect information in the mainstream media to establish a pattern of such poor behaviour.
I am not asking for isolated incidents but a pattern.
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  #14922  
Old 05.08.2018, 13:20
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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"]Those journalists who want to ethically and correctly inform public can't do it via mainstream media." No doubt you are able to furnish evidence of sufficient cases of incorrect information in the mainstream media to establish a pattern of such poor behaviour.
I am not asking for isolated incidents but a pattern.
It depends on what you call mainstream media. I guess in UK daily mail is mainstream too (among others, obviously), so maybe we're talking about different things.
  #14923  
Old 05.08.2018, 13:23
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Even when my daughter was living in the US, she didn't need to do anything special to vote here other than specify that she wanted to retain her previous address as her voting place (I think that that was done when she registered at the consualte in California).

Tom
And? She did register with her address abroad and picked her most recent Commune as the one to vote in. Had she not registered with the consulate she wouldn't have been able to vote, so where's the contradiction?
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  #14924  
Old 05.08.2018, 13:40
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Thank you very much for this information and effort which was over and beyond the call of duty

“election fraud” entries. All 16 pages". These entries were not all about the US!
There were no confirmed cases of votes by dead people, one was classed as "mixed" where it was claimed dead people were registered but it is not clear that they voted.

This boring sub topic started in post 14867 where fduvall claimed "the US has a problem that needs to be solved" due to "numerous instances of DEAD PEOPLE shown as having voted".

As you correctly state, dead people voting is not a current problem and there is nothing in snopes about "numerous instances".
I think the longer reads are more instructive on the sources of possible voter fraud in Chicago.
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  #14925  
Old 05.08.2018, 14:03
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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I thought Trump was referencing Mike Tyson. No matter.


What I find disturbing is when Trump calls the press “enemy of the people”.

Sure, main stream media has its faults, it is way too corporate, profit driven, entertainment focused. The 24 hour news cycle discourages thought and analysis.

But there are still lots of ethical journalists trying to inform their publics.

Now I’m sure some of you will take issue with this. But, it struck a chord with me.

https://www.npr.org/2018/08/04/63546...-menacing-move

The last part, especially

If the president had called reporters nosy, cranky, contentious, or smart-alecky, many reporters would have laughed and agreed. But calling them — us — enemies of the people is the kind of curse made by tyrants.
Maybe Trump was referring to Mike Tyson, he never confirmed who; everybody was simply left to guess.

I agree with what you say about MSM.

Interesting to note all these news organisations are split into two main groups; journalists who report news and opinion leaders who publish opinions which do not have to be objective or fact based.

Trump keeps promoting Fox News but he only references the opinion leaders not the journalists whose reports are pretty similar to all the other MSM.
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  #14926  
Old 05.08.2018, 14:09
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Maybe Trump was referring to Mike Tyson, he never confirmed who; everybody was simply left to guess.

I agree with what you say about MSM.

Interesting to note all these news organisations are split into two main groups; journalists who report news and opinion leaders who publish opinions which do not have to be objective or fact based.

Trump keeps promoting Fox News but he only references the opinion leaders not the journalists whose reports are pretty similar to all the other MSM.
Thanks Marton. Important to differentiate between commentators who opine and journalists who report.
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  #14927  
Old 05.08.2018, 14:10
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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..... opinions which do not have to be objective .......
Opinions are never objective - it's in the word

Opinions (listening to different ones) can lead to an objective conclusion though. In my opinion.
Or at least to an "informed" opinion.
  #14928  
Old 05.08.2018, 14:17
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Opinions are never objective - it's in the word

Opinions (listening to different ones) can lead to an objective conclusion though. In my opinion.
Or at least to an "informed" opinion.
It’s really difficult for humans to be objective. Always a frame in the way. And attempts at “objectivity” sometimes lead to false equivalency. But you just have to reason the best you can. It’s hard with so much info and so little time to think.
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  #14929  
Old 05.08.2018, 16:00
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Those journalists who want to ethically and correctly inform public can't do it via mainstream media. To expect it is naieve. Very few achieve that. Trump was right. I really do not want this to be the truth. But the sooner we own up to ourselves that our illusion of honest media is just a dream, the better. I honestly wish it was somebody else who'd point it out, but who cares.
There is no media outlet more "mainstream" than Fox. It exists for the same reason as all other privately-owned media companies: to make money. Trump loves Fox because its bias is toward him, because its principal shareholder (rightly or wrongly) thinks it expedient to support Trump.

So Trump declares "mainstream media" the enemy of the people—except Fox News, of course.

Rampant hypocrisy.

Last edited by 22 yards; 05.08.2018 at 17:40. Reason: Phone keyboard typo
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  #14930  
Old 05.08.2018, 17:46
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Seems Trump cannot totally rely on Fox News any more!

Quote:
"Fox News Sunday" host Chris Wallace challenged national security adviser John Bolton about President Trump's tweet on Sunday morning, which blasted journalists and claimed they can "cause war."

Wallace read the tweet back to Bolton, then asked, "What wars have we started?"
Source

Here is the tweet they were discussing

Quote:
Donald J. Trump@realDonaldTrump

The Fake News hates me saying that they are the Enemy of the People only because they know it’s TRUE.
I am providing a great service by explaining this to the American People. They purposely cause great division & distrust.
They can also cause War! They are very dangerous & sick!

1:38 PM - 5 Aug 2018
These rants are going to finish encouraging people to injure innocent journalists!

And another example of Fox News calling out Trump

Quote:
Fox News politics editor Chris Stirewalt suggested on Friday that news outlets cease sending reporters to President Trump's rallies, saying that their presence allows Trump to use them as a "prop."

Stirewalt also suggested an end to televised White House press briefings, calling them "counterproductive" and "showboat theater."
Source
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  #14931  
Old 05.08.2018, 18:15
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Dude... are you deliberately obtuse? I said I wasn't citing Chicago wrt Trump/Hillary. There is such a long effin history of the Chicago political machine and I don't give a flying f**k if you don't want to educate yourself. Seriously... I don't know why I even bother...
The onus is on you. "Can't be bothered to demonstrate what I'm talking about" just isn't enough.

Actually you come across as a lazy arse - why should anybody take the effort of digging if not even you do? Provide at least a starting point or three that demonstrate what you base your point on. Of course this should happen right off the bat, something you've probably been aware all along.
  #14932  
Old 05.08.2018, 18:27
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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The onus is on you. "Can't be bothered to demonstrate what I'm talking about" just isn't enough.

Actually you come across as a lazy arse - why should anybody take the effort of digging if not even you do? Provide at least a starting point or three that demonstrate what you base your point on. Of course this should happen right off the bat, something you've probably been aware all along.
You and Marton must both live under a rock!

  #14933  
Old 05.08.2018, 18:39
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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You and Marton must both live under a rock!

Welcome to EF, DT.
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  #14934  
Old 05.08.2018, 18:48
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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welcome to ef, dt.
gtf, um.
  #14935  
Old 05.08.2018, 19:22
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Interesting POV

Quote:
GOP strategist Mike Murphy on Sunday said Republican candidates running pro-Trump platforms in this year's primaries will find the president is an "anchor around [their] neck" during the general elections.

"Now you come out ... from the 'Trump church' in the Republican primary with a big Trump halo.
But in the general election, Democrats all hate Trump and among Independents he’s mostly upside-down," Murphy said on NBC's "Meet the Press."

"So what is your magic light sword in the primary becomes an anchor around your neck in the general," he continued.
Source
  #14936  
Old 05.08.2018, 19:25
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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Welcome to EF, DT.
Matthew 7:6
  #14937  
Old 05.08.2018, 21:11
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It’s really difficult for humans to be objective. Always a frame in the way. And attempts at “objectivity” sometimes lead to false equivalency. But you just have to reason the best you can. It’s hard with so much info and so little time to think.
Too much info and too little of it quality info.
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  #14938  
Old 05.08.2018, 22:35
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It’s really difficult for humans to be objective. Always a frame in the way. And attempts at “objectivity” sometimes lead to false equivalency. But you just have to reason the best you can. It’s hard with so much info and so little time to think.
Article here about opinions, might stimulate some ideas?
  #14939  
Old 05.08.2018, 23:50
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

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It’s really difficult for humans to be objective. Always a frame in the way. And attempts at “objectivity” sometimes lead to false equivalency. But you just have to reason the best you can. It’s hard with so much info and so little time to think.
This bit has been bugging me all afternoon.

Little time to think? Why do people these days assume they need to have - AND voice - an opinion immediately about everything and everybody?

I take my sweet time to form my opinion - definitely about world politics but also about my own enviroment where sometimes I even need to make decisions which concern others, based on the opinion I reach. For the ones that concern others I take even more time actually.
I'm a quick thinker but I see no need to voice everything the moment my brain makes connections.

People who know me have received my answer "I have no opinion yet" when they asked me for it or even asked me how I will decide about something. I also often research and/or ask other people for their opinions. Not because I want anybody to tell me how to think about something but to get more angles on the subject in order to find my own standpoint.

On EF for example the Bill Cosby thread is a good sample. I still don't have an opinion on that. And I feel fine about it, I don't need to have one, do I. I rather say I have not made up my mind about something than sing from the same song-sheet as everyone else.

Once I do voice an opinion I can argue it. Yet it won't be cast in stone, although the new information to make me change my mind ought to be very convincing (while I can be very convincing, once I've come to a conclusion ).

So, long story short: I wish people would take more time to think before they ..... tweet, post on FB, shout everyone else down. I know it's not en vogue but would save us a lot of trouble - and would make discussions so much more interesting again.
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  #14940  
Old 06.08.2018, 01:07
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Re: Will Trump be a Good President?

Obviously I didn‘t take enough time to formulate a response. What i should have said was „take little time to think“

So in essence, I agree.
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