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  #301  
Old 26.03.2017, 17:23
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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All the Islam clerics, Mosques and 1000s of Muslims in the UK have totally condemned his crimes as absolutely anti-Islamic and reminded all of the Koran 5.32

Whosoever kills an innocent human being - it shall be as if he has killed all mankind.
But doesn't the very next verse 5:33 state that if someone fights God or his messenger then they should be killed or crucified?

Sounds contradictory
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  #302  
Old 26.03.2017, 17:29
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

Context is everything- Go read your Bible and see what it says.
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  #303  
Old 26.03.2017, 17:35
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Today from Nick Cohen in the Guardian:

'After every attack, there is a pause while ideologues sniff the wind. If it is an Islamist easterly, the worst elements of the right know what to do. They score points with corpses, make weapons from wounds and say violence was a logical consequence of immigration and multiculturalism, policies they already opposed, and, for this is often overlooked, would have continued to oppose regardless of whether there were terrorist attacks.

Far from shocking them into fresh thinking, “shocking” violence confirms what they already knew. They are comfortable with it, as people always are comfortable with information that can be moulded to confirm their prejudices.'

And Nigel Farage refuses to detract or apologise in any way for stating all over TV and the Press that the EU immigration policy was responsible- for this lone attack by a crazy criminal, who was a 'Christian' criminal before he became a 'Muslim' one after ealier crimes and prison. Like Farage a 52 year old from .... Kent.

All the Islam clerics, Mosques and 1000s of Muslims in the UK have totally condemned his crimes as absolutely anti-Islamic and reminded all of the Koran 5.32

Whosoever kills an innocent human being - it shall be as if he has killed all mankind.
Hmm, how do they define 'innocent'?

Funny, no mention of what comes after 5.32:

33. The punishment for those who fight God and His Messenger, and strive to spread corruption on earth, is that they be killed, or crucified, or have their hands and feet cut off on opposite sides, or be banished from the land. That is to disgrace them in this life; and in the Hereafter they will have a terrible punishment.
34. Except for those who repent before you apprehend them. So know that God is Forgiving and Merciful.


-http://www.clearquran.com/005.html
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  #304  
Old 26.03.2017, 17:45
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

KKross beat me to it...
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  #305  
Old 26.03.2017, 17:48
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

Every time someone quotes the Koran, someone else comes back and makes some reference to the Bible. Every single time. Without fail.

Why? Can anyone give me a convincing reason for this rather tired convention?
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  #306  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:00
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Every time someone quotes the Koran, someone else comes back and makes some reference to the Bible. Every single time. Without fail.

Why? Can anyone give me a convincing reason for this rather tired convention?
I've no idea. But they are altogether stupid and foolish in their discipline of delusion - their idol is wood!
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Old 26.03.2017, 18:07
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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I've no idea. But they are altogether stupid and foolish in their discipline of delusion - their idol is wood!
Burn them!
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  #308  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:08
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Every time someone quotes the Koran, someone else comes back and makes some reference to the Bible. Every single time. Without fail.

Why? Can anyone give me a convincing reason for this rather tired convention?
By using a false equivalence the deceiver attempts to make you question the true nature of your own religion and hoodwink you into thinking that all religions are somehow equal?
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  #309  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:13
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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By using a false equivalence the deceiver attempts to make you question the true nature of your own religion and hoodwink you into thinking that all religions are somehow equal?
Certainly seems to be the case.

The irony being that people who have issues with Islam range from atheists to gay activists to feminists to fascists to Christians to socialists to Buddhists to Bert in the pub.

And quite a lot of Christians have no particular issue with our Muslim neighbours, since we have quite a lot in common.

But it's always the Bible that gets dragged into these conversations.

It's almost like it's still the twelfth century in some people's heads.
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  #310  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:25
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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The irony being that people who have issues with Islam range from atheists to gay activists to feminists to fascists to Christians to socialists to Buddhists to Bert in the pub
Islam is religion of peace which unites people from all walks of life - paradoxically, to fight against Islam.

And Bert in the pub is the absolute worst. You just know he votes UKIP.
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  #311  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:32
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Context is everything- Go read your Bible and see what it says.
Context is everything, christianity has been completely nurtured and if anyone dares say that Islam needs a reformation he/she(specially she if she is a muslim) gets instantanously dismissed for reasons specified HUNDRED OF TIMES.

Truth be told, islam needs the same treatment that Christianity is getting from the atheists and comedians.

I mean a comic can mock judaism and christianity all they want... but the same is not truth for islam... i mean:
guess which of these two got people killed:
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  #312  
Old 26.03.2017, 18:36
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Context is everything, christianity has been completely nurtured and if anyone dares say that Islam needs a reformation he/she(specially she if she is a muslim) gets instantanously dismissed for reasons specified HUNDRED OF TIMES.
Islam underwent several reformations between the 18th and early 20th centuries - although owing to the uncentralised nature of the religion, they tended to be relatively local (if you consider the entire Ottoman Empire to be "local") in nature.

The reasons for the recent rise of fundamentalism have more to do with politics (specifically colonialism and post-colonialism) than religion, even if it does have its roots in 18th century Arabia.

You really ought to do some reading on the subject. Proper reading - books and stuff, not shitty websites. It's fascinating!
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  #313  
Old 26.03.2017, 19:14
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Every time someone quotes the Koran, someone else comes back and makes some reference to the Bible. Every single time. Without fail.

Why? Can anyone give me a convincing reason for this rather tired convention?
Because both books contain incredible violence. And both are subject to interpretation in a modern context and can be misused by the wrong people for the wrong ends. The Bible is still used in some parts of the world to persecute gays and those who are 'possessed', even children- in a very violent, medieval way. The quote from the Koran is the one given by the Islamic foundation in totally condemning the attacks of the other day, and others previously.

So very relevant here. The violence of the Bible is refuted by modern Christians in the 'civilised' world - just as the violence of the Koran is, by modern Muslims.
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  #314  
Old 26.03.2017, 19:20
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Because both books contain incredible violence. And both are subject to interpretation in a modern context and can be misused by the wrong people for the wrong ends. The Bible is still used in some parts of the world to persecute gays and those who are 'possessed', even children- in a very violent, medieval way. The quote from the Koran is the one given by the Islamic foundation in totally condemning the attacks of the other day, and others previously.

So very relevant here. The violence of the Bible is refuted by modern Christians in the 'civilised' world - just as the violence of the Koran is, by modern Muslims.
It isn't relevant at all. It perpetuates the very destructive myth that somehow there is a "culture clash" between Christians and Muslims when, in fact, there is no such thing: in my opinion, we're actually on the same side.

Some atheists seem very fond of propagating it, though. I wonder why?
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Old 26.03.2017, 19:38
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

Since comparing the two religions seems to be the direction you guys are taking, why not comparing both prophets? Mohammed and Jesus... now what are the differences between them? I wonder...
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Old 26.03.2017, 19:39
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Since comparing the two religions seems to be the direction you guys are taking, why not comparing both prophets? Mohammed and Jesus... now what are the differences between them? I wonder...
Now you're at it, too!
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  #317  
Old 26.03.2017, 19:43
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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By using a false equivalence the deceiver attempts to make you question the true nature of your own religion and hoodwink you into thinking that all religions are somehow equal?
Have you ever played Buzzword Bingo?
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  #318  
Old 26.03.2017, 19:44
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Since comparing the two religions seems to be the direction you guys are taking, why not comparing both prophets? Mohammed and Jesus... now what are the differences between them? I wonder...
You're looking for the prophet margin as it were?
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  #319  
Old 26.03.2017, 20:27
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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It isn't relevant at all. It perpetuates the very destructive myth that somehow there is a "culture clash" between Christians and Muslims when, in fact, there is no such thing: in my opinion, we're actually on the same side.

Some atheists seem very fond of propagating it, though. I wonder why?
Au contraire- it shows that they have both so much in common, the good and the bad- and both have huge cultural and local differences- and as many ways of applying and interpreting both - and much more often on the same side than not.
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Old 26.03.2017, 20:31
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Re: Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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Au contraire- it shows that they have both so much in common, the good and the bad- and both have huge cultural and local differences- and as many ways of applying and interpreting both - and much more often on the same side than not.
It's whataboutery of the worst kind: the kind in which the speaker is able to distance himself from both while patting the "good ones" on the head for being "civilised", which usually translates as "almost as good as an atheist, but not quite".
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