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  #221  
Old 24.05.2017, 16:27
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Fun fact: Carriers work when you use them against countries like Afghanistan or Syria without any serious airforce in place. Newer generation smart ammunitions simply destroy them... so fighting a country like Russia with a carrier fleet is a bad idea.
Fun fact. Afhganistan is a landlocked country. Not really the type of terrain aircraft carriers were designed for.
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  #222  
Old 24.05.2017, 16:33
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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  #223  
Old 24.05.2017, 16:47
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

Meanwhile, back OT, some nutjob British "man" targeted and killed children on Monday night. Any chance we can stop willy-waving?

Yuck. I'm going to sit in the sun with my daughter. This thread is making me queasy.
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  #224  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:08
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Fun fact. Afhganistan is a landlocked country. Not really the type of terrain aircraft carriers were designed for.
?

An aircraft carrier is exactly designed for that: Bring air superiority into a battle while staying out of reach of the enemy artillery. Iraq is not land locked, but the aircraft carriers there did not exactly fight the Iraqi navy. The problem is that this strategy was developed in the late stages of WW2 and not exactly a secret. So any nation with a remotely modern air force can bring the party to a carrier fleet instead. Never happened so far but at least in the typical models and tests do hunter-bombers with modern smart weapons typically win against a carrier. Given the price of a carrier vs the price of some Sukhoi with a few laser guided weapons is the result pretty simple: Carriers remain operational for the kind of uneven conflicts we have seen the last 20 years, but are obsolete and a risk in battles between some remotely modern armies.
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  #225  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:13
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Meanwhile, back OT, some nutjob British "man" targeted and killed children on Monday night. Any chance we can stop willy-waving?

Yuck. I'm going to sit in the sun with my daughter. This thread is making me queasy.
My sister is taking my niece (who was at the concert) to a vigil tonight, hoping it might help her to come to terms with what happened.
Young people and children died, many children like my niece witnessed things they should never ever have to.
They are the people that this thread should be about.
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  #226  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:35
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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“He who doesn't understand history is doomed to repeat it.”
Hmmm..sometimes it is interpreted as repeating history/mistakes, sometimes it is a pattern in human nature, genetics, personal interests, etc.

I do like these broad history excursions we are getting here today, history is pushed out of curriculums, constantly. I do wonder if human kind, that usually repeats the same ol' unconstructive stuff multiple times within one's life is able to learn from documents we put at work hundreds of years ago. We did, since it suited our interests. Those populations who's interests are different will never recognize the value of the historical documents and it is naieve to expect it. These Magnas Cartas will always just be excuses and lack of discipline for some...lack of devotion and unwillingnes to forgo individual's interest for the sake of higher spiritual power.
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  #227  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:40
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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?

An aircraft carrier is exactly designed for that: Bring air superiority into a battle while staying out of reach of the enemy artillery. Iraq is not land locked, but the aircraft carriers there did not exactly fight the Iraqi navy. The problem is that this strategy was developed in the late stages of WW2 and not exactly a secret. So any nation with a remotely modern air force can bring the party to a carrier fleet instead. Never happened so far but at least in the typical models and tests do hunter-bombers with modern smart weapons typically win against a carrier. Given the price of a carrier vs the price of some Sukhoi with a few laser guided weapons is the result pretty simple: Carriers remain operational for the kind of uneven conflicts we have seen the last 20 years, but are obsolete and a risk in battles between some remotely modern armies.
point taken.

If you have allied countries in the area though its still much more efficient to use their airstrips than to bring in an aircraft carrier.
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  #228  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:43
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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The problem we know about and one partial solution, maybe, would be to spend more money on domestic defenses, services, health and education to protect and appease the population.
I wouldn't call it appeasing. I would call it a regular healthy investment. It is humorous to see that when some parties offer these investments in purely domestic affairs, they get called pathologically nationalistic.
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  #229  
Old 24.05.2017, 17:50
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Question for you all...

If someone gave you 500,000 CHF per year on the proviso that he can beat you up 10 times a year, would you take that deal?
Yes and then sign up for martial arts classes
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  #230  
Old 24.05.2017, 18:07
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Cool ideas.

But what is stopping a group of Muslims from gathering in someone's living room every Friday with an imam of their choice?

Not all mosques have minarets and loudspeakers to advertise their presence.
That's quite exactly what I said, or meant, by going underground.

As for your "but", I already said I think it wouldn't work.
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It only serves to reinforce the "the whole world is against us" mentality of disaffected groups.
Who do think you would be member of the overseeing body? Who is in the case of the two christian churches?
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  #231  
Old 24.05.2017, 18:42
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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As for your "but", I already said I think it wouldn't work.Who do think you would be member of the overseeing body? Who is in the case of the two christian churches?
There are quite a few Christian groups who do not identify with any of the major churches. Some do actually meet in people's living rooms. In fact they might tell you that Jesus held his Last Supper in the equivalent of somebody's living room.

You either have freedom of religion or you don't. There isn't a halfway solution.
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  #232  
Old 24.05.2017, 18:51
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

Been hearing that armed police have sealed off part of my home town, right on the edge of the town centre and within a mile of my UK home. It's probably nothing, but my great niece and nephew's school is at the top of that street so phoned my brother as he does the school runs. A few friends of his are stuck in their office inside the cordon and have been told to stay there until the bomb squad have arrived.

http://www.wigantoday.net/news/updat...woop-1-8560516
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  #233  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:00
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Been hearing that armed police have sealed off part of my home town, right on the edge of the town centre and within a mile of my UK home. It's probably nothing, but my great niece and nephew's school is at the top of that street so phoned my brother as he does the school runs. A few friends of his are stuck in their office inside the cordon and have been told to stay there until the bomb squad have arrived.

http://www.wigantoday.net/news/updat...woop-1-8560516
I hope everyone is safe.
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  #234  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:04
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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I hope everyone is safe.
Thanks and they will be. Nobody would hit Wigan because everyone would ask "Where?" It's just that it's halfway between Manchester and Liverpool.
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  #235  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:07
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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My sister is taking my niece (who was at the concert) to a vigil tonight, hoping it might help her to come to terms with what happened.
Young people and children died, many children like my niece witnessed things they should never ever have to.
They are the people that this thread should be about.
Just sent my two off to buy an after dinner ice cream at the shop up the road. I didn't even think twice.. how many parents in Manchester are holding and hugging their kids extra tight this evening?

Last edited by Swisstree; 24.05.2017 at 19:23.
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  #236  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:09
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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You either have freedom of religion or you don't. There isn't a halfway solution.
I would propose that a halfway solution would be to stop doing deals with the Saudis until they stop bank rolling Wahhabi schools in the UK, and stop bank rolling the extremists within Wahhabism.
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  #237  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:16
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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Been hearing that armed police have sealed off part of my home town, right on the edge of the town centre and within a mile of my UK home. It's probably nothing, but my great niece and nephew's school is at the top of that street so phoned my brother as he does the school runs. A few friends of his are stuck in their office inside the cordon and have been told to stay there until the bomb squad have arrived.

http://www.wigantoday.net/news/updat...woop-1-8560516
Any update?
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  #238  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:17
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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I didn't even think twice.. how many parents in Manchester are holding and hugging their kids extra tight this evening?
Funny you should say that. What I'm hearing from my mates is that it's the kids getting stressed because their parents work in the city centre. Two of my former colleagues have twin 6yr old boys, and they were crying for daddy to not go to work today, and all because they'd heard about it all in the school yard.
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  #239  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:29
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

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.. how many parents in Manchester are holding and hugging their kids extra tight this evening?
It reminds me of the Dunblane shooting, within less than a week of that tragedy I went to pick up my children from their school located in the middle of the countryside between Bearsden (Glasgow) and Milton of Campsie following a call from the school to come early, I asked why but was just told to come asap and that my two were ok. On arriving at the school all us parents were met by armed police, apparently a man had been seen by staff wandering the fields and hiding behind bushes and croft walls next to the school, he was apprehended and we later found out he was known to the police as someone who suffered from a mental deficiency. Yes, I do remember how we cuddled up to them more than usual that evening and the next few, grateful that school staff were extra vigilant only because of Dunblane, who knows how it might have ended.
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  #240  
Old 24.05.2017, 19:37
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Re: Explosion at Manchester Arena

City of Manchester's adopted son Eric Cantona's message...and not a seagull in sight.


http://www.bbc.com/sport/40026783


(hope link works)
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