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  #241  
Old 17.06.2017, 18:34
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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So, by that logic the loss of children, and especially babies, is what exactly?

EDIT : I didn't write anything about children did I - they don't have a profession.
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  #242  
Old 17.06.2017, 18:55
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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BTW: this interview with the chief of the Frankfurt Fire Brigade (the same guy as in the beginning of above video) is very interesting:

http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/gesel...a-1152148.html

Germany apparently has a lot more regulations and the fire brigades actually have a lot of say in the design and construction of buildings.
Would explain all the refugee shelters which haven't burnt down. Oh wait.
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  #243  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:11
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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II hope the nice people of Kensington and Chelsea who wanted the "eyesore" building beautifying are enjoying their new view.
Agree
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  #244  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:15
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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EDIT : I didn't write anything about children did I - they don't have a profession.
But they don't contribute meaningfully to society, which is what you said meant the architect was more of a loss. I think you are heartless.
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  #245  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:16
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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I hope the nice people of Kensington and Chelsea who wanted the "eyesore" building beautifying are enjoying their new view.
It's hardly their fault. It is, or was an eyesore, but this is absolutely no excuse for improving its appearance by using substandard or (possibly) illegal materials. If done well, it would have improved the lives of the tenants as much as anyone else.
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Old 17.06.2017, 19:18
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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But they don't contribute meaningfully to society, which is what you said meant the architect was more of a loss. I think you are heartless.
Compared to the "unemployed layabout" yes - I don't care what you think - people do not move to countries because of feelings - they move there because of economics. You may wish to escape reality but you cannot escape the consequences of escaping reality - Ayn Rand.
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  #247  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:25
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Well, I can see how sprinklers could get in the way of somebody smoking - or frying a large turkey... or lighting a christmas tree with actual candles.

Maybe this was discussed on the previous pages - but how exactly does such a sprinkler-system work in preventing false positives?

Do you only have sprinklers outside the flats, in the common areas or also inside?

Each time, the fire brigade has to come, you have to pay for it (AFAIK).
The way conventional sprinklers work is:

You plumb the whole building with pipes on the ceiling.
Each space gets a certain number of sprinkler heads, based on the floorspace of that room, and the "throw" radius of the heads.
Each individual sprinkler head has a fusible link (Usually a glass capsule filled with something like ether). Once flames heat the fusible link hot enough for it to let go then it does that and that opens a valve of sorts inside the head, water flows, the fire is suppressed.

The advantage is that there is no electrical or electronic control device - each sprinkler head is an autonomous machine which reacts to heat, and heat alone, by releasing water.

The disadvantages are:
They don't react until there really is a proper fire (and you can't turn them on remotely).

If you haven't got a suspended ceiling, then you can see the pipes.

The system has to be pressurized all the time, with a mains connection that can keep both pressure and flow up in the event of a major fire (i.e. you can't just have a 1000 gal tank on the roof of a 24 story building - it would have enough pressure, but if you can't replenish the tank at the rate the sprinkler(s) is/are releasing, then the system eventually runs out of water. Usually there is a flow sensor which starts feeding the cistern on the roof as soon as a sprinkler head triggers. The sprinkler feed us usually a completely separate piping system from fire hoses (otherwise the sprinkler heads doing the right thing would lose both pressure and flow as soon as a 2" hose gets turned on).

Once a sprinkler starts releasing water, you have to isolate that apt, or usually floor, via a shut off valve. Those valves are usually in an accessible place, and need visual inspection to ensure that if they have been closed off (for maintenance) that they are again opened. Basically any asshole could turn off the sprinklers and set a fire before the next inspection.

Perhaps this is tmi, but I hope it answers your question.
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  #248  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:26
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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It's hardly their fault. It is, or was an eyesore, but this is absolutely no excuse for improving its appearance by using substandard or (possibly) illegal materials. If done well, it would have improved the lives of the tenants as much as anyone else.


How does the "look" of something on the outside affect those who can't see it from the inside? That 9million could have been spent on a lot of different things that would have improved their lives far more.
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  #249  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:27
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Compared to the "unemployed layabout" yes - I don't care what you think - people do not move to countries because of feelings - they move there because of economics. You may wish to escape reality but you cannot escape the consequences of escaping reality - Ayn Rand.
Most of us are familiar with the works of Ayn Rand through basic education.
What point are you trying to make? In any case, it's out of place here.
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  #250  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:27
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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It will be the person who signed the contract to install the inflammable material - knowing the risks of taking this cheap alternative who is accountable.
It's not that simple ZR...if you are going to dig deeper, you'll probably find out that everything was done within the legal limits.

I think the standards should be changed and usually only after something like this happens do they change anything.
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  #251  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:37
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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It's not that simple ZR...if you are going to dig deeper, you'll probably find out that everything was done within the legal limits.
Yes, exactly. That's crazy
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  #252  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:41
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Compared to the "unemployed layabout" yes - I don't care what you think - people do not move to countries because of feelings - they move there because of economics. You may wish to escape reality but you cannot escape the consequences of escaping reality - Ayn Rand.
Hmmmm as someone else said earlier:

I always sense an agenda to your posts, care to spit it out?

Despicable. So in some cases, economics and racism - attracted by SVP policies?
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  #253  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:44
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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How does the "look" of something on the outside affect those who can't see it from the inside? That 9million could have been spent on a lot of different things that would have improved their lives far more.
I disagree that improving the look of the building and the area has no benefits for those living there.

More important, neither of us knows the ins and outs of the renovation, but my understanding is that the project included a lot of internal work as well as the controversial cladding. I wasn't aware that the cladding was insisted-on by the rich neighbours -- I'll take your word for that -- but my point stands, that it can be done well or badly, and is no excuse to have a swide-swipe, implying that the wealthier folk were somehow to blame for this appalling incident. Not a single one of them would have wished for work so substandard that there was any risk of this happening. Not one.
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  #254  
Old 17.06.2017, 19:53
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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It's not that simple ZR...if you are going to dig deeper, you'll probably find out that everything was done within the legal limits.

I think the standards should be changed and usually only after something like this happens do they change anything.
My bet is that cladding material is ok, but the installation wasn't done to the standards required to ensure that the cladding isn't a hazard. I wouldn't be surprised if the first few floors were done to standards and inspected, and from that point on work proceeded at a faster pace to maximize profit (which usually means sacrificing quality).

But this won't be clear until the forensics are done, presuming that nobody fiddles that.
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Old 17.06.2017, 19:54
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Totally frivolous OT question and I feel a bit bad for asking - but why fry a whole turkey?
Because a chicken is sometimes too small.

Anyways, ask Corbets, he did it last year.

Tom
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  #256  
Old 17.06.2017, 21:17
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Compared to the "unemployed layabout" yes - I don't care what you think - people do not move to countries because of feelings - they move there because of economics. You may wish to escape reality but you cannot escape the consequences of escaping reality - Ayn Rand.
What has the "unemployed layabout" got to do with economic migration? (Speaking as an immigrant to this country for work, Is it the schrodinger's immigrant again?).
Unless you mean you are heartless compared to the "unemployed layabout" which I cannot say for certain because we are talking hypotheticals, but I would wager that you are correct that you are.
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  #257  
Old 17.06.2017, 21:26
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Hmmmm as someone else said earlier:

I always sense an agenda to your posts, care to spit it out?

Despicable. So in some cases, economics and racism - attracted by SVP policies?
You and sense have no business being in the same sentence never mind the same thread.

You have demonstrated and been owned repeatedly by the likes of smoky and others on the topic of race - I have absolutely no problem with you , as a private citzen, wishing to contribute to whatever cause you desire (so long as that cause does not involve the wilful destruction of other people's lives or property) , what I do detest is your desperation to condemn anyone else who does not join in your hatred of Swiss society and what has made it successful from your absurdly high horse.
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  #258  
Old 17.06.2017, 21:28
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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What has the "unemployed layabout" got to do with economic migration? (Speaking as an immigrant to this country for work, Is it the schrodinger's immigrant again?).
Unless you mean you are heartless compared to the "unemployed layabout" which I cannot say for certain because we are talking hypotheticals, but I would wager that you are correct that you are.
Are you saying that no migrants are unemployed layabouts ???

See what I did there ? Kindly argue with facts rather than your beating heart , if possible.
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Old 17.06.2017, 21:31
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

What have you been smoking?
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Old 17.06.2017, 21:33
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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What has the "unemployed layabout" got to do with economic migration? (Speaking as an immigrant to this country for work, Is it the schrodinger's immigrant again?).
Unless you mean you are heartless compared to the "unemployed layabout" which I cannot say for certain because we are talking hypotheticals, but I would wager that you are correct that you are.

Hey,

That would be great for a new thread!
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