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  #161  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:03
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

Post crossed,

And yes, absolutely. But those families have made it plain they want to stay in their community.

Absent landlords though? We are not landlords- and we do use that flat and share it with other friends in need, who have to return to UK and have no accom- often. Thanks.
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  #162  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:08
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

Hey, I got away with a Hitler analogy, and nobody's blown their top yet.

Trolling ain't what it used to be
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  #163  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:08
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Post crossed,

And yes, absolutely. But those families have made it plain they want to stay in their community.

Absent landlords though? We are not landlords- and we do use that flat and share it with other friends in need, who have to return to UK and have no accom- often. Thanks.
Ah, so it's the other absentee landlords who should have their legally owned property seized by the state? I've got you...


Bill and Fred were discussing socialism in the King's Head:


Bill: So you're saying that if you had two cows and I had none, you'd give one to me?


Fred: Aye, that's right. That's how socialism works.


Bill: And if you had two horses and I had none, you'd give one to me?


Fred: Aye, that's fair, ain't it? Socialism, see!


Bill: And if you had two pigs and I had none...


Fred: Now, hang on right there! You know I've got two pigs...
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  #164  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:09
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Post crossed,

And yes, absolutely. But those families have made it plain they want to stay in their community.
Any why shouldn't they stay?

Is not as if there are no hotels in Kensington.

Or do you have access to information that we don't?
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  #165  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:11
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Would you not think it suitable, on a temporary basis, to requisition flats which have been bought as investment and left empty? Perhaps. Where are those people going to go??? Tents around Heathrow?
I'm sorry luv, but that's cloud cuckoo stuff, and you can't put tents around Heathrow. It's been tried

The need is immediate, and there are long standing emergency strategies in place that just need a little tweeking to accommodate the people who've lost their homes. This won't be in the media for, what I hope would be, very obvious reasons. If they are using the plan that I think they will, it's a far better, and more efficient solution, than chasing foreign buyers all over the globe for access to their properties that may be bare, empty shells with no utilities connected. Simple known solution vs a whole heap of red tape.
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  #166  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:18
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Ah, so it's the other absentee landlords who should have their legally owned property seized by the state? I've got you...


Bill and Fred were discussing socialism in the King's Head:


Bill: So you're saying that if you had two cows and I had none, you'd give one to me?


Fred: Aye, that's right. That's how socialism works.


Bill: And if you had two horses and I had none, you'd give one to me?


Fred: Aye, that's fair, ain't it? Socialism, see!


Bill: And if you had two pigs and I had none...


Fred: Now, hang on right there! You know I've got two pigs...
Reading problems DB- I said, yes absolutely!

But what I am not, is an absentee landlord- and what our apartment is not - is unused, by us, and friends in need, for one reason or another - for months on end at times. Just like our house here too.
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  #167  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:29
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Hôtels, for how long? Have you tried living in a Hôtel room with a family, for more than a couple of weeks.
The boom sector in West London is serviced apartments, and every one I've stayed in has been fantastic. The UK government has preferred room rates at hundreds of hotels across the country.
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Old 16.06.2017, 13:33
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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So, YOU propose a solution for those people?

Go on- tell me.

Post crossed - containers oh yes- wonderful- in the middle of Summer.

Hôtels, for how long? Have you tried living in a Hôtel room with a family, for more than a couple of weeks. Making those buildings safe- and all the others which are probably about to be declared unsafe- will take how long?
Why not? That's standard practice for anyone who's homeless and yes they may be stuck in an hotel for weeks or even months. But why should they get "better" treatment than anyone else who's made homeless?

And although everyone will moan at me, how about if some of them go back to their home countries? I doubt they're all refugees or asylum seekers. But I expect many have been happily collecting benefit money from the UK.
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  #169  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:57
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Statements like this sow the seeds of unrest.

It's $hit like this that terrifies me about Corbyn.

This is London not fricking Zimbabwe. I'm sure the local council, government and insurance companies will find suitable accommodation for those affected.
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  #170  
Old 16.06.2017, 13:59
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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And although everyone will moan at me, how about if some of them go back to their home countries? I doubt they're all refugees or asylum seekers. But I expect many have been happily collecting benefit money from the UK.
Is this post for real? You're an awful awful person Medea.
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  #171  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:01
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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It's $hit like this that terrifies me about Corbyn.

This is London not fricking Zimbabwe. I'm sure the local council, government and insurance companies will find suitable accommodation for those affected.
Yup, he's bat-shlt crazy if he thinks requisitioning people's private property without their consent or permission is in any way a good solution.

Hotels are a sufficient temporary measure until people can be re-homed.

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Why not? That's standard practice for anyone who's homeless and yes they may be stuck in an hotel for weeks or even months. But why should they get "better" treatment than anyone else who's made homeless?

And although everyone will moan at me, how about if some of them go back to their home countries? I doubt they're all refugees or asylum seekers. But I expect many have been happily collecting benefit money from the UK.
Loz1983, is that you?

PS: Just kidding, Loz.
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  #172  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:04
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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And although everyone will moan at me, how about if some of them go back to their home countries? I doubt they're all refugees or asylum seekers. But I expect many have been happily collecting benefit money from the UK.
If they're in the country illegally then I highly doubt they'll have been collecting benefit money.

What I suspect will come out this though is there will be difficulty in identifying victims who were illegal immigrants living 12 to a council flat that which has been sublet to them.
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  #173  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:06
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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PLEASE STOP EXPLOITING THE DEAD OF GRENFELL TOWER

Some Labourites are using the Grenfell disaster to score political points.

We don’t even know how many souls perished in the Grenfell Tower inferno, and yet already they are being marshalled to party-political ends. Already Labour-leaning commentators and campaigners are using them, using the freshly dead and the unspeakable horrors they experienced, to make milage for their party, to brand the Tories evil and Jeremy Corbyn saintly. In the 20 years I’ve been writing about politics, I can’t remember a national tragedy being exploited for party-political gain so quickly. The time between a calamity occurring and the use of it to harm one’s political enemies and fortify one’s political allies is shrinking all the time. It’s now mere hours, minutes even, courtesy of social media. What has happened to us?

In the 24 hours since fire engulfed that tower in west London, the blame game has been intensifying. There’s a feverish hunt for the one person or the one thing – or the one attitude, primarily uncaring Toryism – that we might pin this horror on. The landlords didn’t care enough. Theresa May’s new chief-of-staff ‘sat on’ a report about tower-block safety. Tories, including rich Tories with double-barrelled surnames (awful creatures), voted against a proposed new system of fines for landlords who let down tenants. Boris Johnson, when he was mayor, made cuts to fire services. Even worse, during a debate about the cuts in the London Assembly he told a Labour rival to ‘get stuffed’. That detail is appearing everywhere, because the true aim here is not to work out what went wrong at Grenfell but to say: ‘Tory scum.’

Social media is awash with Tory-bashing. This party, May herself, is to blame. How? Why? Did they light the flames? Fan the flames? No, it’s because they do not care. They are wicked and they emit this wickedness. They ‘love money more than life’, tweeters say; they have unleashed the ‘horror of austerity’; they are still the ‘nasty party’ and their nastiness kills. The speed and ease with which legitimate questions about what the managers of Grenfell allegedly failed to do have crossed the line into the blackening of certain Tories’ names, and the indictment of the entire culture of Toryism, suggests this is driven less by an instinct for thorough investigation than by an urge for retribution. There’s an old-world feel to it: something dreadful has happened and so we need someone, some thing, to punish for it, to project our grief on to, to transform into the human embodiment of this sin so that he or she might be cast out and our society cleansed.

This compulsion to blame is a central feature of 21st-century life. Every accident or awful thing that happens is followed by now almost instant demands for heads to roll. We seem incapable of accepting that sometimes horrendous experiences cannot easily be blamed on an individual or a group or a party. Like medieval communities who burnt witches when their crops failed – someone just had to be held morally responsible for the awful consequences of crop failure – today we point a collective or at least media finger at ‘uncaring’ individuals and institutions every time a tragedy occurs.

This is not to say there isn’t a discussion to be had about Grenfell. Of course there is, and a very serious one indeed. Specific issues, about the building’s cladding and its weak fire-alarm system, must be addressed. And far broader questions about the failures of house-building and the corresponding warping of the housing market, and how these things impact on house prices and on the moral value we accord to social-housing residents, must be asked too. James Heartfield raises these broader questions on spiked today, and spiked will publish more on this next week. But the blame game, today’s sometimes hysterical retributive instinct, doesn’t address these issues or questions. In fact it can distract from them. Its preference for condemnation, for the collective chiding of evil individuals, for finding the person or thing we can all round on and get a kick from destroying, elevates the narcissistic moral needs of the media mob over serious analysis of Britain’s broad and complicated economic and social problems.

‘But the Grenfell disaster is political’, the people exploiting it cry, somewhat defensively. And they’re right. It is. Social housing and gentrification and the eco-approved application of cladding to tower blocks are political issues, or at least public issues, and we should talk about them. But these people aren’t treating Grenfell as political; they’re treating it as party political. They’re using it to demean Toryism as evil, and big up Corbyn as the leader Britain needs right now. He cares, you see, unlike them. He is Good, they are Bad. This isn’t politics – this is a culture war, where the horrors experienced by the working classes of North Kensington are used to underpin the binary moralism of a Corbynista worldview of the right as wicked and the left as decent. They are building their political movement on the corpses of the poor, and no amount of radical-sounding lingo can cover up just how cynical, opportunistic and depraved that is.

http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite...2#.WUOKKuuGPmG
Oh the irony...
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  #174  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:23
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Is this post for real? You're an awful awful person Medea.
Don't you see the genius? Light up every building predominantly lived in by people on welfare and the refugee problem is solved
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  #175  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:26
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Oh the irony...
Yeah, I spotted that.
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  #176  
Old 16.06.2017, 14:31
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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And although everyone will moan at me, how about if some of them go back to their home countries? I doubt they're all refugees or asylum seekers. But I expect many have been happily collecting benefit money from the UK.
What a despicable post
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  #177  
Old 16.06.2017, 15:14
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

Why? For telling the truth? It's council housing, a certain percentage of people living there are almost guaranteed to be collecting benefits. We know some are ayslum seekers and they're not allowed to work in the UK so how else are they supporting themselves?
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  #178  
Old 16.06.2017, 15:19
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Why? For telling the truth?
No, because it was just an epically callous and insensitive post based mostly on prejudice and speculation. We only know of one asylum seeker (who died) and as far as I am aware there are no publicised statistics saying who was on benefits. However if it makes it easier to justify saying such things to yourself by feeling you are speaking 'the truth' then hey, knock yourself out.
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  #179  
Old 16.06.2017, 15:24
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Please read page 8, Paragraphs 2.4 and 2.8.
https://www.modernupvcwindows.co.uk/...ide---2014.pdf
I read your link.

Your statement that all private UK landlords are required to provide a fire extinguisher and a fire blanket is still incorrect.
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  #180  
Old 16.06.2017, 15:25
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Re: London Tower Block Fire

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Why? For telling the truth? It's council housing, a certain percentage of people living there are almost guaranteed to be collecting benefits. We know some are ayslum seekers and they're not allowed to work in the UK so how else are they supporting themselves?
Well, there has been a lot of opportune and speculative passing of blame, with people trying to tie this to the entire Tory party, both living and dead, and May in particular. I'm just surprised nobody has blamed Trump yet.

If they're fair game, as they appear to be, then so should be asylum seekers, Millwall, the Saudi Royal Family and the Billag.

Some people just need to take their irony suplements and not get offended at silly banter.
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