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  #201  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:18
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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They should have raised it to 30, at least.

Tom
I'd say at least 35. Maybe 30 if they pass a test.
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  #202  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:25
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

I think it's safe to conclude that in America the violence more often comes from the right than in Western Europe where it in huge majority is the left side that causes the violence and the attacks. (at least concerning the last 60 years.)

Also as for the far right there are to many differences to me to see the American and the European far right as the same thing.
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  #203  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:38
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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What makes you say that "most of the nation's problems" trace to those particular amendments? I realize the 14th is a huge litigation target, and the 16th created the tax disaster we have, but what's wrong with allowing a voting age of 18?
I argue eighteen is too young a voting age, and was put forth in response to the Vietnam War. The US draft was ended in 1973 largely as a result of the Vietnam War, so the primary argument of younger people voting was removed. The voting age should have returned to twenty one after the draft ended but could not due to the amendment (as opposed to a Federal law which could be repealed or updated). If I could, I would change it to 25+ and land-owning as voting requirements.

Quoting Wikipedia:

"President Dwight D. Eisenhower, in his 1954 State of the Union address, became the first president to publicly state his support for prohibiting age-based denials of suffrage for those 18 and older.[4] During the 1960s, both Congress and the state legislatures came under increasing pressure to lower the minimum voting age from 21 to 18. This was in large part due to the Vietnam War, in which many young men who were ineligible to vote were conscripted to fight in the war, thus lacking any means to influence the people sending them off to risk their lives. "Old enough to fight, old enough to vote," was a common slogan used by proponents of lowering the voting age. The slogan traced its roots to World War II, when President Franklin D. Roosevelt lowered the military draft age to eighteen."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty...s_Constitution

tl;dr: Voting changed to 18 in 1970 because of the armed forces draft which ended in 1973. The voting age should have gone back up afterward.

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I do believe the lack of savings. I see the "keeping up with the Joneses" of my friends and shake my head. Some of the least wealthy people make the worst expensive decisions - such as buying tickets to the American Football Super Bowl for $1,200. Plus airfare, meals, hotels, memorabilia, etc. One took out a loan against the house to make the trip.

Being broke is almost a badge of honor. There's a meme that makes the rounds on my FB feed rather often:
I agree with you, but this behavior implies a vast majority of the US is essentially incompetent in basic finance. This in an of itself is quite concerning, especially when referencing voting rights.
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  #204  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:42
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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What remains a mystery to me is how that kind of paranoid rubbish could possibly attract followers.
I'm just speculating but I think it has something to do with the human psychology of fear and desperation. Things are very screwed up over on this side of the pond, and the issues are decades old at this point.
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  #205  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:43
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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I truly cannot believe you have written THAT Please give me examples of the murderous of violence perpetrated by the 'left' in recent years in USA. and have you ever studied the history of the KKK ?

Thank you Edot for your reply- spot on.

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4New...5141196941939/
excluding islam inspired violence i presume? a few from usa that i remember:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_C...eball_shooting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_s...olice_officers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_s...olice_officers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_k..._NYPD_officers
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  #206  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:51
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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Articles from that site have been over social media since 7am that I'm aware of, so there's no need to go to the source.
However, if you quote somebody who quotes and don't yourself have the inclination to check the primary source, you credit the person you quote, saying they claim it is from xyz.

Sort of protects you in case they made it up or quoted it wrong.
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  #207  
Old 14.08.2017, 20:54
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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I'm just speculating but I think it has something to do with the human psychology of fear and desperation. Things are very screwed up over on this side of the pond, and the issues are decades old at this point.
The whole thing with terrorism is that the number of actual victims is mostly very low, but people's fear that it could happen to them next or somebody they know is irrationally high.
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  #208  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:04
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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I'm just speculating but I think it has something to do with the human psychology of fear and desperation. Things are very screwed up over on this side of the pond, and the issues are decades old at this point.
The fear and desperation is pretty much universal in the rest of the world too(I wouldn't want to be 18 or so nowadays). What is different about the US?

I used to quite enjoy travelling in the US. In the '80s I often walked around downtown Detroit (not just the nice private policed shopping areas) and never worried, or had a problem (and I'm about as white as you can get).

I no longer feel at ease when I visit now. I'm much more leery of rural white areas than I ever was in the "dangerous" areas of Detroit.

Is it drug use?
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  #209  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:06
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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What remains a mystery to me is how that kind of paranoid rubbish could possibly attract followers.
Far from me to detract from the gravity of it all, but talking about paranoid rubbish...seeing how many people (across all religions) believe that hell is a real thing, I am surprised at nothing.

I am getting more and more cynical and more and more detached about everything, less optimistic about the fact that people are intrinsically good even though there are a few bad apples - and that is scaring me.
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  #210  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:07
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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Yes of course. But not exactly left leaning. There are right leaning Dems and left leaning Reps. The Republican party actually once had some very reasonable thinkers.
Well, let's say there are certain states that used to be Dem ruled and are now Rep ruled. The Dems in those states are saying everything was much better when they were in charge and things have got so much worse under the Reps.

Maybe it's just me, but if I was a Dem I wouldn't be glorifying that period of my party's past.
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  #211  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:13
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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If I could, I would change it to 25+ and land-owning as voting requirements.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 14.08.2017 at 21:19. Reason: fixed quote
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  #212  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:16
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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I used to quite enjoy travelling in the US. In the '80s I often walked around downtown Detroit (not just the nice private policed shopping areas) and never worried, or had a problem (and I'm about as white as you can get).

I no longer feel at ease when I visit now. I'm much more leery of rural white areas than I ever was in the "dangerous" areas of Detroit.
Never been to Detrot, but I'm very much the type of person who doesn't claim to jknow a place until he's walked most of it. Walking gives you a totalyl different perspective on cities.

I've done various US cities including Houston and Philadelphia. I have at times been in streets where I thought, I wouldn't want to be here after dark.I've been in streets where people really stared at me. But these were more the exception, short patches, and not typical of broader neighbourhoods. I was never actualyl threatened. On the contrary, people who came up and talked to me thought i might be lost and offered to give directions, or were just seeking to chat. On the whole a lot of the fear mongering is just that. Most people there just want to get on with their lives and aren't seeking to rob or murder anybody.

I don't know what the USA was like in the 80ies or 90ies, but today it's much better than its reputation.
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  #213  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:44
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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Never been to Detrot, but I'm very much the type of person who doesn't claim to jknow a place until he's walked most of it. Walking gives you a totalyl different perspective on cities.

I've done various US cities including Houston and Philadelphia. I have at times been in streets where I thought, I wouldn't want to be here after dark.I've been in streets where people really stared at me. But these were more the exception, short patches, and not typical of broader neighbourhoods. I was never actualyl threatened. On the contrary, people who came up and talked to me thought i might be lost and offered to give directions, or were just seeking to chat. On the whole a lot of the fear mongering is just that. Most people there just want to get on with their lives and aren't seeking to rob or murder anybody.

I don't know what the USA was like in the 80ies or 90ies, but today it's much better than its reputation.
Living there is a different story. The murder rate in Detroit is 85+ times that of Zurich. People often don't stop at red lights or to get gas for fear of getting car jacked - because that's the reality. Philadelphia is in the middle of a heroin epidemic, with over 30,000 addicts in the city. And it's only getting worse...

Of course, it's true that most people just want to get on with their lives and aren't robbers or murderers.

Last edited by pilatus1; 14.08.2017 at 22:19. Reason: add link
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  #214  
Old 14.08.2017, 21:55
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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Living there is a different story. The murder rate in Detroit is 85+ times that of Zurich. People often don't stop at red lights or to get gas for fear of getting car jacked - because that's the reality. Philadelphia is in the middle of a heroin epidemic, with over 30,000 addicts in the city. And it's only getting worse...

Of course, it's true that most people just want to get on with their lives and aren't robbers or murderers.
The thing with gang warfare is that the stats are miselading. Most of the people killed are members of rival gangs. That doesn't justify the killing. Nobody deserves to die. But it creates a totally wrong impression that you as a total stranger just walking by, are at any increased risk of getting shot. Or indeed that a person living in such an area and just getting on with their legitimate business will get shot.

I don't know much about car jackings mind you.
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Old 14.08.2017, 22:06
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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The thing with gang warfare is that the stats are miselading. Most of the people killed are members of rival gangs. That doesn't justify the killing. Nobody deserves to die. But it creates a totally wrong impression that you as a total stranger just walking by, are at any increased risk of getting shot. Or indeed that a person living in such an area and just getting on with their legitimate business will get shot.

I don't know much about car jackings mind you.
I've had guns pulled on me twice in Philly, and i'm no gang member or thug or anything of the sort. Once at a Temple U. party, once while driving down Broad Street (A main artery in center city, with cops on every corner, not some remote ghetto..)

Also had a friend get shot and killed in a carjacking, back in 1997.
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Old 14.08.2017, 22:21
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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So....

Should they remove the statue of General Lee or not?
Removing statues because it offends someone could be a slippery slope.
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  #217  
Old 14.08.2017, 22:32
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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The whole thing with terrorism is that the number of actual victims is mostly very low, but people's fear that it could happen to them next or somebody they know is irrationally high.
I agree wholeheartedly, but I was referring more to ordinary people being so attracted or at least open to very radical ideologies.
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  #218  
Old 14.08.2017, 22:40
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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In the US, there are no longer serious legal barriers to land ownership. Renting is largely by cost and inclination. If not land ownership then some sort of stipulation for "skin in the game" as it were.
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  #219  
Old 14.08.2017, 22:41
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

Despite a few isolated incidents, the US overall must be a cool country to live in ...
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  #220  
Old 14.08.2017, 22:42
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Re: I hate Illinois Nazis!

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People often don't stop at red lights or to get gas for fear of getting car jacked.
So, like driving in Napoli.

Tom
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