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  #281  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:29
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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LOL at pulling the "what me?" face.



To any reasonable reader, that looks like you are implying that Loz1983 is a sexual pervert. Why else would he be "up on top somewhere" of a "me too" campaign?

And here we have, in a nutshell, what's wrong with the whole bloody circus. It's being devalued by people who think it's a great way to drag down people with whom they disagree. Once upon a time you'd just drop hints that they were communists, or atheists, or Jews. Now you imply that they'd be "up on top somewhere" of a list of sexual transgressors.

Plus ca change and all that...
Steady on. curley proposed a "#MeToo" campaign "about common guys". Are you suggesting that she's saying that all "guys" are sexual perverts? I think, contrary to your reading of her post, that she's saying "let's have a #MeToo-style campaign to expose mongers of Fake News". Granted, that showcases my exceptional comprehension skills, but I think curley simply didn't want to use the word "monger" in a sentence.
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  #282  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:31
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Steady on. curley proposed a "#MeToo" campaign "about common guys". Are you suggesting that she's saying that all "guys" are sexual perverts?
No, just Loz1983:

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I wouldn't be surprised if you were up on top somewhere.
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  #283  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:36
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Steady on. curley proposed a "#MeToo" campaign "about common guys". Are you suggesting that she's saying that all "guys" are sexual perverts? I think, contrary to your reading of her post, that she's saying "let's have a #MeToo-style campaign to expose mongers of Fake News". Granted, that showcases my exceptional comprehension skills, but I think curley simply didn't want to use the word "monger" in a sentence.
Well, I might have, but the word 'monger' was not in my vocabulary until just now
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  #284  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:42
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Well it's not Fake News. "Had to" merely expresses obligation.
Isn't that Curley's point? Affleck wasn't obliged to withdraw. He chose to.

Also, shouldn't we object to the term "withdraw"?
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  #285  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:46
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Isn't that Curley's point? Affleck wasn't obliged to withdraw. He chose to.

Also, shouldn't we object to the term "withdraw"?
He chose to, because he felt he had no other option. Hardly fake news.
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  #286  
Old 26.01.2018, 12:50
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

Not sure what to make of the Financial Times exposé of the all-male Presidents' Club bash. Is it a reliable report by Madison Marriage (seems an odd name, though she has apparently been using it for articles since 2012) or has she been tempted to exaggerate?

Financial Times: Men Only: Inside the charity fundraiser where hostesses are put on show
Undercover footage from inside secretive Presidents Club Charity Dinner (no groping of women to see here as far as I can tell)
BBC Newsnight: Interview with undercover journalist Madison Marriage

You'd think that any woman asked to wear a particular colour of underwear for a job described as "hostess" might question what was expected of them - unless it was simply to give them a streamlined look (e.g. avoid white bra straps appearing out of a black outfit). Perhaps the women's role at the event was similar to that of Japanese hostesses, though boundaries there are apparently not clear cut.

Wikipedia: Host and hostess clubs in Japan
The Telegraph: The grim truth about life as a Japanese hostess
"As a hostess I poured drinks, sang karaoke and tried to ignore the customers who invited me to hotel rooms after work. Hostesses aren’t supposed to have sex with customers, but many do."

It all seems a bit archaic, an all-male guest list with the only women present in a servile role, but if the women sign up and some return repeatedly is it really as bad as the report makes out?
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  #287  
Old 26.01.2018, 13:04
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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It all seems a bit archaic, an all-male guest list with the only women present in a servile role, but if the women sign up and some return repeatedly is it really as bad as the report makes out?
Ladies Night Dudley – Charity Ladies Night In Lower Gornal

Charity ladies night staring male stripper The Stallion, male stripper Trouble, male stripper CJ, and comedy drag act Pam Catz, perform to a sold out audience. Money raised in excess £1600, which was for a great cause. Lady said “thank you so much to Eye Candy UK for supplying us with top quality acts.”
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  #288  
Old 26.01.2018, 13:11
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

Of all the messages this whole thing sordid tale sends, there is a host of other very negative and evil payload that people are not recognizing or refuse to acknowledge. As much as it is a great cause to liberate allegedly oppressed women and shine light on corruption, would it be too offensive for ask "What the hell are we becoming?" in the process.

A couple of problems with the current dynamic:
1) There is no due process
2) This lynch mob mentality can spiral out of control
3) Even worse, maybe this mob mentality might actually be controlled for some person's or group's nefarious purpose.

In this instance, we are seeing a sordid tale of the moral and ethical failings of an oppressor, his enablers and even the purported victims. This has been knowingly going on for decades, and there is a whole culture being indicted here. Not really seeing what the redemption here is, especially since Weinstein is still walking around freely. Why isn't he in jail, and what message does that send?
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  #289  
Old 26.01.2018, 13:32
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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He chose to, because he felt he had no other option. Hardly fake news.
See, that is what I'm arguing: Unless he is a friend of yours and personally told you that this was his reason (in which case you should have mentioned that fact) you put your personal interpretation into a link-text, making it look like you copied that from the article.

I know it's the way to go these days, but I deeply feel it's not okay. Which is why I point these things out. These little details go straight to people's "stomach" (meaning they are manipulative, not informative).

As to my person: If you give me a link, I will follow it, read it, make my opinion about it. If you put an opinion in the link it seriously peeves me. Just like I simply can't stand Amrican news-stations where journalists have an opinion and shout (literally shout - as one I saw yesterday) them out instead of just aksing the right questions and let the answers of the other person speak for themselves, in the sense that I make my own mind up about those answers.

Not specifically referring to that interview which is all over the net, I seriously think a journalist should not say things like "so you're saying xyz" as again it is a subtle - or actually not so subtle - manipulation of the viewer.
That's different if you and I sit at a table and have a private discussion. There "so you're saying xyz" is helpful as it leads to mutual understanding. But in that case nobody else is listening/judging yet you have the chance to stop me from misssunderstanding. It's commonly used in sales/business talks and there it has it's due eligibility.
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  #290  
Old 26.01.2018, 13:44
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

Good post,I agree with everything. But I just have to ask, surely you could have squeezed one more 's' into:
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misssunderstanding
couldn't you?
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  #291  
Old 26.01.2018, 14:35
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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......
You'd think that any woman asked to wear a particular colour of underwear for a job described as "hostess" might question what was expected of them - unless it was simply to give them a streamlined look (e.g. avoid white bra straps appearing out of a black outfit). Perhaps the women's role at the event was similar to that of Japanese hostesses, though boundaries there are apparently not clear cut.......

It all seems a bit archaic, an all-male guest list with the only women present in a servile role, but if the women sign up and some return repeatedly is it really as bad as the report makes out?
Boundaries seem obviously not cleaer cut. Imo it doesn't really matter whether it is as bad as reported or not: If they employ "waitresses" the job description is clear, uniform all the way down to black underwear or not.
If they want what they seem to want, they should employ professional prostitutes and pay the according price.

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Ladies Night Dudley – Charity Ladies Night In Lower Gornal

Charity ladies night staring male stripper The Stallion, male stripper Trouble, male stripper CJ, and comedy drag act Pam Catz, perform to a sold out audience. Money raised in excess £1600, which was for a great cause. Lady said “thank you so much to Eye Candy UK for supplying us with top quality acts.”
I feel that is different as it seems to be announced as what it really is and the employed strippers knew they were there to strip.

While the example above was pretending to be a male-dinner-charity-event only.
Which leads to the question: Why do some guys need to pretend to be all neat and sophisticated and then drop to the lowest level behind closed doors?
There was a non-disclosure agreement - which doesn't necessarily imply sexual harrassment but could also be about not talking about who was there, spent how much on what but we don't know that. As the journalist was there as a hostesse and apparently they didn't get a copy of what they signed (which makes it invalid), I think she should have photographed and published that paper.

I wonder whether for the event Loz linked there was also a non-disclosure agreement?

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..... Not really seeing what the redemption here is, especially since Weinstein is still walking around freely. Why isn't he in jail, and what message does that send?
This!
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  #292  
Old 26.01.2018, 14:36
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Good post,I agree with everything. But I just have to ask, surely you could have squeezed one more 's' into:
couldn't you?
"s"
there you go
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  #293  
Old 26.01.2018, 14:46
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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See, that is what I'm arguing: Unless he is a friend of yours and personally told you that this was his reason (in which case you should have mentioned that fact) you put your personal interpretation into a link-text, making it look like you copied that from the article.

I know it's the way to go these days, but I deeply feel it's not okay. Which is why I point these things out. These little details go straight to people's "stomach" (meaning they are manipulative, not informative).

As to my person: If you give me a link, I will follow it, read it, make my opinion about it. If you put an opinion in the link it seriously peeves me. Just like I simply can't stand Amrican news-stations where journalists have an opinion and shout (literally shout - as one I saw yesterday) them out instead of just aksing the right questions and let the answers of the other person speak for themselves, in the sense that I make my own mind up about those answers.

Not specifically referring to that interview which is all over the net, I seriously think a journalist should not say things like "so you're saying xyz" as again it is a subtle - or actually not so subtle - manipulation of the viewer.
That's different if you and I sit at a table and have a private discussion. There "so you're saying xyz" is helpful as it leads to mutual understanding. But in that case nobody else is listening/judging yet you have the chance to stop me from misssunderstanding. It's commonly used in sales/business talks and there it has it's due eligibility.
In all three links I didn't copy the headline. I also have no "proof" that Michael Douglas had to pre-emptively deny sexual misconduct accusations, but he obviously felt that he had to, or else he wouldn't have done it. This isn't manipulation, it's my interpretation of what's happened.

Hell, you're starting to sound like marton. This is an internet forum, if you want unbiased news reporting go and read Breitbart.
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  #294  
Old 26.01.2018, 15:03
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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.......
Hell, you're starting to sound like marton. This is an internet forum, if you want unbiased news reporting go and read Breitbart.
what a way to say we will never understand eachother.

addition: But you do have a point re internet-forum and unbiased news reporting. I just have to remember to distinguish who's posts I'm reading - just like I distinguish which news-paper I'm reading.
After all, I'm the one who always compares EF with a pub. Point taken
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  #295  
Old 26.01.2018, 15:10
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Hell, you're starting to sound like marton. This is an internet forum, if you want unbiased news reporting go and read Breitbart.
I always fall for the mistake of responding to Marton, hoping someday that some dawn will break. Just my part in trying to be fair.
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Old 26.01.2018, 15:13
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Hell, you're starting to sound like marton. This is an internet forum, if you want unbiased news reporting go and read Breitbart.
It's so cute that you think that there is unbiased news out there.
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Old 26.01.2018, 15:21
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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I always fall for the mistake of responding to Marton, hoping someday that some dawn will break. Just my part in trying to be fair.
coming from this internet site's most needy troll
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  #298  
Old 26.01.2018, 15:40
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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I feel that is different as it seems to be announced as what it really is and the employed strippers knew they were there to strip.

While the example above was pretending to be a male-dinner-charity-event only.
Which leads to the question: Why do some guys need to pretend to be all neat and sophisticated and then drop to the lowest level behind closed doors?
There was a non-disclosure agreement - which doesn't necessarily imply sexual harrassment but could also be about not talking about who was there, spent how much on what but we don't know that. As the journalist was there as a hostesse and apparently they didn't get a copy of what they signed (which makes it invalid), I think she should have photographed and published that paper.

I wonder whether for the event Loz linked there was also a non-disclosure agreement?
Successful, wealthy powerful men are wankers. As a general rule, you don't get to become successful and powerful without being a wanker. They also go to these events to behave like wankers, but because they don't want people to know that they're behaving like wankers so they have non-disclosure agreements.

The event that I linked to isn't attended by the rich and powerful, more likely the regular patrons of Mecca Bingo, hence no non-disclosure agreement. But at events like this, they still behave like wankers.
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Old 26.01.2018, 16:36
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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Successful, wealthy powerful men are wankers. As a general rule, you don't get to become successful and powerful without being a wanker. They also go to these events to behave like wankers, but because they don't want people to know that they're behaving like wankers so they have non-disclosure agreements.

The event that I linked to isn't attended by the rich and powerful, more likely the regular patrons of Mecca Bingo, hence no non-disclosure agreement. But at events like this, they still behave like wankers.
typical rubbish from you: ignorant, ill informed and totally wrong
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Old 26.01.2018, 16:37
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Re: When You Wish Upon a Weinstein

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typical rubbish from you: ignorant, ill informed and totally wrong
How so?
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