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  #381  
Old 16.03.2021, 13:00
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I think the press has still treated Kate better. Does anyone think that Kate might be a nicer person by any chance?
Could be, or maybe it doesn't make much difference, as the press appears to have turned on a sixpence with other people, like Fergie. Perhaps the press is more influenced by how nice a person is to the press.

What to make of the "Meghan made Kate cry"/"Kate made Meghan cry" saga?

Hard to understand why either of these grown women would be in tears (of sadness? frustration? anger?) over flower girls' dresses.

Interview transcript (Ctrl/Cmd+F to look for "Kate") [Must confess that when watching the interview I laughed when she said "And she brought me flowers and a note, apologising. And she did what I would do if I knew that I hurt someone, right, to just take accountability for it."]

This seems to be the latest, though anti-Meghan and pro-Kate, so perhaps by definition untrue.

Daily Mirror: Meghan Markle 'slammed door in Kate Middleton's face' after she 'made her cry'

Daily Mail: Slammed door, flowers thrown in the bin... and why the row that made a Duchess weep was about FAR more than Princess Charlotte's dress (but was it Meghan, Kate or even both left in tears?!)
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  #382  
Old 16.03.2021, 13:23
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Hard to understand why either of these grown women would be in tears (of sadness? frustration? anger?) over flower girls' dresses.
No, someone said something on a harsher tone i.e. disagreed a tad stronger than needed or was too honest (e.g.I don't like it, it's vulgar, it makes you look fat) and hell and blah blah. This is typical women behaviour, Kate, Meghan whoever. IMHO
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  #383  
Old 16.03.2021, 13:28
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Could be, or maybe it doesn't make much difference, as the press appears to have turned on a sixpence with other people, like Fergie. Perhaps the press is more influenced by how nice a person is to the press.

What to make of the "Meghan made Kate cry"/"Kate made Meghan cry" saga?

Hard to understand why either of these grown women would be in tears (of sadness? frustration? anger?) over flower girls' dresses.

Interview transcript (Ctrl/Cmd+F to look for "Kate") [Must confess that when watching the interview I laughed when she said "And she brought me flowers and a note, apologising. And she did what I would do if I knew that I hurt someone, right, to just take accountability for it."]

This seems to be the latest, though anti-Meghan and pro-Kate, so perhaps by definition untrue.

Daily Mirror: Meghan Markle 'slammed door in Kate Middleton's face' after she 'made her cry'

Daily Mail: Slammed door, flowers thrown in the bin... and why the row that made a Duchess weep was about FAR more than Princess Charlotte's dress (but was it Meghan, Kate or even both left in tears?!)
Who reads this stuff???? I can't blame the media if they fabricate what readers demand.
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  #384  
Old 16.03.2021, 13:58
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I think the press has still treated Kate better. Does anyone think that Kate might be a nicer person by any chance?
I don't think being "nice" comes into it. The press treat Kate Middleton better because she comes across as someone who has accepted her position and the duty and responsibility that comes along with it. Meghan Markle comes across as someone who wanted the position but not the sacrifice that it comes with it.

The press and public have been equally critical of other Royals who they feel abuse or disrespect the position. Prince Andrew being the most recent example, his popularity really is in the dumps (as an aside, compare the style of Emily Maitlis' interview with that of Oprah Winfrey).
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  #385  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:18
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I don't think being "nice" comes into it. The press treat Kate Middleton better because she comes across as someone who has accepted her position and the duty and responsibility that comes along with it.
Which for a lot of people might be the definition of nice. Or grown up, or something similar.

The public might be in some way critical of the royals (unlike here where important people enjoy their private life just fine) but at the same time there is a lot of support, over the top positive attention, etc. So, to pick selectively media negative attention when all royal roles come both with bad and good, seems manipulative to me. Media in the UK sells what the consumers will pay for, popularity has never automatically meant quality before. That goes for the royals, too.
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  #386  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:28
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

From my days of reading Hello magazine and their ilk, I don’t think the press was necessarily kind to Kate Middleton. Not only was she labelled Waity Kaity, she was also called boring, bland, and there then were those rumours that she only went to St Andrews in order to catch the big fish. Her mother was nicknamed the Trolley Dolly, and Kate’s siblings were constantly called work-shy. I think her dad was the only one to be treated fairly.

How I see it is that despite all the brouhaha around her and her family, Kate never responded to any accusations/ rumours. The family just kept quiet and the press just got tired of the Middletons. They are “just a boring plain” family.

Sadly for Meghan, she went all gung -ho on the press, trying to refute everything that was printed on her. That, I think is like putting your head in a hornet’s nest!
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  #387  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:40
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I don't think being "nice" comes into it. The press treat Kate Middleton better because she comes across as someone who has accepted her position and the duty and responsibility that comes along with it. Meghan Markle comes across as someone who wanted the position but not the sacrifice that it comes with it.

The press and public have been equally critical of other Royals who they feel abuse or disrespect the position. Prince Andrew being the most recent example, his popularity really is in the dumps (as an aside, compare the style of Emily Maitlis' interview with that of Oprah Winfrey).
Which is the one double standard I really do think is terrible - Meghan Markle gets a full external-law-firm-root-cause-investigation because someone said she's a bully, while at the same time it is pretty much a cast iron certainty that Prince Andrew is a paedophile who refuses to cooperate with the American law enforcement and the response is that he is just quietly moved behind the scenes and allowed to carry on with his life.
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Old 16.03.2021, 14:50
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Which is the one double standard I really do think is terrible - Meghan Markle gets a full external-law-firm-root-cause-investigation because someone said she's a bully, while at the same time it is pretty much a cast iron certainty that Prince Andrew is a paedophile who refuses to cooperate with the American law enforcement and the response is that he is just quietly moved behind the scenes and allowed to carry on with his life.
Very true!
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  #389  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:51
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Which is the one double standard I really do think is terrible - Meghan Markle gets a full external-law-firm-root-cause-investigation because someone said she's a bully, while at the same time it is pretty much a cast iron certainty that Prince Andrew is a paedophile who refuses to cooperate with the American law enforcement and the response is that he is just quietly moved behind the scenes and allowed to carry on with his life.
There is a difference. Alleged Workplace bullying in the U.K. must be investigated as it could contravene the Equality Act 2010 and so could be unlawful.

As wrong as it may seem, I don't believe Prince Andrew has broken any U.K. laws by not cooperating with American law enforcement.
I think he should cooperate though.
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  #390  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:51
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Which is the one double standard I really do think is terrible - Meghan Markle gets a full external-law-firm-root-cause-investigation because someone said she's a bully, while at the same time it is pretty much a cast iron certainty that Prince Andrew is a paedophile who refuses to cooperate with the American law enforcement and the response is that he is just quietly moved behind the scenes and allowed to carry on with his life.
I'm not going to defend Prince Andrew at all, but he is the son of the ruling Queen of the UK. Meghan is her grandsons wife. I'm guessing the closer to the head of things you are, the more protected you are.
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  #391  
Old 16.03.2021, 14:58
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I'm not going to defend Prince Andrew at all, but he is the son of the ruling Queen of the UK. Meghan is her grandsons wife. I'm guessing the closer to the head of things you are, the more protected you are.
Probably the case, but it certainly shouldn't be. Im for fair treatment of all people, which is why I get so annoyed at MM's accusation of racism without naming the perpetrator. Andrew should also be held to account, if he's been taking part in sexual abuse he should be prosecuted for it.
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  #392  
Old 16.03.2021, 15:44
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Which is the one double standard I really do think is terrible - Meghan Markle gets a full external-law-firm-root-cause-investigation because someone said she's a bully, while at the same time it is pretty much a cast iron certainty that Prince Andrew is a paedophile who refuses to cooperate with the American law enforcement and the response is that he is just quietly moved behind the scenes and allowed to carry on with his life.
Judging from what she has said in her numerous interviews, my impression is that the woman who is accusing Prince Andrew has embellished her story. It's not for him to prove his innocence but for her to prove that what she's claiming about her interaction with him is true and she doesn't convince me.

Take the photo of her with Prince Andrew. She said in one of her interviews (YouTube: "Exposing Jeffrey Epstein's international sex trafficking ring | 60 Minutes Australia", approx. 19:20) that she felt "disgusted, absolutely disgusted" when allegedly told by Ghislaine Maxwell on the alleged car trip home from the alleged visit to Tramp nightclub that she'd have to do for Prince Andrew what she did for Jeffrey Epstein, implying something sexual. She says the photo was taken when they arrived back at Ghislaine Maxwell's house. She's leaning into Prince Andrew, has her arm around him and is smiling broadly. She doesn't look disgusted at all.

So if she's misrepresenting her feelings at the time, did what she claims she felt disgusted by, i.e. Ghislaine Maxwell's instructions, happen? Did the car trip happen? Did the visit to Tramp nightclub, with Prince Andrew supposedly dancing so closely his sweat was dripping over her, as she told the BBC, happen?

She is reported to have said "All of us went upstairs and I asked Jeffrey to snap a picture of me with the Prince. I wanted something to show my mom." (Daily Mirror). Yet she apparently told the Miami Herald that she had run away from home (cf. Miami Herald YouTube video: "How teen runaway Virginia Roberts became one of Jeffrey Epstein's victims"). If you had run away from home, would you want to give your mom a souvenir photo? She has claimed to have been a "sex slave" and to have been "trafficked". If you were a trafficked sex slave (to my mind a sex slave is someone like the Yazidi girls, raped and held prisoner by Islamic State), would you want a souvenir photo to show your mom? If you were in fact on good terms and in touch with your mom, wouldn't you ask her help to escape?

And that's just the photo. There's more about her story that, IMO, doesn't add up either. I'm no fan of Prince Andrew and thought he confirmed the impression of being pompous in the Newsnight interview but one woman telling (selling?) a salacious story with holes in it to the media doesn't convince me that he's a sex criminal let alone a paedophile.
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  #393  
Old 16.03.2021, 22:55
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I'm not going to defend Prince Andrew at all, but he is the son of the ruling Queen of the UK. Meghan is her grandsons wife. I'm guessing the closer to the head of things you are, the more protected you are.
Which western countries extradite their citizens against the citizen's will (applicable to which allegated crimes), or forces them to cooperate with foreign authorities? I don't know any.
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  #394  
Old 17.03.2021, 06:44
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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Which western countries extradite their citizens against the citizen's will (applicable to which allegated crimes), or forces them to cooperate with foreign authorities? I don't know any.
Didn't google then did you.

Just from the UK to US:

"Gary McKinnon – extradition blocked on 16 October 2012 by order of Home Secretary Theresa May, on the grounds that "Mr McKinnon's extradition would give rise to such a high risk of him ending his life that a decision to extradite would be incompatible with Mr McKinnon's human rights."

NatWest Three – extradited to Texas on fraud charges against a British bank while they were living in the UK and working for the British bank. Arriving in the US on 13 July 2006 they eventually pleaded guilty to wire fraud in a plea bargain.

Babar Ahmad – extradited in 2012 on charges of running web sites supporting the Chechen and Afghan insurgencies while in the UK.[22][23]

Syed Talha Ahsan – extradited in 2012 on charges of running web sites supporting the Chechen and Afghan insurgencies while in the UK, co-defendant with Babar Ahmad[23]

Abu Hamza al-Masri – extradited to the US on 5 October 2012, among other things accused of conspiring with convicted American terrorist James Ujaama while in the UK.[23]

Alex Stone – alleged child abuse, charges subsequently dropped after 6 months in US jail. According to Mr. Stone "there appeared to be no defence to extradition and no evidence at all was presented in this case".[24]

Ian Norris of Morgan Crucible – alleged price fixing (while in the UK and price fixing was not a crime in the UK at the time). Extradition overturned by the House of Lords on appeal.[25] Subsequent extradition request on obstruction of justice charges approved in July 2008,[26] extradited March 2010.[27]

Wojciech Chodan and Jeffrey Tesler – face extradition over their alleged role in a Nigerian bribery scandal, but argue that almost none of the misconduct they are accused of was connected to the US and that the alleged bribery plot took place mainly in the UK or Nigeria.[28][29]

Richard O'Dwyer – extradition request made in May 2011. The extradition request follows the Southern District Court in New York bringing two charges against Richard O'Dwyer for criminal copyright infringement in relation to TVShack.net while in the UK. The two charges, conspiracy to commit copyright infringement and criminal infringement of copyright, each carry a maximum sentence of five years.[30][31]

Christopher Tappin – extradition request made in 2010. Accused of selling batteries to be used in Iranian surface-to-air missiles while in the UK. Mr Tappin says he was approached by US agents asking him to ship batteries from the US to the Netherlands who sent paperwork saying that permits were not required and then sought to have him arrested and extradited. A spokesman for Tappin's lawyers said "This is a case in which the Customs agents caused the offence to be committed rather than merely providing an opportunity for the defendant to commit it."[32] On 9 January 2013, Tappin was given a 33-month prison sentence for arms dealing and fined US$11,357 (£7,095).[33][34]

David McIntyre, an ex-soldier, was serving in Afghanistan when in July 2012 he was ordered to return to the UK after being accused of fraud following another man naming him in a plea bargain. He was extradited on 3 July 2014"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UK%E2%...0to%20the%20UK.
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  #395  
Old 17.03.2021, 07:03
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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And that's just the photo. There's more about her story that, IMO, doesn't add up either. I'm no fan of Prince Andrew and thought he confirmed the impression of being pompous in the Newsnight interview but one woman telling (selling?) a salacious story with holes in it to the media doesn't convince me that he's a sex criminal let alone a paedophile.
I think she was a minor back then? And it was already proved the sleazy characters were running a child sex trafficking ring. I would say let the justice system establish whether PA is guilty or not. Wait, we won't see that because the royals investigate their things privately.

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  #396  
Old 17.03.2021, 10:18
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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From my days of reading Hello magazine and their ilk, I don’t think the press was necessarily kind to Kate Middleton. Not only was she labelled Waity Kaity, she was also called boring, bland, and there then were those rumours that she only went to St Andrews in order to catch the big fish. Her mother was nicknamed the Trolley Dolly, and Kate’s siblings were constantly called work-shy. I think her dad was the only one to be treated fairly.

How I see it is that despite all the brouhaha around her and her family, Kate never responded to any accusations/ rumours. The family just kept quiet and the press just got tired of the Middletons. They are “just a boring plain” family.

Sadly for Meghan, she went all gung -ho on the press, trying to refute everything that was printed on her. That, I think is like putting your head in a hornet’s nest!
Don’t forget, they also photographed Kate topless too. She’s far from had an easy time.
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Old 17.03.2021, 10:39
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Don’t forget, they also photographed Kate topless too. She’s far from had an easy time.
Who cares too much about being photographed topless, sure it's a violation of privacy and was likely very annoying, but at least it's not a reputational issue. She has every right to go topless and it doesn't hurt anyone.
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Old 17.03.2021, 11:51
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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You can get married anywhere you want, but it still has to follow rules. The rules weren't followed in the backgarden,so it wasn't a wedding in any legal sense. The Archbish isn't a hedge priest, there isn't any legal concept of common-law marriage in the UK, and even the Scottish one was scrapped quite a long time ago.

Meghan* is either delusional (or incorrectly informed) in saying it was the real wedding, or lying.
Common law "marriage" is nothingt to do with being married. The opposite in fact. Who's to say their garden marriage didn't follow rules? How do you know? A gazebo, a permanent one, not a pop up, would suffice.


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I don't think being "nice" comes into it. The press treat Kate Middleton better because she comes across as someone who has accepted her position and the duty and responsibility that comes along with it. Meghan Markle comes across as someone who wanted the position but not the sacrifice that it comes with it.
In other words Kate has become a Royal brood mare and just has to look pretty for photo ops. No notion of a life.

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Probably the case, but it certainly shouldn't be. Im for fair treatment of all people, which is why I get so annoyed at MM's accusation of racism without naming the perpetrator. Andrew should also be held to account, if he's been taking part in sexual abuse he should be prosecuted for it.
Yep.

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I think she was a minor back then? And it was already proved the sleazy characters were running a child sex trafficking ring. I would say let the justice system establish whether PA is guilty or not. Wait, we won't see that because the royals investigate their things privately.

Andrew is in the upper echelon of the establishment. He is male. He likely knows who else did exactly the same as him and can probably prove it. Consequently he is untouchable. Lousy but true.
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Old 17.03.2021, 11:55
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Yep.




Andrew is in the upper echelon of the establishment. He is male. He likely knows who else did exactly the same as him and can probably prove it. Consequently he is untouchable. Lousy but true.
I know.

Btw, Kate seems a very likeable person. I think she knew much better than MM what was she getting into. I think she made a very informed choice. I wouldn't be surprised if she likes her role. Horses for courses and all that...
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Old 17.03.2021, 12:01
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Re: [Prince] Harry and Meghan

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I know.
I know you do.
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