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  #641  
Old 13.03.2018, 17:45
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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I asked why nobody in the West EU is welcoming them. Yes, they threw some money in the Eastern direction. But why isn't anybody in Western EU allowing the Ukrainian people to leave Ukraine, arrive in Germany, and be taken in and accepted as refugees, given food, shelter and a chance to work and integrate into German society?
Do you have any evidence that Ukrainians are not allowed?

According to this article
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Mass EU immigration UNCOVERED: Millions of Ukrainians on their way to Europe
AROUND two million Ukrainians are believed to have moved to the European Union - with the encouragement of the eastern European countries.
Source

Of course it is the Express so the article may not be entirely true
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  #642  
Old 13.03.2018, 18:30
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

I just searched to see which EU countries offer Ukrainians refugee status, and couldn't find any. I only found a report by the UNHCR that criticizes Ukraine for not being accepting enough towards African/Middle East asylum seekers Seriously, WTF, did I just read that right? Ukraine, a country at war, suffering from extreme poverty and political problems, should be more hospitable to African/Middle East refugees?

https://reliefweb.int/report/ukraine...kers-june-2017

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Ukraine is a destination and transit country for persons with international protection needs as well as economic migrants seeking to enter the European Union (EU). The Ukrainian asylum system still requires improvement to meet international standards.

The majority of refugees in Ukraine have no prospects for safe and dignified voluntary repatriation. Resettlement to third countries is used as a protection tool for small a number of the most vulnerable refugees, facing serious risks that cannot be addressed effectively in Ukraine.
*Note: in the above text, when they say "refugees" they are not referring to Ukrainian people, but rather people other than Ukrainians (ie: people from Africa and Middle East)
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  #643  
Old 13.03.2018, 18:45
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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I just searched to see which EU countries offer Ukrainians refugee status, and couldn't find any. I only found a report by the UNHCR that criticizes Ukraine for not being accepting enough towards African/Middle East asylum seekers Seriously, WTF, did I just read that right? Ukraine, a country at war, suffering from extreme poverty and political problems, should be more hospitable to African/Middle East refugees?

https://reliefweb.int/report/ukraine...kers-june-2017

*Note: in the above text, when they say "refugees" they are not referring to Ukrainian people, but rather people other than Ukrainians (ie: people from Africa and Middle East)

Now you know.

It's probably just a bit extended variation of "schadenfreude" towards the EE. Or double standards on the Western front?
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  #644  
Old 14.03.2018, 06:08
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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I just searched to see which EU countries offer Ukrainians refugee status, and couldn't find any. I only found a report by the UNHCR that criticizes Ukraine for not being accepting enough towards African/Middle East asylum seekers Seriously, WTF, did I just read that right? Ukraine, a country at war, suffering from extreme poverty and political problems, should be more hospitable to African/Middle East refugees?
You have to understand, once and for all, the white man complex. People in the WE prefer to help anyone else but (for instance Ukrainians), the further away culturally and geographically, the better. They feel guilty for the poverty in Africa, or South Asia, or who knows where else. They don't give a dam' about Ukrainians or EE in general.
Ukrainians will have to start from 0, like all those classic immigrants. For Ukrainians it will be at least three times more difficult to get a residence permit anywhere in WE than for - you name any country outside Europe. Of course, I am not talking about "expats" and posh people, just about ordinary folks who were not so lucky to be trained in certain fields that are in great demand now. And even so.. but whatever, I decided to stop giving my full opinions on EF.
Europe has adopted a trend about which we don't have any say.

Last edited by greenmount; 14.03.2018 at 06:53.
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  #645  
Old 14.03.2018, 08:24
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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You have to understand, once and for all, the white man complex. People in the WE prefer to help anyone else but (for instance Ukrainians), the further away culturally and geographically, the better. They feel guilty for the poverty in Africa, or South Asia, or who knows where else. They don't give a dam' about Ukrainians or EE in general.
Yea, it's kind of funny how people think. For example, if your unemployed neighbor is always drunk and lazy, you are angry with him and for sure won't give him money. But if you walk down the street and see some poor guy begging for money, suddenly your imagination kicks in and start thinking "well, maybe the guy had a rough life, maybe society didn't give him a chance, etc." and then you feel bad and drop some money in his hat. But in reality, maybe he is just the same lazy drunk guy as your neighbor that you dislike

And it's funny how there are all these NGO "activists" who are out every day off the coast of Italy "rescuing" African refugees, and bringing them into EU saying we need to give them a new life here. But yet there is no NGO driving buses into Ukraine or East Europe offering suffering and distressed people there the same package

So yea, the whole mantra about "we must help migrants fleeing poverty and war"...

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  #646  
Old 14.03.2018, 10:49
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Yea, it's kind of funny how people think. For example, if your unemployed neighbor is always drunk and lazy, you are angry with him and for sure won't give him money. But if you walk down the street and see some poor guy begging for money, suddenly your imagination kicks in and start thinking "well, maybe the guy had a rough life, maybe society didn't give him a chance, etc." and then you feel bad and drop some money in his hat. But in reality, maybe he is just the same lazy drunk guy as your neighbor that you dislike
That made me chuckle. I had this discussion with a friend from back home who's an animal lover and she's sponsoring a couple of NGO's that activate in China etc - taking care of stray dogs etc. Now, don't get me wrong, it's not like this isn't a noble, or nice, or good thing or anything. But how on earth her first charity target was that instead of helping people in need from her native country, I will never understand. Stray dogs in China before children hospitals, now these are some people's priorities. Charity starts from home and all that jazz seem to have totally passed them by.
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  #647  
Old 14.03.2018, 11:59
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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People in the WE prefer to help anyone else but (for instance Ukrainians), the further away culturally and geographically, the better. They feel guilty for the poverty in Africa, or South Asia, or who knows where else. They don't give a dam' about Ukrainians or EE in general.
I have to disagree with you because two of my oldest friends (sisters) are members of the Manchester's large Ukranian community. http://www.augb-manchester.org.uk/ Manchester has one of the most diverse populations and it's been that way for over 100yrs http://www.manchester.gov.uk/directo.../category/1373
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  #648  
Old 14.03.2018, 12:22
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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That made me chuckle. I had this discussion with a friend from back home who's an animal lover and she's sponsoring a couple of NGO's that activate in China etc - taking care of stray dogs etc. Now, don't get me wrong, it's not like this isn't a noble, or nice, or good thing or anything. But how on earth her first charity target was that instead of helping people in need from her native country, I will never understand. Stray dogs in China before children hospitals, now these are some people's priorities. Charity starts from home and all that jazz seem to have totally passed them by.
I know more or less the reverse of this story.

A relative of mine works in the administration for a charity in the UK. I won't say which one. Not one of the very big ones but a smaller but nevertheless fairly well known one.

This charity does work all over the world. And so is always having to take decisons, as to which country or which projects is being prioritized, and if an unexpected large donation comes in, to work out what best to do with it.

Now my relative works in the accounts department, so she sees pretty much what people donate. She also deals with the bigger donations, most of them wills and inheritance. Quite often somebody leaves not just all their money but also their land or house, which she then has to help sell or otherwise find a use for.

But here comes the caveat. Very many people stipulate in their will that the money is to be used only for projects in the UK. They don't actually have enough projects in the UK to sepnd all that money, yet on the other hand many of their African projects and such are chronically under-funded. She says the charity would love to shift some of that money overseas but legally they can't.

So I would say, people do want charity to start at home, but it's the charities themselves that don't share that view.
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  #649  
Old 14.03.2018, 15:11
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

Coming back to Sweden...

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More than seven in ten companies in Sweden are having difficulties finding employees, according to a report by the Confederation of Swedish Enterprise.

The unemployment rate in Sweden is at 6.5 per cent, but a significant proportion of those unemployed have recently arrived in this country and are still learning the language.
http://sverigesradio.se/sida/artikel...rtikel=6906601

Interesting social dynamics. Lots of people, lots of jobs. But yet lots of people out of work, and lots of vacant jobs. They mention Sweden will make it easier to bring qualified workers from abroad.

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Refugees: Welcome to Sweden, You'll Get a Job in a Decade
Only 53 percent of refugees found a job after 10 years
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ob-in-a-decade
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  #650  
Old 14.03.2018, 16:29
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Coming back to Sweden...

http://sverigesradio.se/sida/artikel...rtikel=6906601

Interesting social dynamics. Lots of people, lots of jobs. But yet lots of people out of work, and lots of vacant jobs. They mention Sweden will make it easier to bring qualified workers from abroad.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ob-in-a-decade
"Only 53 percent of refugees found a job after 10 years" That is one of those statistics that needs digging into!

Were half of the refugees women from countries where it is unusual for women to work?

Or were they typical families of four with mother, father and two children?
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  #651  
Old 14.03.2018, 16:49
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Were half of the refugees women from countries where it is unusual for women to work?
Sounds like their culture is incompatible with Sweden's.
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  #652  
Old 14.03.2018, 16:52
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Sounds like their culture is incompatible with Sweden's.
And their home country language, thanks for this startling insight
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  #653  
Old 16.03.2018, 10:58
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

There is now a debate in Sweden about if Mosques should be allowed to have outdoor loudspeakers that play the Muslim call to prayer several times a day. I've never heard of a non-Muslim country doing this But according to the report there are already two in Sweden that are doing it now (one in Stockholm and Karlskrona). That would be really bizarre to me, to be walking down a street in Sweden and hearing a Muslim prayer call being blasted out over the neighborhood, with women in burkas and bearded guys in Muslim dress walking around.
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Old 16.03.2018, 23:03
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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That would be really bizarre to me, to be walking down a street in Sweden and hearing a Muslim prayer call being blasted out over the neighborhood, with women in burkas and bearded guys in Muslim dress walking around.
According to some EF members it's actually completely natural and normal for European neighbourhoods to look and feel like the Middle East.

Silly bigot.
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Old 16.03.2018, 23:44
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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According to some EF members it's actually completely natural and normal for European neighbourhoods to look and feel like the Middle East.

Silly bigot.
No doubt you can provide links to support your EF fantasies ?
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  #656  
Old 16.03.2018, 23:47
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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According to some EF members it's actually completely natural and normal for European neighbourhoods to look and feel like the Middle East.
Serious question now... When you're a foreigner who's moved to Europe and likes to tell us how we should run things, what makes you any different?

Last edited by Blueangel; 17.03.2018 at 01:01.
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  #657  
Old 17.03.2018, 08:06
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Serious question now... When you're a foreigner who's moved to Europe and likes to tell us how we should run things, what makes you any different?
Not such a big difference. Only if he starts opening his windows 5x a day and yelling in the speaker phone something in a language his new country does not speak, police will most likely seal the windows shut and he will be questioned for his health, probably. Just saying'...


This idea of 'Europe' is probably not working so much anymore. Sweden is deciding to do stuff on their own, and they should. Whether it will work out for them, is entirely different issue.

Last edited by MusicChick; 17.03.2018 at 09:41.
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Old 17.03.2018, 08:50
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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According to some EF members it's actually completely natural and normal for European neighbourhoods to look and feel like the Middle East.

Silly bigot.
While others use hyperbole, and deliberately misinterpret posts because it's the only way they can make their own unrealistic nonsense look less idiotic.

EF is funny like that...
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Old 17.03.2018, 10:50
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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There is now a debate in Sweden about if Mosques should be allowed to have outdoor loudspeakers that play the Muslim call to prayer several times a day. I've never heard of a non-Muslim country doing this But according to the report there are already two in Sweden that are doing it now (one in Stockholm and Karlskrona). That would be really bizarre to me, to be walking down a street in Sweden and hearing a Muslim prayer call being blasted out over the neighborhood, with women in burkas and bearded guys in Muslim dress walking around.
Nah, a little diversity, colour and culture-wise, won't kill anyone. It brings creativity, joie de vivre..Now it all depends on how these - let's call them freedoms, will be put in practice and how the rest of the population will react, or feel about. My guess is there will be lots of people suddenly realising they're "Muslims" - common....5 breaks from work per day? All payed? The right to be a bit of a snowflake if they're not respected? Who'd run away from such an offer. This is the greatest risk of these identity politics...falsehood. If the majority says "Boys, don't be unreasonable now - you pretended you run away from the Yazzidis, who burned your schools, killed your mamas and forced religions down your throat, and (we pretended) we believe you...but we only ask you to live like us in exchange for our hospitality" then, the whole idea will be only a cultural right, and maybe only the pensioners and the crippled will come 5 days per day to pray. I'm joking, mainly, but try to imagine some scenarios. Don't take me very seriously.

Would you say that the Spanish Corridas or the Pamplona encierros, the Catholic processions around the world are not a bit of some ahem, colourful, if not "slightly" outdated things, strongly contrasting with the puritanic Scandinavian cultures? And they're still part of Europe, and we like it. I'd say - let Sweden do whatever they want, as long as the whole thing will not be exploited by some far right parties which will decide they have to eliminate entire groups in order to restore orderliness. And even gather fans for that.

Last edited by greenmount; 17.03.2018 at 11:00.
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Old 17.03.2018, 11:29
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Re: What's Happening to Sweden?

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Nah, a little diversity, colour and culture-wise, won't kill anyone. It brings creativity, joie de vivre.
Can you define 'a little diversity'?
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