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  #121  
Old 08.03.2018, 17:42
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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What makes you characterize him as "alt-right"?
I never said he's alt-right, but he is lauded by the alt-right.
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  #122  
Old 08.03.2018, 17:46
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I never said he's alt-right, but he is lauded by the alt-right.
For what reason is he lauded by the alt-right?
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  #123  
Old 08.03.2018, 17:49
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

BTW, "we're all fascists now"...

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Christina Hoff Sommers is a self-identified feminist and registered Democrat with a Ph.D. in philosophy and a wicked sense of humor. She is also a woman who says bad things. Things like: Men and women are equal, but there are differences between them. Or: The gender gap in STEM fields isn’t simply the result of sexism. Or: Contrary to received wisdom, the American school system actually favors girls, not boys.

When such a person steps foot on a college campus these days, you know what’s coming. So it was on Monday at Lewis & Clark Law School in Portland, Ore., where Ms. Sommers had been invited by the Federalist Society to give a talk about feminism.

In advance of the lecture, nine student groups, among them the Portland National Lawyers Guild, the Minority Law Student Association, the Women’s Law Caucus, the Jewish Law Society and the school’s Young Democratic Socialists of America chapter sent a letter protesting the appearance by this “known fascist.”

The letter added that her invitation amounted to an “act of aggression and violence” and went on to offer a curious definition of free speech: “Freedom of speech is certainly an important tenet to a free, healthy society, but that freedom stops when it has a negative and violent impact on other individuals.”

Yes, these future lawyers believe that free speech is acceptable only when it doesn’t offend them. Which is to say, they don’t believe in it at all.
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  #124  
Old 08.03.2018, 17:57
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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BTW, "we're all fascists now"...
Oh come on, it's not as if either side is immune to petty name calling is it?

You get the right end of the spectrum itching to bleat out whatever is the liberal left luvvie label du jour at every available opportunity just the same as the left chucking labels out about the right.

Like it makes a difference.
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  #125  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:03
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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Oh come on, it's not as if either side is immune to petty name calling is it?

You get the right end of the spectrum itching to bleat out whatever is the liberal left luvvie label du jour at every available opportunity just the same as the left chucking labels out about the right.

Like it makes a difference.
I don't know, I keep hearing "racist", "fascist", "xenophobic" constantly being overused today by the alt-Left "snowflake" generation.

...but here's the rest of the (Left-leaning) NYT article:

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The main effect is that these endless accusations of “fascism” or “misogyny” or “alt-right” dull the effects of the words themselves. As they are stripped of meaning, they strip us of our sharpness — of our ability to react forcefully to real fascists and misogynists or members of the alt-right.

Will true liberals do what it takes to reverse it? We can only hope so, because the battle against genuine authoritarian threats needs to be waged consistently, credibly and persuasively. For that to happen, words need to mean something. Calling women like Christina Hoff Sommers and Mary Beard fascists and racists only helps the other side.
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  #126  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:03
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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Even if he was, it makes sense to know your "enemy"...you don't have to agree with the author to read a book.
No offence meant greenmount, but I don't see some philosopher in Canada as my 'enemy'. Moreso, I don't have the time, energy or inclination to fill my head with such guff. I'm just taking a break between German and French, then a longer break between French and Italian (because I'm inclined to overlap the two if I don't 'detox' with some English inbetween ). Plus, I'm still only halfway through an interview with Amber Rudd r.e. alleged Russian poisoning of a former spy and the implications of that. Anyway...I digress...
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  #127  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:06
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I don't know, I keep hearing "racist", "fascist", "xenophobic" constantly being overused today by the alt-Left "snowflake" generation.

...but here's the rest of the (Left-leaning) NYT article:
Yeah, but maybe the left leaning people only hear the Alt-right language, same as you are picking up on the Left's shouty-ness. Horses for courses, and all that.

Politics seems to be all about what people want to hear.

QED.
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  #128  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:09
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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  #129  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:11
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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Politics seems to be all about what people want to hear.

QED.
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Boom...
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  #130  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:12
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I don't know, I keep hearing "racist", "fascist", "xenophobic" constantly being overused today by the alt-Left "snowflake" generation.
Well, you're not hearing those terms in this thread; just ignore them for now if it makes you feel uncomfortable. *Hands virtual cup of tea*

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...but here's the rest of the (Left-leaning) NYT article:
Grab 'em by the pussy. Make America Great Again. Shitholes. I could shoot somebody and not lose voters. If we keep promoting the noise, it's harder to read the signal, which is exactly the intention.
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  #131  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:12
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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For what reason is he lauded by the alt-right?
How the hell should I know, and why TF should I even care?
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I don't know, I keep hearing "racist", "fascist", "xenophobic" constantly being overused today by the alt-Left "snowflake" generation.
A generation which I don't belong too and (thankfully) haven't encountered i.r.l. I'm far too old, grey, grumpy and aggro to tolerate all that whining, hence why I'm not on twatter. If you're not in the same room as me, you're just words on a page that has an 'off' button, so why get your knickers in a twist over it.
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  #132  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:24
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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How the hell should I know, and why TF should I even care?
I don't know, you brought it up (" He's just a Chomsky for the alt-right. Nothing more, nothing less")...but you can't explain. Why? You saw his name in some news articles lumped together with the words "alt-right", and now you freely make that association, even tho you never heard him speak or read his stuff. ...oder?
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  #133  
Old 08.03.2018, 18:36
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I don't know, you brought it up (" He's just a Chomsky for the alt-right. Nothing more, nothing less")...but you can't explain. Why? You saw his name in some news articles lumped together with the words "alt-right", and now you freely make that association, even tho you never heard him speak or read his stuff. ...oder?
I think it's more to do with overlapping ideals (no idea who the guy is, his YouTube comes across as mind-numbing - anyway). Earlier, Loz (now deleted) posted in the thread about muslims a news story where a muslim woman had been jailed for not covering herself, head or whatever.

Classic dog-whistle article for right leaning people to pick up on to say "THAT is why we shouldn't let muslims gain any ground in OUR country!!" Right?

At the same time, I saw the same story pop up in a Humanism feed that I occasionally follow. Humanism - that leftie, liberal, wishy washy load of sinners.

Their ideals completely synced up over a common issue. Slightly different emphasis but, nonetheless, common ground.

Maybe this Peterson bloke's issues bend back and forth and round to each end of politics. He reckons he's liberal but aspects of his beliefs draw in Alt-right stuff.
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  #134  
Old 08.03.2018, 19:09
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I think it's more to do with overlapping ideals (no idea who the guy is, his YouTube comes across as mind-numbing - anyway). Earlier, Loz (now deleted) posted in the thread about muslims a news story where a muslim woman had been jailed for not covering herself, head or whatever.

Classic dog-whistle article for right leaning people to pick up on to say "THAT is why we shouldn't let muslims gain any ground in OUR country!!" Right?

At the same time, I saw the same story pop up in a Humanism feed that I occasionally follow. Humanism - that leftie, liberal, wishy washy load of sinners.

Their ideals completely synced up over a common issue. Slightly different emphasis but, nonetheless, common ground.

Maybe this Peterson bloke's issues bend back and forth and round to each end of politics. He reckons he's liberal but aspects of his beliefs draw in Alt-right stuff.
Isn't this a good thing?

Rather than the left and right each barricading themselves into their own liitle bunker of indignation and refusing to even agree about obvious things, we need ideas that people from across the divide can get behind, even if not maybe for 100% the same reason.

Isn't this essentially what the 5 Star movement is about? Getting leftists and rightists to agree over a number of topics and making a political platform out of that?
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  #135  
Old 08.03.2018, 19:10
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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Does it surprise you that the voters and supporters of these politicians are getting tired of seeing that bias, and are thus being progressively lost to the mainstream media?
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  #136  
Old 08.03.2018, 20:50
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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Isn't this a good thing?

Rather than the left and right each barricading themselves into their own liitle bunker of indignation and refusing to even agree about obvious things, we need ideas that people from across the divide can get behind, even if not maybe for 100% the same reason.

Isn't this essentially what the 5 Star movement is about? Getting leftists and rightists to agree over a number of topics and making a political platform out of that?
I didn't say it was a bad thing, did I?

I was just providing a sort of explanation for the blurring of lines between the two political spectrums. Sometimes it's two sides of the same coin it's just the sentiment which is different.
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  #137  
Old 08.03.2018, 20:55
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I didn't say it was a bad thing, did I?

I was just providing a sort of explanation for the blurring of lines between the two political spectrums. Sometimes it's two sides of the same coin it's just the sentiment which is different.
Sometimes sentiment can just boil down to the words you use to describe a problem. Language has become so politicized that it can be difficult to even realize that you're talking about the same thing.

Time to publish a leftist / rightist phrasebook anybody?
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  #138  
Old 08.03.2018, 21:18
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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I don't know, you brought it up (" He's just a Chomsky for the alt-right. Nothing more, nothing less")...
I think you'll find that you brought him up in #112 and #115. My only comment was to query his claim that he's a 'classic British Liberal'.

Similarly to Sandgrounder, I'd never, ever heard of the man until this post from Phos... https://www.englishforum.ch/internat...ml#post2905592

You see esto, there's a group of mouthpieces, commentators that get mentioned by certain people on EF who align themselves with the right of politics, that I have absolutely no knowledge of. The only one I do recognise is Cathy Newman because, though she is despised by right wingers, she's absolutely hated by Momentum and the far left in her native UK, to the point of her employer having to assign personal security to her twice...once after her interview with Jeremy Corbyn, and again after her interview with Jordan Peterson (which I've only just seen when Googling the date of the death threats she received after the Corbyn interview. Crikey! She's Miss Popular!!! ).

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...but you can't explain. Why? You saw his name in some news articles lumped together with the words "alt-right", and now you freely make that association, even tho you never heard him speak or read his stuff. ...oder?
I can honestly say, hand on heart, I've never read anything of the man, never watched him in videos or on tv, and it would most likely have stayed that way if it hadn't been for people like you, Phos, et al bringing his name into threads. I won't be reading any of his books unless he writes a brilliant crime thriller, and the only book on my bedside table at the moment is Trevor Noah's biography.

Capiche?
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  #139  
Old 08.03.2018, 21:20
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

Just asked my OH who Jordan Peterson is... "Is he a South African politician or an American athlete?"
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  #140  
Old 08.03.2018, 21:41
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Re: Election Results: Italians Say FU to the EU, Globalists

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BTW, "we're all fascists now"...
Here's the link to the mentioned NYT article.

It was a good read. I'm surprised you took the "all fascists now" comment and weaponised it to bash the values held by the author. I don't believe you were cherry picking, "so what you're saying" () was we should be on our guard against radical reactions of all hues, Left or Right? You'll find agreement there.

"Freud called this the narcissism of small differences." xaxaxa!
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