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  #21  
Old 09.03.2018, 11:50
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

It is just another "targeted assassination" or "non-judicial killing". The papers are full of these. OK, the method was apparently unusual (the leaks from the investigation to the BBC, at least up until now, have not gone so far as to name the exact poison) but it leads to the same result as using a drone or one of the other more popular methods.
Interestingly, as I saw pointed out somewhere (not in the UK main stream media), the location of the incident is only a few kilometers from the UK's own bio weapons research labs.
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  #22  
Old 09.03.2018, 11:53
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Pretty basic deterrence measure, IMO. Bigger question is why the Brits failed to protect him. This will surely make it harder for them to recruit future defectors.
Perhaps they (the Brits) werent expecting him and his family to be assasinated, theoretically it could just be a statement from Moscow warning off future defectors. Its politically well timed, what with all the meddling etc, if anyone "involved" in that feels like whistle blowing, it would definitely put them off. It also shows that Moscow doesn't fear western criticism of the way it deals with its enemies.
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  #23  
Old 09.03.2018, 12:45
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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He's a former spy who was jailed in Russia and then handed over to the UK in a prisoner swap deal. In terms of intelligence information he's a busted flush, of no further threat to Russia, so so I don't see what they have to gain by assassinating him. On the other hand Russia's enemies may have a lot to gain with a false flag operation on British soil.

For the record I am neither pro or anti Russia, i'd just rather operate on the truth.
You ignore the method, means & motive for a conspiracy theory.

As long as the likely culprit is anti west (Hamas, Iran, Syria, Russia) you give them the benefit of the doubt.
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  #24  
Old 09.03.2018, 12:46
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Perhaps they (the Brits) werent expecting him and his family to be assasinated
Not knowing that an assassination was planned is an intelligence failure.

But not expecting it at all after the numerous killings already?
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Old 09.03.2018, 12:50
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Why are Russian opponents of the regime always killed in such spectacular ways?
Was the Litwinenko case ever truly solved?
Somebody is trying to leave a "signature".

As Castro said, Russian enemies would make sure the case would be unique enough to point fingers on Russia easily.

Innocent until proven guilty. Once again the press is messing about. On both sides.
Decent press coverage would be: This has happened, these are the victims, this weapon has been used, no suspects yet.
It sends a strong signal. If you cross us, you will die horribly, and don't think the British government will be able to protect you. I doubt the number of Russians willing to pass secrets to the UK for £100k will have increased in the last few days.
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  #26  
Old 09.03.2018, 12:51
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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It is just another "targeted assassination" or "non-judicial killing". The papers are full of these. OK, the method was apparently unusual (the leaks from the investigation to the BBC, at least up until now, have not gone so far as to name the exact poison) but it leads to the same result as using a drone or one of the other more popular methods.
Interestingly, as I saw pointed out somewhere (not in the UK main stream media), the location of the incident is only a few kilometers from the UK's own bio weapons research labs.
Those who live by the sword . . .
If a more traditional method had been used, or if it had been made to look like a suicide or accident, it might have been more difficult to attack the father and daughter together, others in the vicinity wouldn't have been affected, there wouldn't have been a deployment of troops and likely wouldn't have been the proximity to Porton Down and associated suggestion of a home-grown attack. This method hasn't just disabled the two targets but disrupted the host country.
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  #27  
Old 09.03.2018, 13:00
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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The UK said by now that the poison used was a nerve agent. "Not Sarin or VX, but something much rarer". I'd say only intelligence services have access to that sort of chemical weapons... not necessarily the Russians, but I dont see anyone else benefiting from the case. It's not like the UK needed any reasons to not trust the Russian government...
The BBC were reporting this morning that "only a handful of labs around the world could have made this substance"... yeah one of which is about 3 miles down the road from where the incident happened.
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  #28  
Old 09.03.2018, 17:19
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

As somebody who's country has been occupied by 'friendly' Russian troops killing locals for 21 years due to fact that we were moving very slightly towards democracy (Czechoslovakia) - never expect anything good from Russian. Common citizens might be +-OK (apart from rampart alcoholism and f**ed up attitude to life in general), but politicians are a joke of a human being, worst of the worst scum.

Putin is at least very consistent - he only cares about 'Russia's interest' - meaning staying in power and keeping friendly oligarchs untouchable and richer. Don't mind him personally stashing billions of USD in (not only) Zurich's banks via his close friends of course. Things like human decency, democracy, freedom or respect for another human being or life are a joke there. You know, things that make the country we live in the greatest out there in my humble eyes. They don't mind seeing the world burn, not at all.

His attitude to this kind of spies is pretty well known (they should die very slowly in a public way). And what sends the message more loud and clear than using a nerve agent, killing also his family (the fact that all other family members died in recent years is probably not an accident). North Korea sent the same message few months ago, for exactly same reasons - big FU to everybody while doing internal cleaning publicly.

I am no friend of US and their usually pretty abhorable foreign politics, but in this game, compared to Russians, they are holy knights in shining armor. No sympathy for the devil.
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  #29  
Old 09.03.2018, 17:59
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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I am no friend of US and their usually pretty abhorable foreign politics, but in this game, compared to Russians, they are holy knights in shining armor.
Um, which game? Intelligence services? I don't think the CIA is wearing a shining armour, they aren't even knights by the furthest stretch of "chivalry"... they have a track record of torturing suspects to death. This guy died of hypothermia... slowly freezing to death over a two week period in a cell: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-interrogation
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  #30  
Old 09.03.2018, 19:49
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Castro, are you a commie?
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Test says 'No'

Says I'm a socialist
Ah, "Commie Lite" , all the rich Marxist flavour, but without the bloody aftertaste
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  #31  
Old 09.03.2018, 20:05
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

Double agents for any country are pretty low. He went into service for his country, and then flat -out betrayed it. I'm surprised he wasn't killed immediately. I'm no fan of Putin or Russia, but this guy got what he had coming. Altho they should have left his daughter out of it.
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  #32  
Old 09.03.2018, 20:07
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Not knowing that an assassination was planned is an intelligence failure.

But not expecting it at all after the numerous killings already?
To be fair to the UK intelligence services, he had already done time in Russia before being exchanged, they (secret services), probably did not care if he was assassinated or weren't expecting it to be carried out in such a public way. Perhaps Russia kept him alive as a bargaining chip for that initial exchange, with the intention of later assassination. We can speculate all we like, but we'll never find out. I just feel sorry for his family and the other innocent bystanders who were exposed to a deadly nerve agent.
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  #33  
Old 09.03.2018, 20:11
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Double agents for any country are pretty low. He went into service for his country, and then flat -out betrayed it. I'm surprised he wasn't killed immediately. I'm no fan of Putin or Russia, but this guy got what he had coming. Altho they should have left his daughter out of it.
Maybe he betrayed something he saw as being intrinsically wrong about his own country, the corruption, the dictator. Maybe he was very patriotic and did not like what is happening in Russia. We'll never find out what information he shared, but saying he deserved it is a bit low.
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  #34  
Old 09.03.2018, 20:26
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Double agents for any country are pretty low. He went into service for his country, and then flat -out betrayed it. I'm surprised he wasn't killed immediately. I'm no fan of Putin or Russia, but this guy got what he had coming. Altho they should have left his daughter out of it.
Yup, say want you want about Russia but they don't mess about where these things are concerned. At the same time there are thousands of ISIS fighters returning to Europe to be welcomed with reintegration programs and trauma counselling.
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  #35  
Old 09.03.2018, 20:54
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Double agents for any country are pretty low. He went into service for his country, and then flat -out betrayed it. I'm surprised he wasn't killed immediately. I'm no fan of Putin or Russia, but this guy got what he had coming. Altho they should have left his daughter out of it.
Playing devil's advocate, why leave the daughter out of it? It's most likely a more effective warning to others to target her and perhaps other family members too.
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  #36  
Old 09.03.2018, 21:13
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Yup, say want you want about Russia but they don't mess about where these things are concerned. At the same time there are thousands of ISIS fighters returning to Europe to be welcomed with reintegration programs and trauma counselling.
Leave it mate, we all know you must have withdrawal symptoms re your favorite subject by now but this thread doesn't need turning in your favorite direction. I personally think it should really be about what the title says, as it is an important subject on it's own.

Start a new thread or go back to those which were already contaminated.
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  #37  
Old 09.03.2018, 22:46
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Maybe he betrayed something he saw as being intrinsically wrong about his own country, the corruption, the dictator. Maybe he was very patriotic and did not like what is happening in Russia. We'll never find out what information he shared, but saying he deserved it is a bit low.
What he did, selling out his fellow servicemen to another country, is treason, plain and simple. And historically, in many countries, including the UK, the punishment for treason is death.

Saying his daughter deserved to die would be low.

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The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.
Article III, Section 3, Clause 2
https://www.heritage.org/constitutio...ent-of-treason

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Committing treason is one of the most extreme things you can be punished for in Britain.
While rare, acts of treason and high treason are still punishable - although the death penalty is no longer the ultimate sentence after it was scrapped in 1998 under the Crime And Disorder Act.
Nevertheless, guilty parties can expect a maximum term of life behind bars for acts of disloyalty to the Queen.
Britain’s Treason Act was written out in 1351 - and is still in force today, albeit with several amendments over the years.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/10-crimes-...145300595.html
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  #38  
Old 09.03.2018, 22:46
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Leave it mate, we all know you must have withdrawal symptoms re your favorite subject by now but this thread doesn't need turning in your favorite direction. I personally think it should really be about what the title says, as it is an important subject on it's own.

Start a new thread or go back to those which were already contaminated.
Look who can’t spot the difference between how Europe treats their traitors and how Russia treats theirs. Europe is toothless, soft and impotent, Russia isn’t. This is why the Crimea is now in Russian hands. It’s also the reason why Russia can get away with doing pretty much as they please.
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  #39  
Old 10.03.2018, 08:24
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Look who can’t spot the difference between how Europe treats their traitors and how Russia treats theirs. Europe is toothless, soft and impotent, Russia isn’t. This is why the Crimea is now in Russian hands. It’s also the reason why Russia can get away with doing pretty much as they please.
So you want to live in a totalitarian state Loz? You could always move to Moscow!

on another note, the Kremlin mouthpiece issues a threat to all would be traitors: https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e_iOSApp_Other
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Old 10.03.2018, 08:30
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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So you want to live in a totalitarian state Loz? You could always move to Moscow!
Because that’s exactly what I said.
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