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  #61  
Old 13.03.2018, 09:57
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Sooo... Is it "highly possible" or "clearly"? Or, if the truth is in the middle, isn't it "circus" indeed?
Absolutely.

If the truth is 'somewhere in the middle', and against backdrop of Putin currently standing for re-election, what are the scenarios?

1. Novichok was stolen from a military facility and Putin was not made aware of this, which is a serious cause for concenr and makes Russian security look weak.

2. Novichok was stolen from a military facility and Putin was aware but chose not to report it because it made him look weak.

3. Novichok was used without Putin's knowledge of the operation, which makes him look weak.

We know the British government have been weak, lax and ineffective in how they've dealt with this event so far, but I don't see Putin volunteering a response that would also make him look weak. It's much easier for him to corral off the loose sheep, isolate it from the rest of the flock, and make it look ridiculous.
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  #62  
Old 13.03.2018, 10:32
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

I just wonder why looking like clowns, time after time, doesn't make UK government look weak?
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  #63  
Old 13.03.2018, 10:35
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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I just wonder why looking like clowns, time after time, doesn't make UK government look weak?
They don't 'look' weak. They are weak.
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  #64  
Old 13.03.2018, 11:08
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

I've just looked up Novichok in Wikipeadia. The edit history in the last few days shows feverish update activity e.g. :

. . .
. . .
(cur | prev) 23:10, 12 March 2018‎ 146.90.245.115 (talk)‎ . . (17,735 bytes) (-3)‎ . . (Changed to MI6 as most likely culprit in Skripal case) (undo)
(cur | prev) 23:06, 12 March 2018‎ 86.128.104.123 (talk)‎ . . (17,738 bytes) (0)‎ . . (→‎Use as a weapon by russia for assassination: russia -> Russia) (undo)
. . .
. . .

Clear is that such an online resource cannot be scholarly and apolitical.

Most odd is that if, as claimed in the leaks to the BBC, the poison used was known early in the investigation, why the information was not made immediately available. Anyway, it certainly casts doubt on Putin's claim to have disposed of Russia's stockpile of nerve gasses. Alternatively, this black farce was intended to do exactly that.
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  #65  
Old 13.03.2018, 11:55
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

How about yet another crazy theory?
Russia was not the only xUSSR republic with chemical weapons storage.
After USSR split, nuclear weapons were put under control of Russia only, but I am not sure the same was done for chemical weapons.
Wouldn't surprise me if the xUSSR republics Secret Services were not the authors but only performers. The level of performance really doesn't match the KGB/FSB, but very well matches the Secret Services of the "young democracies". I can name at least 4 of them who would be interested to put more blames on Russia. Especially if well paid for that.
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  #66  
Old 13.03.2018, 12:06
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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I can name at least 4 of them who would be interested to put more blames on Russia. Especially if well paid for that.
But by whom? Putin has the most to lose in this 'dark game', but who has the most to win? Or you can take the view that this is Putin asserting his authority, then standing back and refusing to take the blame. It's a tangled web alright.
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  #67  
Old 13.03.2018, 12:37
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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But by whom? Putin has the most to lose in this 'dark game', but who has the most to win?
Probably the ones who make most of noise now ))
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  #68  
Old 13.03.2018, 12:53
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Probably the ones who make most of noise now ))

then Putin would be pulling out all the stops to prove he wasn't involved, don't you think? not helped by the polonium 210 poisoning in 2006, neither substance is something you can just pick up in boots.
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  #69  
Old 13.03.2018, 13:36
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Probably the ones who make most of noise now ))
If I were trying to stitch up Putin, I'd be quietly sitting back and watching it unravel now.
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Old 13.03.2018, 13:48
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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If I were trying to stitch up Putin, I'd be quietly sitting back and watching it unravel now.
why, nothing happened back in 2006 and the evidence linking him was much stronger, the formula for these nerve agents is in the public domain so much easier for him to distance himself from.
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  #71  
Old 13.03.2018, 14:00
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

PM May's handling of this affair, driven in part by bombastic sounding Etonian voices, has been lamentable. She is out of her depth.
At some point, but hopefully not immediately so that this comedy spectacle will not be killed off too prematurely, she will be forced to hand the whole thing over to a formal public enquiry. She can then shut her trap, but still the maintain the mandatory anti-Russian narrative by controlled "leaks" out of the enquiry as and when required.
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  #72  
Old 13.03.2018, 14:01
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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then Putin would be pulling out all the stops to prove he wasn't involved, don't you think?
Nah, no need.
Anyone with elementary analytic skills can figure out who benefits the most, who are the clowns and who owns the circus.
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  #73  
Old 13.03.2018, 14:07
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Nah, no need.
Anyone with elementary analytic skills can figure out who benefits the most, who are the clowns and who owns the circus.
Enlighten us please.
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  #74  
Old 13.03.2018, 14:25
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Enlighten us please.
Sorry to say this, but I hate to act like CNN or BBC.
I strongly believe that everyone should make up his own opinion, basing on facts, "highly probable" and "less probable" scenarios, arranging them in a proper order of probability.
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  #75  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:00
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

Spoil sport!
I don't pretend to know all the players in this scenario, or all the possible suspects. The choice of a victim in Salisbury puzzles me. If you're going to be damned for something, why do it in such a low key location?
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  #76  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:03
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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Spoil sport!
I don't pretend to know all the players in this scenario, or all the possible suspects. The choice of a victim in Salisbury puzzles me. If you're going to be damned for something, why do it in such a low key location?
its not the location that matters, its the method. if you want someone dead there are far quicker, easier, more reliable methods with very little risk of getting caught, this, along with 2006 is a huge message. Screw with us and we'll kill your whole family, and then you, slowly and painfully, and the rest of the world will look on and do nothing.
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  #77  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:09
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

...and screw the consequences.
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  #78  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:17
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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...and screw the consequences.
haven't been any previously
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  #79  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:18
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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The choice of a victim in Salisbury puzzles me. If you're going to be damned for something, why do it in such a low key location?
Perhaps to show that no-where is safe, even for the locals.
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  #80  
Old 13.03.2018, 15:22
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Re: Poisoning of two Russians and a police officer in Salisbury, UK

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...and the rest of the world will look on and do nothing.
It's arguably for internal consumption within the Russian Kleptocracy, to show the folks that he, Putin, hasn't lost his mojo, will face down the west, will show how weak they are, and should be supported.

It's straight out of the "The Dictator's Survival Guide".
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