Sounds very similar to the Alexander Litvinenko poisoning

Difficult to board an international flight without a valid passport, that advice is probably on the second page

Also difficult to hire a vehicle without a valid driving licence.

Anyway why would terrorists want to hide their identities; mostly they want to be recognised as glorious martyrs.

I smell a government stitch-up, the only reason for this type of undiplomatic language so early on is because the game is already in play.

Watching Corbyn get heckled in Parliament yesterday for urging caution, restraint and the rule of law reminds me of the Iraq War in 2003, when any MP brave enough to stand up to the government was branded a traitor and an appeaser. Tory MPs have been briefed to attack him in all interviews and media appearances since yesterday.

I never realised we had so many conspiracy theorists on here. All the evidence points to Russia out to murder one of their own. That there was collateral and that the daughter was also affected isn't nice, but we know the Russians aren't nice. Other than that, who cares?

no spy agency in any country is nice you betray your country and its pretty naive to think you'll be left alone after paying your debt, hope he invested his 100k wisely, was it really worth it

Perhaps, but I don't imagine other spy agencies using such public and painful methods to eliminate targets. Quick, clean and with minimal fuss. You don't see Mossad using nerve agents.

just because others haven't been caught doesn't mean it doesn't happen

All the evidence?! Really?
Even Mrs. May admits there is no evidence, just a "high probability", because someone told her about "Novichok". Even the existence of Novichok itself can be questioned. Even the fact that there was a poisoning at all - who saw Skripals after it? Who spoke with med personnel?
But who cares if Russians aren't nice anyway

all 9/11 flights where internal, no passports or anything else needed (at the time)

Are you by chance working for RT? Because you argue with the same old Soviet propaganda tactics... when in doubt simply question everything and muddy the water so much that people lose the thread.

Simply put:
- the dude isn't dead, he is in hospital. So it's pretty easy for the UK to check him medically. Plenty of witnesses on the TV who have seen him. No point denying the fact that the guy was poisoned. Only question is "who did it?".
- "The existence of Novichok"? You mean as a concept or on site in salisbury? The soviet weapons program is by now pretty well known, the formula of a hundred Novichok agents are in the public domain. Since then can you expect that the western powers have developed tests to identify them in case of a use.
- It's the first time a chemical weapon was used within Nato territory for the entire cold war. That's a pretty big red line to cross. While I would not trust any country on everything... I very much doubt the UK would make up a claim if they weren't pretty certain its Novichok.

I bet pretty much everyone expected that use to be in Syria or Afghanistan, not in the UK though. I see what's in it for the FSB, but I don't think Putin would be personally stupid enough to stir the shit like this unless there are some extremely good reasons for it... so, either:
- the kremlin was the one behind it and have a good motive, for example know that the west is currently trying to turn some agents... so they make a point.

- the kremlin is not behind it but some other Russian (potentially ex-)spies who don't really liked the guy for what he was. I am sure he made some enemies as a double agent...

- well, the obvious: the guy, a known double agent with good connections in the espionage world, "retires" in the UK. Of all places does he pick the one town which is famous for the UKs own ABC program... maybe he wasn't quite as retired as the media says.

Let's be having it right...His own back benchers were heckling him for that display yesterday. The problem with Corbyn is 30% what he says and 70% what he doesn't say, and he's neatly done an about turn this afternoon.

As has been said elsewhere in this thread, 'identical' chemical compounds can have a 'signature' which gives away the location or method of their creation. That will have been one of the very first things looked for during the identification of the substance. But Poundland Gandalf had to go flapping his gob off in Parliament claiming that nobody was co-operating with Russian agencies in this identification, whilst also offering zero support for the British agencies tasked with resolving the matter. Has he never seen 'Spooks' or any recent Bond film? And whilst I'm on about fiction, who the hell has dressed Tessie May like a reject from Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome today, resplendent with a limited edition rose gold version of her usual Marley's Chain???

Ah, apparently that's "old Soviets" who invented the main principle of any professional investigation - "question everything". Especially question what looks most obvious. Or named obvious


Not everyone trusts UK. Has anyone else seen him?

I heard about just one who gave only one interview.

Why not?

Ah, still a question. You just said it's not anymore.

Both. The recipe costs $30 - as much as a paperback where it's published, according to it's "inventor". Either it's not a military grade gaz, or the whole Novichok story is a fake.

We've seen such claims before, quite recently, so why not doubt now?

What? How exactly does FSB benefit from poisoning a spy long after a swap deal?

Nah, that wouldn't trigger so much noise.
It's obvious to me that UK government was ready to start the noise before the case happened. If it happened at all - there is still no direct proof even that Skripals are in the hospital.

What's obvious about it? He landed where his former MI6 boss lives, maybe they were friends...

People are merely heeding your advice Loz, and have stopped taking MSM for anything other than fake news.

Wait minute, are you now saying they're not fake?

Umm no!

The main principle of any professional investigation is to collect evidence.

think people have been watching way too many hollywood movies

you credit the security services / governments / politicians with way too much intelligence, pre-planning some huge elaborate scheme to get someone else the blame.

To get hold of this poison (and the polonium 210 before that) would just be way too much effort, not to mention the risks of getting caught and the fact someone somewhere would notice a break in / stuff missing.

my money is on them being on the same plane as the daughter, followed her to the pub and took their chance, simple. then next plane out while the police and nhs are all saying drugs o/d.

Although saying that, my old company had a contract in russia, the guys sent over there told stories of visiting the local market one weekend, when the army turned up, they preceded to unload a load of trucks and sell off everything, clothes, equipment, you name it, they all came back with russian army jackets but resisted the urge on the night vision equipment, apparently the army hadn't been paid for a while and did this kind of thing quite a bit, so you never know.

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Quote:
UK defence secretary tells Russia 'go away and shut up'

Who's that teenie?! Britain's defence secretary? ROFL.
And what is he saying? "What Russia did ..." did? It's proven now? ..... "Russia should go away and shut up" ..... "it would be wrong to prejudge their response" .... which one now? Respond or shut up?

WTF?

If that's the old Soviet propaganda tactics - it speaks for the Russians.

<<muddy the water so much that people lose the thread>>
get so much information in that people lose their prejudices? Yeah, that's absolutely horrible. I mean how the hell will we get all these detailsin a twitter-post, right?!

I can't believe the stuff I'm reading here today.

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In order to determine the signature you need to get hold of a sample for each factory. AFAIA this hasn't happened.

Those days are over... at least in Moscow. By now has the Russian army there a chain of fashion stores called "Army of Russia" (I am not making this up!) selling anything from combat boots and allegedly the same equipment they use (looked on the cheap side to me...) as well as "fan" t-shirts and fashion items with pictures of their weapons systems, Putin and what not else. Last time I was there about 2 years ago did they just get a new collection on their campaign in Syria...

this was quite a few years ago