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  #41  
Old 02.10.2018, 11:04
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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It's so difficult to avoid plastic. It's everywhere you look.
It's a massive issue. Some UK supermarkets are encouraging shoppers to bring their own reusable containers for fresh produce.

It was reported the other week that there are 39 different rules in the UK about recycling plastics. No I don't know what they are. I'm just getting to grips with a 4 bin system.

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  #42  
Old 02.10.2018, 11:23
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Funny how when it's David Attenborough suggesting it, everybody thinks it's fine.
Well, you know, now that you mention it ..... this hunting twice a year to keep the game population in check - apparently a very, very important thing to do here - all we need is a "higher" species ......


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Link please, DB.
ROFL, you're a funny person, you're sitting in front of your screen now, impatiently tapping your nails on the table, waiting for DB to send you links?
You got the name, you got the subject, there are things like search-engines. You type the info in, you end up here.
Want me to chose which article/video to read/watch as well?

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It's a massive issue. Some UK supermarkets are encouraging shoppers to bring their own reusable containers for fresh produce.
......
You can shop like this in Switzerland too.
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  #43  
Old 02.10.2018, 11:41
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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It's a massive issue. Some UK supermarkets are encouraging shoppers to bring their own reusable containers for fresh produce.

.
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You can shop like this in Switzerland too.
Indeed. Migros (and coop) have had the re-usable veg bags for some time now.

http://organic-market.info/news-in-b...ggie-bags.html

Reducing the numbers of plastic bags, packaging, plastic drinking straws etc. that we use and recycling as much as possible is a good start but there is still a long way to go.
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  #44  
Old 02.10.2018, 11:51
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Indeed. Migros (and coop) have had the re-usable veg bags for some time now.

http://organic-market.info/news-in-b...ggie-bags.html

......
I didn't even know that. I thought of the little shops that popped up the past years.

<<A set of four bags costs 9.90 Swiss Francs.>> I'm not impressed Migros is making this kind of money on them though.
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  #45  
Old 02.10.2018, 17:32
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Well, I was suggesting that if EVERYONE had a bit of that "self interest" in their own environment the world would be in a better state.
We do. Unfortunately.

Those trillions of plastic pieces polluting the oceans are just a symptom (albeit a big one). The real issue is unbridled consumption of finite natural resources of all kinds. Unless consumption is scaled back in a major way, whatever you do is at best a drop on the proverbial hot stone.

About the only way to reduce that problem, rather than just a symptom or two, would be the artificial increasing of the prices of natural resources. The taxing of fossil fuels in Europe, for example, is the (main) reason why Europe is easily twice as energy efficient as North America. Sooner or later prices will increase for all natural resources, simply because they're finite and demand keeps growing.

That however would mean a substantial reduction of our standards of living across the board, a route nobody's willing to go. Even the Greens want their transcontinental holidays at least twice a year, Argentinean fillet (if they can't afford Kobe beef), and all the other stuff that requires transport across half the globe.
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  #46  
Old 02.10.2018, 17:34
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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<<A set of four bags costs 9.90 Swiss Francs.>> I'm not impressed Migros is making this kind of money on them though.
They’re only 6.50 for four in our Migros and you only need to buy them once.
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  #47  
Old 02.10.2018, 19:31
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I am genuinely happy for people worried about plastic, global warming and all that crap. It means they are so high on Maslow's pyramide that Maslow himself didn't even envision such a level. I guess next level of concern is the levels of hydrogen on Jupiter
Guilty as charged.
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  #48  
Old 12.10.2018, 07:11
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I don't wear synthetic clothes.
Yes. These clothes have crazy amounts of static electricity. Very bad.
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  #49  
Old 12.10.2018, 08:29
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

watch a BBC program, LOL
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  #50  
Old 12.10.2018, 09:47
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

I don't give a damn if people think this is "white guilt" or that climate change doesn't exist - sure, the icecaps melting was just in our imagination.

I've started to purposefully avoid plastic as much as I can - which admittedly is very difficult - because yes, it is indeed a problem and no, it's not just the bad Asians. Though that said, having travelled that continent extensively for longer periods of time, you see quite horrifying things, piles of plastic the size of four-story houses, burning next to groundwater, being dumped into the ocean, etc.pp. I surf and also occasionally scuba-dive, and to anyone who thinks plastic is not an issue, I have a few recommendations of certain beaches and oceans to check out and then tell me again that it's "not a problem"

I am by now means an environmentalist and I'm doing massive damage by driving and flying all the time. But that doesn't mean I can't at least try to make a small difference here and there. Because yes, one less Starbucks plastic cup and straw in the ocean is one less Starbucks plastic cup and straw in the ocean. You don't always have to be radical. Even the smallest step gets you closer to your destination.
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  #51  
Old 12.10.2018, 10:06
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

That Starbucks straw is really making the difference.

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  #52  
Old 12.10.2018, 10:18
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

The thing is this Loz: if only a lousy 200 people wasted one less plastic straw a week, it would be 10'000 fewer straws somewhere in an ocean every year. And yes, over time, that indeed changes things. That's how this works. It's the same as donating. If 100 people donate just 2$, an amount of money that in the countries we live in no one would even notice is gone from their account, you can already build a shelter for some refugee somewhere in Bangladesh.

THIS is why small steps matter, steps that for most of us don't even present the slightest inconvenience. But of course some always look down on people thinking that way because presumably, it is irrelevant as it's not drastic enough and "doesn't make any difference".
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  #53  
Old 12.10.2018, 10:53
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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The thing is this Loz: if only a lousy 200 people wasted one less plastic straw a week, it would be 10'000 fewer straws somewhere in an ocean every year. And yes, over time, that indeed changes things. That's how this works. It's the same as donating. If 100 people donate just 2$, an amount of money that in the countries we live in no one would even notice is gone from their account, you can already build a shelter for some refugee somewhere in Bangladesh.

THIS is why small steps matter, steps that for most of us don't even present the slightest inconvenience. But of course some always look down on people thinking that way because presumably, it is irrelevant as it's not drastic enough and "doesn't make any difference".
No it won't. You live in Switzerland, if 200 people wasted one less plastic straw a week, it'd mean that one less plastic straw gets incinerated. We are civilised here, we dispose of our trash in bins where it is collected and taken to incineration where it is turned into electricity and heat. Occasionally we even get a fine for disposing of our straws in the wrong bin.

I personally believe in using less plastic because I don't like waste, but please don't pretend that you're making a difference.

p.s. who uses straws anyway?
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  #54  
Old 12.10.2018, 11:15
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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Because yes, one less Starbucks plastic cup and straw in the ocean is one less Starbucks plastic cup and straw in the ocean.
a) We live in Switzerland. Trash from Starbucks does not end up in the ocean.

b) I never go to Starbucks.

Tom
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  #55  
Old 12.10.2018, 12:00
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I have a few recommendations of certain beaches and oceans to check out and then tell me again that it's "not a problem"
like this one - a small island in the Maldives - where are the trash from the 5* Hôtels ends up, after your honeymoon:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...box=1539302360

Of course, with no landfill in Switzerland, and all incinerated, the situation is very different. It really does not mean that we should not think about our use of plastics, especially single use.

Even in Switzerland, the waste from incineration plants is becoming a real problem, as there is no-where to safely bury them, and it contains many harmful chemicals.
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  #56  
Old 12.10.2018, 12:06
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

I don't use straws.

From what, therefore, must I abstain for penance, Padre?
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  #57  
Old 12.10.2018, 12:09
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I personally believe in using less plastic because I don't like waste, but please don't pretend that you're making a difference.
But indirectly you are making a difference (does that make you a closet eco-warrior? ). It's not rocket science to just use what you absolutely need to use.

Seriously, though, if everyone just dialled down the attitude towards disposable plastic and reused stuff, regardless of whether you're living in Switzerland or Swaziland or anywhere, the production of it would slow and the disposal would fall.

The production of plastics is also pretty heavy going on the environment, too. The argument for rubbish incineration in Switzerland is irrelevant in this case.
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  #58  
Old 12.10.2018, 12:44
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

From madre - stupid, irrelevant comments would be a start
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  #59  
Old 12.10.2018, 12:45
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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1970's - New ice age
1980's - Ozone Layer
Early 1990's - Acid Rain
Late 1990's - Global Warming
2000's - "Climate Change"
2018 - Ocean Plastics

I'm starting to see a pattern here.
Lol its probably been answered but, just to appease yer trolling.

1980s Ozone layer ban of cfcs and other ozone destroying chemicals stopped the hole increasing, its still there and in places like Australia the lack of UV protection due to Ozone depletion causes higher levels of Skin carcinoma then any other country.

Acid rain that issue was recognized a long time before the 90s, but led to the introduction of unleaded petrol as one example.

Global warming, climate change are very real occurences as the result of human activity. We are seeing the effects every day.

Plastics have been building up in oceans and waterways for decades, so far microbeads (plastics) in cosmetics and paints and other products have been phased out. There is an area the size of Texas meters deep in plastics in the Pacific Ocean, its calculated that by 2050 there will be more plastic then fish in the worlds waterways.

Although what pattern do you see? I am truly curious.

Last edited by TobiasM; 12.10.2018 at 15:43.
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Old 12.10.2018, 13:05
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Re: Drowning in Plastic

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I disagree. I simply see way too much plastic stuff around me. That might not be the plastic that ends up in the ocean, but it is likely produced in one of the countries where the byproducts get dumped... I don't think I want to live in a world free of plastic, but I don't get why every sandwich needs to be wrapped three times... had breakfast with the wife at a Pret-a-Manger in the UK lately and was kind of amazed of the pile of packaging left on the tray in the end.

I am certainly not a tree hugger, but I think some aspects of our lifestyle are currently excessive and will be hard to explain to future generations. Yes, we Europeans aren't as bad as some others... most notoriously the Americans. But that does not mean we should not think of how to use resources efficiently.
Agreed. This summer, all the kiddies in my neighbourhood were having water balloon fights but they did not seem to see the need to pick up all the plastic pieces afterward. Smokers often just drop the plastic wrapper of their cigarettes on the ground. There is always at least one empty crisp/snack packet within 50 metres of my home. I run past discarded PET bottles in the middle of the forest when I go jogging. It's freaking everywhere.
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